A bit confused

[Cal_Newbie]

Tested the water on a new AG pool, no additives had been given yet.

Can someone give me an idea as to what would be an acceptable starting point for BBB on a 12x24x54 AG pool? We would like to get this going right from the start.

[CarlD]

AG means vinyl.

1) GET A GOOD TEST KIT! We recommend either Ben's PS234 (currently unavailable) or the Taylor K-2006 or K-2006C, or the Leslie's FAS-DPD Chlorine Service Test Kit. They are all basically the same--the Leslie's may be the easiest to order and is simply a re-badged Taylor. From a donut inflatable to the fanciest infinite edge this kit will be the BEST investment you make in pool care.

2) pH--aim for 7.3-7.8 with 7.5 or 7.6 as your target. Raise pH with 20 Mule Team Borax or Washing Soda (not Baking Soda). Lower pH by adding Muriatic Acid--dilute it into a 5 gal bucket first and wear goggles and gloves--and don't breathe the fumes.

3) Now shock your water by raising Free Chlorine to 10ppm--this is just a good generic startup.
1 gallon of regular 5.25 % laundry bleach adds 5.25 ppm of free chlorine to 10,000 gallons of water.

3/4 gallon of regular Ultra Bleach at 6% adds 4.5 ppm of free chlorine to 10,000 gallons of water and 1 gallon of it adds 6ppm to 10,000 gallons.

Those are the rules of thumb for estimating how much chlorine you should use.

4) Now you need to adjust your Total Alkalinity (T/A). You can either add Baking Soda or Washing Soda to raise T/A. But you ONLY use Washing Soda if you are raising pH as well. Otherwise stick to baking soda. I never add more than a pound at a time. There's some discussion about the ideal range, which is 80 to 125ppm, and whether you should be low (Chem_Geek likes 80 to 90) or higher (Me...I like the 100 to 125). Further, in a vinyl pool you can go as high as 180ppm without worries. However, if you have a heater (other than solar) you should follow the manufacturer's requirements for both T/A and Calcium Hardness--they do interact. If T/A is too high, find the stickied thread on how to lower it--PoolDoc is the author of that one.

5) Stabilizer or CYA or Cyanuric Acid. This prevents your chlorine from being consumed too fast by the sun or other contaminants. It's a double edged sword so too much is a big problem. I like 30ppm in the spring and then moving to 40-50ppm as the intense heat of summer shows up. You buy it at a pool store and it takes 48 hours to a week to dissolve. I like to recommend that you use 1/4 to 1/3 of the amount you estimate you need to reach your target--adding more is easy, getting it out is tough

6) Now keep your Free Chlorine at the levels suggested in the Best Guess table for various levels of stabilizer.

Alternative ways to get your water to correct levels.

1) Tri-Chlor Tablets. These are VERY acidic and will lower too-high pH nicely. They add chlorine and stabilizer and will increase your CYA levels quickly. When you hit your target, stop using them. You can raise pH in the meantime with Borax. Pucks are REALLY good for new concrete pools because as the concrete/plaster cures it makes the water very basic and the tabs lower that while adding CYA.

2) Di-Chlor Powder. This is similar to Tri-chlor but it doesn't tend to lower pH nearly as much. I actully prefer to use Di-Chlor when I want to raise my CYA levels as I get to add the chlorine with it.

Notice I didn't talk about calcium hardness, TDS (total dissolved solids) or phosphates. None of these matter to you DESPITE what the clerks in the pool stores say. With a vinyl pool, you only need to test calcium once or twice a summer, just to make sure it isn't too high.

TDS is BS as is phosphates. You ONLY worry about these when ALL other options are exhausted. 99.99% of the time people who worry about TDS and Phosphates are wasting their time (the 10,000th guy is the only one who actually has a problem with them).

[Cal_Newbie]

Carl, Thank You....I have a good kit, not the one sold here (sold out, grrrrrrrr) but, one that was recommended as being quite alike, the Taylor. I had to add 8 drops to get the PH into range, so it appears I shall be hunting down the Tri-Chlor tabs this a.m. Muriatic Acid I shall get also, is there a rule of of thumb with regard to how much acid to use? I ask because I do not want to add too much at one time...

Thank You.

[CanuckPool]

Hey CarlD, did you mention what the best Alk range is? and where to look if the alk is too high?

[Watermom]

In a pool your size (approximately 9,000 gallons) adding about a cup of muriatic acid should lower your ph by about 0.2. It is better to add small increments of things instead of trying to do it all in one large dose to make sure you don't overshoot your target. So, I would only add one cup of acid at a time and as my pal, Carl, said above -- take precautions with the stuff.

For alk, a range of 80-125 is a good target. You can raise alk by using baking soda as explained above. If your alk is too high, check the sticky at the top of the alk forum for the method recommended to lower it.

[CarlD]

Hey CarlD, did you mention what the best Alk range is? and where to look if the alk is too high?

Of COURSE I did! Just go re-read it. (not like I edited it or anything... )

[CanuckPool]

oh yea, my eyes are a failing!

[Cal_Newbie]

PH= 7.6
FC= 6
CC= 1
TA= 290
Calcium was way low, below 100
CYA:40

[CarlD]

PH= 7.6
FC= 6
CC= 1
TA= 290
Calcium was way low, below 100
CYA:40

In order of importance:

1) OK, you have CC, that means you need to shock your pool, all the way up to 15, then see if the CC vanishes. This is the most important task.

2) Next, your T/A is WAY too high--you need it between 80 and 180ppm and absolutely NO higher than 200. So you'll need to lower your pH to between 7.0 and 7.0 and aerate your water (see the stickied thread on lowering T/A.

3) You have a vinyl pool. Calcium is virtually irrelevant unless it goes over 500. You should NOT worry about nor attempt to increase your calcium level, and I don't care WHAT some guy in a pool store says about you needing it. If you don't have a heater, you don't need calcium. Period. Yet he will swear on his saintly mother's head you need calcium. He's STILL wrong.

[Cal_Newbie]

my mistake, calcium is 240

I will hit the CC in the a.m. to 15 ppm, how long shall I wait until I check its CC?

Yes, the T/A is too high, I have the pool return eye pointing upwards so that I have a very strong splash across the pool, very strong surface movement.
Shall the CC be done totally before the T/A or can this be done in relative time to one another?

Lastly, I do not trust the store..I trust only this forum.

Thank You Carl...

Bob-