Famous Chlorine

[CarlD]

Bleach and liquid chlorine are the same thing in different concentrations.

The Rule of Thumb:
1 Gallon of bleach/LC will add EXACTLY its concentration to 10,000 gallons of water.

So if you add 1 gallon of 6% bleach to 10,000 gallons of water, it will add 6ppm to your FC.

If you double the water, you get half the effect.

Double the concentration (to 12%) and you get twice the effect. (12% adds 12ppm to 10,000 gallons).

Figure accordingly to get to your target FC level.

[Watermom]

It's scary to imagine how low your pH must have been!!! That is why I said don't wait for aeration to bring pH up. Get Borax in there ASAP. And, to reiterate what I said above for anybody else who may be reading this thread ----- most test kits will not register any pH reading lower than 6.8. So, if your test shows 6.8, it might actually be much lower than that and really low pH is a CRITICAL ISSUE!

Hope the next addition of Borax takes you over the magic number of 7.0. Please keep us posted how you are progressing.

[gfritz1]

Went to pool place this morning to have them read a water sample:
TDS 1100 CYA 110 Tot Chlorine 0 Free Chlorine 0 PH 6.5 Total Alk 166 Tot Hardness 209
My readings were:
CYA 60 Total Chlorine .5 PH 6.5 Alk 210 Hardness 180
I added (2) of the Borax boxes and yes another 4 (1.42 gal) of the bleach 6%

Just checked after running pump for 4 hours
PH is above 6.8 but not a 7.2 as that is the range on my HTH kit.So 6.9-7.0 Gained but will need to add some in morning after another run to walmart
Total Chlorine at best 1.0--------------- Why am I not seeing the increase in Total Chlorine?
My kit only reads Total Chlorine-any advise?

Water could not be any clearer . So now what ?

Thanks

[Watermom]

You need a good test kit. We recommend the Taylor K-2006. This place seems to have a good price for it. http://www.amatoind.com/taylor-k2006-test-p-555.html

But, in the meantime, while you are at Walmart, see if they have a 5 or 6-way kit for about $15? Test and post.

By the way, cya of 100 is really high and is going to cause you to have to run higher than normal cl levels. The only way to lower it is to do a partial drain. If you drain half, that would put it at about 55 which would be much more manageable.

[gfritz1]

My readings were with a hth 6 test kit.are you saying to now drain as the only option

[Watermom]

I just now kind of reskimmed this thread and see that you said earlier that you had the 6-way kit. Sorry about that. We read and respond to SO many threads that sometimes we forget some of the particulars about a specific poster's problem. Plus, you only gave a TC reading. I thought the 6-way kit also allowed you to either find FC or CC. Can't remember. It has been a long time since I used a 6-way kit.

I'm not saying you have to drain. You can run a pool with a high cya level. You just have to run your cl higher than normal. Take a look at this chart:

Stabilizer . . . . . . Min. FC . . . . Max FC . . . 'Shock' FC
=> 0 ppm . . . . . . . 1 ppm . . . . . 3 ppm . . . . 10 ppm
=> 10 - 20 ppm . . . . 2 ppm . . . . . 5 ppm . . . . 12 ppm
=> 30 - 50 ppm . . . . 3 ppm . . . . . 6 ppm . . . . 15 ppm
=> 60 - 90 ppm . . . . 5 ppm . . . . . 10 ppm . . .. 20 ppm
=> 100 - 200 ppm . . . 8 ppm . . . . . 15 ppm . . .. 25 ppm

Since your cya is 110, then that means that shock level for your pool is 25ppm of chlorine and normal maintenance levels of chlorine must stay between 8-15. It can still be done, though if you don't want to drain. But, it is going to continue to cause you to use a lot of chlorine.

Have you used lots of triclor tablets in the past? They have cya in them and that is how a lot of people unknowingly get such high cya levels.

So -- two options. Either do a partial drain and refill or leave it as it is but use a LOT of bleach and shock that pool up to 25. I'm sorry you are having such a hard time, but ultimately, you will get it taken care of and be able to enjoy your pool.

(BTW -- In a pool your size, each gallon of 6% bleach should raise your cl level by just under 3 ppm.)

EDIT --- Just noticed that you tested and got a cya reading of 60 vs. pool store reading of 110. Don't know why I didn't see that before. Retest and see what you get and/or maybe let a different pool store test it and see what they get. Do this before you decide to drain. If it is indeed 60, that would be a much more manageable level. Note that the shock level would change for that cya level. Check the chart.

[gfritz1]

Ok added 3 additional boxes of Borax to raise the PH .They love me at Walmart

Finally today have success on PH as am at 7.2 --------------YES

Went back to same pool store today to test and they provided the readings on left with mine on right using the Walmart kit
CYA 70 (why did they get 110 yesterday?) I am out of chemical for this but I have been 50-60 . Assume this will impact what you tell me to do ?

Total Chlorine 0 Me 1 My kit only does Total .Will order Taylor in morning
Free Chlorine 0
PH 7.1 7.2 Me
Total Alkalinity 191 210 me
Total Hardness 229 210 me

They also said phosphates at 2500 and wanted to sell me phos out

My water is sparkling and 82F -never this way on Memorial Day in Pa

I added no bleach today - so GROUP what now as still cannot get a chlorine reading?
Another nice day on tap Memorial Day .
I tried to get a second pool store reading which is 11 miles away but closed .Nobody open now until Tuesday

Looking for advise

[Watermom]

Read the following thread. I'm wondering if you are having the same type problem as that guy. Sometimes pools have huge chlorine demands upon opening. That is what this guy's problem has turned out to be. I'm wondering if your pool is having the same thing going on.

http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/showthread.php?t=9547

We'll get this figured out one way or another.

Now that your ph is above 7.0, I want you to start aerating to make the pH rise. (Aim the return jet upward to create as much bubbling and splashing as you can get.) The reason I want you to do this is because your alk is high. Not critical but when your ph gets up to about 7.6-7.8, we're gonna work on your alk. But, that is not a priority for now.

Keep adding bleach. What is the most bleach you have added at one time so far?

Glad you didn't buy the phos out.

[gfritz1]

Most Bleach was 5.6 gals of the 6 % which should have raised the ppm by 17ppm -what do you suggest ?

I now understand the aeration and will add the nozzle and point upwards .Presently no eye ball nozzle on the return

[Watermom]

OK. Unfortunately, this pool situation is not responding like normal pools do to the advice you have been given so far. I suspected that this high chlorine demand is due to stabilizer biodegradation to ammonia and/or urea like we are helping another member deal with in a different thread. (That is why I asked you to read the thread link I posted above.)

I consulted with Ben as to what advice to offer next. A few questions we need to know to help us solve this mystery:

1. Have you used any type of chlorine remover such as peroxide or thiosulfate in this pool?

2. You don't have massive amounts of floating algae, do you?

3. Have you ever used any products such as Yellow Out or Yellow Treat, etc. in this pool?

Can you timeline the pool from opening for us. What water was like when, and what the readings were. What you added when, etc. A timeline so we can see the progression more easily without having to keep scrolling back and forth through the entire thread. In addition, having it be more concise will make it easier to pinpoint the problem.

Also, can you tell us what your cya level was upon closing last fall and what it was upon opening this spring before you did anything to the water? Answer these questions and hopefully we can get this solved.