Is TA 140 too high?

[Water_man]

Opened pool last Friday and treated successfully the "swamp".

Taylor kit numbers for pool condition yesterday morning:

CYA 60
TA 140
pH 7.9
CH 170
FC 7.5
CC < 0.5

After adjusting for pH with dry acid and adding calcium chloride for hardness, the numbers today are:

pH 7.5
TA 140
CH 220
FC 5
CC < 0.5

Should I try to lower my TA by adding acid?

[waterbear]

IF you are using trichlor for chlorinating then the TA of 140 is fine. If you are using an unstabilized chlorine then you will find that your ph is constantly rising fast and you will have better pH stability if you lower the pH to around 80.

[Water_man]

IF you are using trichlor for chlorinating then the TA of 140 is fine. If you are using an unstabilized chlorine then you will find that your ph is constantly rising fast and you will have better pH stability if you lower the pH to around 80.

I used to use trichlor until I was educated by this forum.
With my 60 ppm CYA I now use nothing but pure active chlorine
(bleach or ca - hypo.) Do I still need to lower the TA to 80?
I assume you had a typo when you wrote to lower the pH. and you meant TA.
If this is the case, do I lower TA by simply lowering the pH to, say 7.2 and then raising it again?

[CarlD]

MAY is the key word. If you use bleach you should not have a problem. I have had several seasons with T/A in that range and didn't have a pH rise.

But if you use cal-hypo you'll probably see pH go up--I RARELY use cal-hypo, preferring to use Di-chlor if I'm going to use dry chlorine.

What I suggest is you run your pool using bleach/LC and see if you are fighting rising pH. If so, lower T/A. If not, swim and have fun!

BTW, I'm assuming you have a vinyl pool. But if it's concrete/tile/plaster, you should keep T/A below 120-125, so lower the T/A.

[Watermom]

Carl - you may have missed it. In his signature line, he says he has gunite.

[Water_man]

MAY is the key word. If you use bleach you should not have a problem. I have had several seasons with T/A in that range and didn't have a pH rise.

But if you use cal-hypo you'll probably see pH go up--I RARELY use cal-hypo, preferring to use Di-chlor if I'm going to use dry chlorine.

What I suggest is you run your pool using bleach/LC and see if you are fighting rising pH. If so, lower T/A. If not, swim and have fun!

BTW, I'm assuming you have a vinyl pool. But if it's concrete/tile/plaster, you should keep T/A below 120-125, so lower the T/A.

Since it's gunite, what should be the desired TA level and how do I lower it in the quickest way?
BTW, my poolskimmer creates air bubbles. Would this aeration affect the pH?

[waterbear]

Thanks for catching the typo. As far as lowering TA there is a sticky here on the forum that explains how.
One thing I have to caution you. This is a pool, not a science experiment You are starting to overthink things and looking for problems before they materialize.(I have been following your threads, as you know). Now I can debate the theoretical chemistry with the best of them (as the long timers on this forum well know) but I choose not to unless their is a REAL reason to.
My suggestion is to start ENJOYING your pool and stop worrying so much about water balance. That's wny we got 'em in the first place, right? You hvae been given advice. Don't overthink it.
BTW, the amount of bubbles produced by your pooskimmer should not have any major impact on pH rise since the amount of aeration produced is going to be small. This is what I mean by overthinking.

[CarlD]

Carl - you may have missed it. In his signature line, he says he has gunite.

Yeah, I did miss it--I was writing in the midst of 3 insane days at work.

For a gunite pool, the T/A should be in the 80-120 ppm range (sometimes the top is 125-statistically insignificant).

[waterbear]

For a gunite pool, the T/A should be in the 80-120 ppm range (sometimes the top is 125-statistically insignificant).

Actually, the NSPI (now APSP) standard recommends 80-100 ppm TA for liquid chlorine, cal hypo, and lithium hypo and 100-120 ppm TA for chlorine gas. trichlor, dichlor, and bromine. The pool surface is immaterial. This is actually sound and based on the chemistry involved. Chlorine gas, trichlor, dichlor, and bromine are all acidic and become even more acidic when they sanitize. A higher TA with it's tendency to create a pH rise helps offset this.
The unstabilized chlorines are all alkaline and have an acidic effect when they santize and are converted to chloride ions so their net effect on pH is neutral to slighly alkaline. Therefore they benefit from a much lower TA so there is less outgassing of carbon dioxide (since the water is not 'carbonated' as highly) and therefore a more stable pH.

[Water_man]

Thanks for catching the typo. As far as lowering TA there is a sticky here on the forum that explains how.
One thing I have to caution you. This is a pool, not a science experiment You are starting to overthink things and looking for problems before they materialize.(I have been following your threads, as you know). Now I can debate the theoretical chemistry with the best of them (as the long timers on this forum well know) but I choose not to unless their is a REAL reason to.
My suggestion is to start ENJOYING your pool and stop worrying so much about water balance. That's wny we got 'em in the first place, right? You hvae been given advice. Don't overthink it.
BTW, the amount of bubbles produced by your pooskimmer should not have any major impact on pH rise since the amount of aeration produced is going to be small. This is what I mean by overthinking.

Thanks for all the advices. I certainly plan to enjoy my pool, as I've used to, once the weather gets better here and the pool is ready.
However, I’ve learned from my experience so far that if I don't follow the RIGHT balance and sanitation, there's more work and more trouble. Most likely this is why I got the pink algae last year, which was a pain to get rid of. Also, in the past my pH was never stable. Now I want a smoother operation. As for the aeration - I think I saw in this forum more than once that this changes the pH.
My pH already drifted in one day from 7.5 to 7.6, so what was said here about the need to lower TA was probably right.
All in all my plan is to start with a good balance first and than to enjoy the water with as little work as possible.