Post some good testing numbers when you get your kit and then someone can make a recommendation based on that.
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Post some good testing numbers when you get your kit and then someone can make a recommendation based on that.
Oh, No! I HATE what I'm going to have to write! Virtually everything the pool store guys told you and sold you is WRONG and won't help. Sorry in advance!Quote:
Originally Posted by Traxl
Had you merely poured in several gallons of Liquid Chlorine (12.5%) you would have probably had a far greater effect. What you need to do is KILL the algae, and chlorine is generally the best thing for that. Regular bleach works just as well but you need 50% more of the 8.25% to get the same effect.
I was beginning to think the pool store guy was leading me down a path that would be expensive and not necessary (should have trusted my gut), thank you for the confirmation. :)
PoolDoc originally recommended 1.5 gallons of chlorine per night to clear up the algae. What I was able to source is the 8.25% bleach, so does this figure still stand, or should I go with 2 gallons?
My intention is to add Borax to the pool per this thread. Understand that I need to get the algae gone, and chlorine and stabilizer in check beforehand, but thought this would be a good time to go through the process, before the family has started using the pool.
Thank you again for the advice!
Do NOT use the bleach!. Using bleach now may cause a variety of problems including stains.
It's unfortunate, but you did not mention either Sink and Sweep or Algae Eliminator Max in your list above. The listed chemicals weren't ideal, but would not have been a big problem If you'd listed Sink and Sweep or Algae Eliminator Max, I would have posted a quick response to encourage you avoid using those. Too late now! What you need to know, going forward, is that the Aqua Chem | Pool Time products are among the worst on the market. Many items in those lines are products you should NEVER use, either because they are highly diluted or because they will actually do things you don't want. A further problem is that, because the AquaChem | PoolTime products go as far as is legal to avoid identifying ingredients, you don't know what's in them this year OR whether the 2014 "Sink and Sweep" is the same as the 2012 "Sink and Sweep". As a result, having used this product successfully in years past does not guarantee you'll be successful with it this year, since it may not even be the same chemicals as it was before!
"Aqua Chem" | "Pool Time" Sink and Sweep is a mystery goo product made by ChemTura, also known for the BioGuard
'premium' line of dealer-only chemicals. Sink and Sweep has no identified ingredients appearing on either the label. The MSDS does reveal that it's "cationic", that is that the big part of the ion, when dissolved, is positive. This is significant, which I'll get to below. It is marketed as an 24 hour floc; reviews on Amazon (link) suggest that it may actually work . . . if you use it correctly.
"Aqua Chem" | "Pool Time" Algae Eliminator Max is currently a 3% copper algaecide; but it may have been something else (Amazon review)
We do NOT recommend either of these chemicals. But, since you've used them, you have no options. If you turn on the filter, or stir up the water too much while filling, you can actually make things much WORSE. So do this instead:
1. Stop filling for now. Add NO other chemicals. Tonight, post information what kind (make/model/sand, cartridge, or DE) filter you have.
2. Get several quarts of polyquat -- see this page for info http://poolsolutions.com/gd/polyquat.html Polyquat is a cationic algaecide that shouldn't react with the Sink and Sweep. You may be able to find it locally; if not order from Amazon. Links to Amazon on that page.
3. Tomorrow -Monday- evening, continue filling, but -- to avoid stirring up the water -- put the hose in the largest bucket you have, and place the bucket on the bottom of the pool.
4. Hopefully, by Tuesday PM, the algae will be dead and settled on the bottom. If not, go ahead and add a quart of polyquat.
5. Once the pool is fully, start the pump and filter. Immediately hook up your vacuum and begin slo-w-wly vacuuming the debris on the bottom. Have some one watch the pool return: if the vacuumed debris begins shooting back into the pool, STOP IMMEDIATELY.
6. If the settled debris passes through the filter, turn the pump off, and use your vacuum hose to set up a 'siphon' vacuum and vacuum the debris out onto the ground.
Good luck!
7. Remove as much from the bottom as possible. The problem with flocculents, like sink and sweep, is that with overdoses or if the formed particles go through the filter and are broken up, the floc can begin act in reverse, to make it HARDER to remove the dead algae.
Re-reading some of this, it's not clear to me: was the Algae Max and the Sink and Sweep added BEFORE, or AFTER you drained?
Just a note from me:
Ben's advice supersedes mine: Follow HIS advice, please--he's more on top of the subtleties of chemicals I do not buy and do not use!
Thank you for the replies :)
Here is a timeline...
