Dealing with scale problem

[PoolDoc]

Maybe not as fast as I'd like, but as I keep at it and follow your advice on chlorine, oh, etc, the algae is slowly going away.

Then, you're losing.

You are wasting chlorine, wasting time, wasting effort, and wasting money.

Kill it quickly, as Watermom told you several days ago:

If you stop adding chlorine, your algae will take over even more than it already is! You don't want that. You need to be adding chlorine daily up to shock levels! Don't stop and let the algae get even worse!

My biggest concern is the scale.

Maybe, but you can't deal with the scale, till the algae is gone.

I'd rather leave covering the pool as an absolute last resort. To keep my cover on means having the brass bolts raised. Too great a risk of someone stubbing a toe.

You raised the issue of the cost of dealing with the algae. If cost is not that much of an issue, leave the cover off. If it is, cover it.

I wasn't suggesting that you swim with the cover one. I was suggesting that you forgo swimming till you've solved your algae problem.

I'm still curious what a yellow color result when the hardness indicator is used means with the HTH kit.

The HTH 6-way has a different hardness test then the K2006. Here are the instructions: http://pool9.net/hth-6way/

[beaverplt]

Losing? How? Since Watermom told me several days ago to keep adding chlorine, I have kept my chlorine level in the orange color range of the OTO chart that she sent me. I'm checking it twice a day. The lowest it's gotten is dark yellow. That has been over a week now. During that time my PH has stayed at 7.2 and my TA near 110 until tonight when they were 7.5 and 150. Is it possible that the algae is dead, but so intertwined with the scale that removing it requires a lot of brushing? The algae is no longer green, rather kind of an ochre/light brown color.
My HTH kit came with the same instructions you linked, so I have been following the correct procedure. The good news is when I tried it again tonight, it worked and I was able to get a hardness reading of 310. I wonder if the kit has a "floor" it won't give results below.
Another little bit of good news is I saved a good piece of change when a lawn tractor repair I needed to do cost me almost nothing other than my labor and some good luck. I immediately ordered a K2006. I'll have it Thursday. I'll keep testing with the HTH until then, but I'll share my new test results Thursday night.

[PoolDoc]

OK. I hadn't understood that. I thought you were saying there was still green algae.

Brown algae is dead. And yes, when the calcium 'sand' is present, the algae will remain brown inside those nodules till it's bleached out by sun and/or chlorine.

There probably IS some live algae inside some of the bits, but if everything you can see is brown, then you can move own. So do this:

1. Use muriatic acid to lower your pH to just below 7.0. That is, add acid till you reach 7.0, and the add a bit more. Read http://pool9.net/muriatic/

2. Dose with chlorine nightly, to maintain chlorine levels above 5 in the AM.

3. Brush the scale after adding chlorine, if you can. Don't brush hard, just enough to knock loose what's already coming loose.

4. Complete the pool chart: http://pool9.net/pf-chart/ so we can see what sort of pool you have.

5. Increase aeration by adjusting the return eyeballs to 'riffle' the surface.

[beaverplt]

OK. I hadn't understood that. I thought you were saying there was still green algae. My fault, I should have mentioned the color earlier

Brown algae is dead. And yes, when the calcium 'sand' is present, the algae will remain brown inside those nodules till it's bleached out by sun and/or chlorine.

There probably IS some live algae inside some of the bits, but if everything you can see is brown, then you can move own. So do this:

1. Use muriatic acid to lower your pH to just below 7.0. That is, add acid till you reach 7.0, and the add a bit more. Read http://pool9.net/muriatic/
I added a half gallon just now. I'll check PH before bedtime to see if more is needed.

2. Dose with chlorine nightly, to maintain chlorine levels above 5 in the AM. I'm at dark yellow or about 13 ppm on the oto chart right now. I was in the orange range this morning and most of the day was cloudy. It seems I lost more chlorine today than I have over the past 3 days. Is that due to the higher PH?

3. Brush the scale after adding chlorine, if you can. Don't brush hard, just enough to knock loose what's already coming loose. Easy enough, between my wife and I we've been brushing twice daily plus running our cleaner almost all day.

4. Complete the pool chart: http://pool9.net/pf-chart/ so we can see what sort of pool you have. Stupid of me, should have done that when I joined.

5. Increase aeration by adjusting the return eyeballs to 'riffle' the surface. My eyeballs that are in my steps are a good 6-8 inches below the surface. I aimed them as high as I can. I can see minor riffling when I do. My other return riffles the surface nicely when turned slightly up Question; doesn't aeration increase PH? Am I negating some of the effects of adding muriatic acid?

One more thing. I had almost forgotten that we are going out of town this weekend to celebrate our son's birthday. That means two days without attention. I don't want to lose ground. Any suggestions?

Thanks for your help.

[PoolDoc]

Aeration strips carbon dioxide, which raises pH. But aeration LOWERS 'carbonics' => carbon dioxide + carbonic acid + bicarbonate + carbonates.

Essentially, alkalinity is that fraction of the 'carbonics' that is present as bicarbonates or carbonates. You can't easily remove those. BUT if you lower the pH, you shift some of the bicarbonates and carbonates into the form of carbonic acid + carbon dioxide.

In your case, reducing the alkalinity enable your pool water to begin dissolving the scale. But that, in turn, replenishes the alkalinity, and increases the calcium.

Since you're leaving for a few days, I'd re-orient the eyeballs to reduce aeration, let the pH drift up to a stable plateau, raise the chlorine level -- and then restart the process once you return.

Brushing 2x per day probably doesn't hurt anything, but it probably doesn't help that much, either. Once a day, or even once every 2 days is probably enough. It's unlikely the dissolution process is moving fast enough to warrant a 2x per day brushing.

Losing chlorine could be a result of dissolving some of the algae capsules, and exposing oxidizable algae to the chlorine.

I'll look at your chart data, and update your pool sig. info.

[PoolDoc]

Just checked -- there is no chart entry for "beaverplt", nor any entry associated with this thread (24064)

[beaverplt]

I received my new kit today. Here are the numbers I got
FC 7.6
CC .8
TA 150
CH 250
CYA 42

Weekend prep is done. I'll add chlorine tomorrow to raise levels to last through the weekend. I may not make any progress on the scale, but I don't want to give any algae a chance to come back.

[PoolDoc]

Use this chart to enter your test results; go ahead and retest today and complete the chart. I entered the results above.

http://pool9.net/pf-hist-form/

You can see the results here:

http://pool9.net/pf-hist-chart/

Also, if you haven't yet done so, please complete the pool chart data, here:http://pool9.net/pf-chart/


Enter the thread number (24064) as needed:

http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/showthread.php/24064-Dealing-with-scale-problem

I merged your threads -- they are separate problems, and we've been wasting time giving you the same advice in two threads.

[beaverplt]

Thanks for merging the threads I had been hopping back and forth to re-read both.

Back from my weekend away. I had not been home since I read your last post. I tested the water and entered the results on the form you linked. I was pleased to see the pool is very clear. I also cleaned the filter bag on my Dolphin as I usually do before running it and was very pleased to see handfuls of scale from the last cycle. I seem to be making progress. I believe the correct next step is to lower PH to 7.0 again, reorient the eyeballs to riffle the surface again. I'll continue with your program for the next week or so and continue posting results on the chart.

[PoolDoc]

Thanks!