Pre-Filter on a Refill?

[Rottwieler]

Hey guys.
I've been snooping around here off and on over the winter, but now I'm ready to start getting serious as the grandson has already started using the pool.
The pool supply house says my water is full of minerals, etc. and that I need to drain the pool and re-fill.
I have several questions about that process, but my first question is whether it is worth it to pre-filter the fill water?
Our water here is very hard and full of all sorts of things. They actually advise against letting small children drink the stuff due to excessive amounts of fluoride.
I need to look up the stats on the pool, but I think it's about 20k gallons - modified kidney shape with a large wading step and depths from about 4' to 7'.
Is it OK to just pump out all of the water, scrub out the pool a bit, and start filling it back up?
We're in the Phoenix area so we're talking very dry soil. Pool is about 5 years old.
I'll snoop around looking for answers on my own, but the search function doesn't seem to work so point me in the right direction please.
I also need to find your recommended test kit... I think that's in the Tips.
Appreciate any guidance.
Sam

[aylad]

Hi Rotweiler, and welcome to the forum!

Has the pool supply house told you what minerals are in the water? Are they something you've added, or are they in the fill water? What kind of pool finish do you have--vinyl liner, plaster, gunite, etc?

The recommended test kit is the K-2006, and can be gotten for a very good price through the Amazon link in my sig. Try using the Google search feature linked in my sig, as well--it works much better than the v.bulletin search feature on this forum.

[PoolDoc]

The pool supply house says my water is full of minerals, etc. and that I need to drain the pool and re-fill.
I have several questions about that process, but my first question is whether it is worth it to pre-filter the fill water?

Call your water company, or check their website, and get their latest analysis. Then either post the link to the analysis, or send me a photo of it (poolforum@gmail.com) or transcribe the mineral section.

Is it OK to just pump out all of the water, scrub out the pool a bit, and start filling it back up?
We're in the Phoenix area so we're talking very dry soil.

In Phoenix, I don't think you're going to have any of the high water table problems we warn people of - the only concern would be water use restrictions. But if it's OK with the water company, it should be find to do just what you say.

One warning -- it's not good for plaster to get really hot and dry. So plan to clean quickly, and refill ASAP.

Without seeing the analysis, it's impossible to tell if it's worthwhile . . . or even practical to pre-filter it. Most minerals can be removed with the right zeolites, but setting up a system to do that would be quite expensive. Some metals can be removed more easily, but again, without seeing what you've got, it's impossible to say.

[Rottwieler]

OK. Thanks for the replies. I have been traveling for business and this got bumped back, but now I'm moving it back up to the top of my list.

I believe the pool is plaster. There is quite a bit of dirt/discoloration around the steps that scrubbing hasn't helped. I guess we'll need to do some painting.

Is there anything we need to be particularly careful of when cleaning the drained pool?

I have requested a copy of the latest water analysis from the water company and have ordered the test kit. I figured I'd take a pool sample down to Leslie's and see what their analysis says and post it along with the water company report.

When I get the test kit, would it be worthwhile to do testing on the pool water, the outside faucet water, and the softened and filtered house water, or am I going overboard?

I'm totally new to all of this and you guys tend to speak in code that I don't understand, so thank you for your help and patience.

Sam

[aylad]

It wouldn't hurt to test all three--except you don't need to waste the CYA reagent on any of the faucet or house water, because there won't be any in there. It's nice to know what the numbers are on your fill water.

We're here to help folks who are new at this--so don't be shy if someone posts something that you don't understand--ask, ask, ask!

Janet

[Rottwieler]

Here is what I could find from my water company:
(http://www.gwresources.com/resources...ulfer_2010.pdf)

Substance......... MCLG or....MCL, TT or.....Lowest.....Highest.....Compliance
........................MRDLG......MRDL........... ..Level........Level........Achieved
Chlorine
[as Cl2] (ppm).... 4 ............ 4 ................. 0.2 ......... 2.6 ............ Yes
Haloacetic Acids
[HAA5] (ppb) .... NA .......... 60 ................ NA .......... 2.2 ............ Yes
Total Trihalomethanes
[TTHM’s] (ppb) . NA .......... 80 ................ NA .......... 14 ............. Yes

Inorganic Chemicals
Arsenic (ppb)
2008 Data ......... 0 ............ 10 ................ NA .......... 5.0 ............ Yes
Barium (ppm)
2007 Data ......... 2 ............ 2 .................. NA ......... 0.18 ............ Yes
Chromium (ppb)
2007 Data ....... 100 ......... 100 ................ NA .......... 28 .............. Yes
Fluoride (ppm)
2007 Data ......... 4 ............ 4 .................. NA .......... 1.2 ............. Yes
Nitrate (ppm)
[Nitrogen] ........ 10 .......... 10 .................. 5.8 ......... 6.8 ............. Yes
Selenium (ppb)
2007 Data ....... 50 ........... 50 .................. NA .......... 3.5 ............. Yes

Microbial Organisms
Total Coliform .. 0 ............. 1 ................... NA ........... 0 ............... Yes

Radionuclides
Alpha Emitters (pCi/L)
[2002 Data] ..... 0 ............ 15 ................... NA .......... 2.9 .............. Yes

Lead and Copper
Copper– less than 0.022 ppm
Lead — less than 3.8 ppb

Test kit should be here tomorrow.

[PoolDoc]

Not showing anything there that needs to be pre-filtered.

Of course, if the distance from the plant is great, and the distribution is old and iron . . . that's a different matter.

You can do the white bucket test:

1. 5 gallon CLEAN white plastic bucket
2. 4 gallons of tap water
3. 1/8 cup of bleach
4. 1/8 cup of baking soda
5. Mix, cover, wait 24 - 48 hours
6. If there's colored sediment on the bottom of the bucket, you might want to pre-filter

.

Use Clorox bleach for this test; some cheaper bleaches might have small amounts of iron.

[Rottwieler]

Thanks Doc.
Been developing a new problem over the past week. Actually noticed it a couple of weeks ago after a bad dust storm that coated the bottom of the pool with dirt. The vacuum seemed to not be getting everything and I thought it was just the handy son not brushing very well, but then I brushed good and the dirty looking sediment doesn't come off. I haven't been adding ANY chemicals to the pool on anticipation of doing the drain and refill, but now I'm not sure when I will be able to do it. Might be several weeks. Anyway, over the past few days what was just dirty looking bottom corners has grown to cover most of the floor and lower walls... Any ideas?
Also, we have cartridge filters - 4 or 5 in the big compression tank - each one is about 3' or 3.5' long and about 6" around. We run the pump about 8 hours a day. Should we run the pump more, and how often should we clean the filters? Thanks. Sam

[Anonymous [GDPR] European in Spain]

I'll let the experts tell you more, but get some bleach/chlorine in there quick.

[PoolDoc]

It could be iron.

Go to Walmart, and get a bottle of Vitamin C tablets - small one is fine; larger TABLETS are better -- and a container of Iron Out (detergent section). Get some snack or sandwich baggies, if you don't have any.

1. Place a couple of tablets on a stained spot.

2. Put a couple of tablespoons of Iron out in a snack baggie, along with a couple of tablespoons of water. Force all the air out, and seal the baggie. (Do NOT suck on the baggie, to get the air out!!)

3. Get into the pool, with the baggie and an old cotton rag or towel. Carefully place the baggie on a stained spot, and then open it so the Iron Out is released. Cover with the towel to protect it from currents.

4. Check back in an hour, and see if the stains are affected.

5. While you're waiting, check the interior of your toilet tanks -- see if they are stained, and if so, what color.

Are you running the bucket test? Do you have a K-2006 on order?