14 Apr - AlgaeMax & 2 pounds of Shock PLUS
16 Apr - Sink & Sweep
18 Apr - Phosphorous Reducer & 5 pounds of Shock PLUS
26 Apr - Drained pool from 44" to 18" (Depth verified with tape measure)
The pool was running continuously from the 14th to the 16th, and again from the 18th to the 26th. While running, I always kept at least one 3" Trichloro-s-Triazinetrione in the skimmer.
The pool has one skimmer, one return jet, a 16" sand filter, and a 1 hp single speed pump.
The owner said he replaced the sand last summer, and had algae then as well.
Right now I have a 30 foot round, 18 inch deep green pond. I have skimmed the surface numerous times, and every time I go through the pool, more algae floats to the surface. I'm a little hesitant to add anything to the pool (including water) at this point.
The quantities added were: 32 oz of Algae Eliminator MAX, 16 oz of Sink & Sweep, and 32 oz of Phosphate remover.
Thanks again!!!
Ok, that's a relief. Let's redirect then.
1. Do not add water.
2. Buy 12 gallons of PLAIN 8% store brand bleach (Walmart?), 2 boxes of 20 Mule Team borax (Walmart?), and 1 gallon of plain 31% muriatic acid (Lowes, other hardware store) with NO sudsing or foaming additives. Also buy a cheapo OTO / phenol red testkit (yellow/red drops)(Walmart) and a trichlor floater (Walmart). Also, you'll need a small bag of DE powder to test / help your filter. You may not be able to get it locally, but you can get it from Amazon.
3. Test the pH levels.
4. If needed, use muriatic acid to lower the pH to ~7.0 - 7.2, to keep any remaining copper from staining. Mix the acid in a 3 - 5 gallon bucket: add 1 gallon of water, then 1/4 gallon of acid, and then 1 - 2 MORE gallons of water. Watch out for fumes; wear gloves and glasses. Once the acid is diluted, it will stop fuming. Add the acid around the pool, then rinse off any splatters with a hose. Then, take a brush on a pole, and stir the water to mix.
5. Once the pH is below 7.4, begin adding bleach, in 4 gallon doses in the EVENING. Use your acid bucket to dilute 1 gallon of bleach with 1-3 gallons of water, and pour around the pool. Once all 4 gallons have been added, mix with a brush on a pole. Wear old clothes (bleach EATS clothes and glasses).
6. Repeat evening doses, till the algae is dead. Once it is, fill the floater with trichlor and put it in the pool. Begin siphon vacuuming the pool to remove the settled algae. Add more water as needed to maintain levels.
7. One day after the last bleach dose, test chlorine and pH. Report results here.
8. Once you've siphoned as much settled algae as possible, begin refilling. Once the pool is full, turn the filter to the RECIRCULATE position and turn the pump on.
Your 16" filter is MUCH too small for that pool. Odds are the pump is too big, and capable of forcing the algae through the filter. Once this happens, it becomes much harder to remove the algae. My guess is, the algae particles get broken up into very small pieces that are hard to filter -- but I have no proof of that.
Once the pool is operating, TEST the filter, by (a) turning the pump off and switching to the FILTER position; (b) turning the pump on; (c) adding 2 - 4 cups of DE powder to the skimmer, (d) watching the pool return to see if the powder blows back into the pool. If it does, promptly return the filter to the recirculate position. If it does NOT, you are good to go. The DE powder will help capture the algae, but will make filter runs very short.
The tiny filter is the reason why you need to remove as much algae as possible, before filling the pool. Every year, we have several new PoolForum members who try to clean up algae, but force it through undersized filters, using their oversized pumps, and as a result, end up with cloudy pools for as much as 3 weeks!
9. Probably, before you get to step #8, you'll have your K2006. Report complete results once you have them. You may want to watch the testkit video series here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...99CY_BQXE1Jx6s
PoolDoc,
Thank you so much!!!!! I will gather everything soonest, and start clearing up the algae tomorrow evening. :)
Thank you again for all of your help!!!!!
The process has begun....
When I started, the pH was higher than the test kit could show. Took two doses of acid, approximately 1/2 gal, and it dropped to ~6.8 - 7.2. The color seems to be in between the 6.8 and the 7.2 on the test kit. This may be a little lower than what PoolDoc recommended. I then added the 4 gallons of Wal-Mart bleach, and mixed for around 5-10 minutes.
I took a couple of pictures before I started today, and will take pictures as I progress through this ordeal.
Thanks again to PoolDoc and everyone else that replied. Hopefully this gets rid of the algae once and for all. :)