leveling

[hrsdennis]

Well said Sevver, the water level is accurate but there are easier ways. You can rent a transit or laser lever for a small daily fee and they are so much easier to use. I set my laser up and within an hour or two it is packed up and put away. I level the ground and each individual post, and I can do it alone when needed. I love my laser.

Best of luck with the install, Dennis

[badutahboy]

Well said Sevver, the water level is accurate but there are easier ways. You can rent a transit or laser lever for a small daily fee and they are so much easier to use. I set my laser up and within an hour or two it is packed up and put away. I level the ground and each individual post, and I can do it alone when needed. I love my laser.

Best of luck with the install, Dennis

Presumably, a laser level works only with the receiver, right? So you set up your level in the "control" spot (the poing you're grading to), and then move your receiver from one spot to another, getting it level, then moving on...correct?


Any chance there's a laser level that you set up at ground level, and it'll show you the high and low spots without having to move a receiver around constantly?

I'd love to know there's a solution that makes this process as easy as hanging pictures with the laser levels that'll project a line across the entire wall...

[CarlD]

A laser level MUST be level at its source. If it's even a fraction of a degree off, that will multiply into a noticeable discrepancy. So lots of time is spent setting it up. The, the laser beam breaks up over distance--it shouldn't but I found mind did. The dot would be tiny at 2', but 1/4" across at 30' (roughly).

Another thing about lasers: the pictures always show a line...that's false. The laser is INVISIBLE in the air until it touches something You don't see a line, you see a dot.

OTOH, a water level doesn't have that problem. You can have a 50' tube to lay out a 40' pool, and it will be perfectly level at both ends--it's simply the nature of the beast. It may be difficult and require two people working slowly and carefully, but you won't get an increasing deviation as you move further away...(unless, like Chem_Geek, you start analyzing the physics of Gravity in terms of Einstein's Theory of Relativity! ).

A water level is also cheap...just clear plastic tubing.

You have to get a fairly expensive laser level to be as accurate. Saying that, once the laser is set up properly, it's much easier...But keep checking it!

[sevver]

A laser level MUST be level at its source. If it's even a fraction of a degree off, that will multiply into a noticeable discrepancy. So lots of time is spent setting it up. The, the laser beam breaks up over distance--it shouldn't but I found mind did. The dot would be tiny at 2', but 1/4" across at 30' (roughly).

Another thing about lasers: the pictures always show a line...that's false. The laser is INVISIBLE in the air until it touches something You don't see a line, you see a dot.

OTOH, a water level doesn't have that problem. You can have a 50' tube to lay out a 40' pool, and it will be perfectly level at both ends--it's simply the nature of the beast. It may be difficult and require two people working slowly and carefully, but you won't get an increasing deviation as you move further away...(unless, like Chem_Geek, you start analyzing the physics of Gravity in terms of Einstein's Theory of Relativity! ).

A water level is also cheap...just clear plastic tubing.

You have to get a fairly expensive laser level to be as accurate. Saying that, once the laser is set up properly, it's much easier...But keep checking it!

The laser level that I use actually will self level after you get it close. Once it starts spinning it does that, if you get it spinning, and hit the transit legs it returns to where it was. Not sure how the cheaper ones are though, I am tempted to get one as they are very useful to me. You can even use them vertically for building walls. But I digress...

Yes that is totally true, the beam does get larger that farther away you get, but not really anything to throw the pool build off with. not sure, but I don't see tubing being cheap either, I could see renting a laser for cheaper somehow. Or a transit.

Presumably, a laser level works only with the receiver, right? So you set up your level in the "control" spot (the poing you're grading to), and then move your receiver from one spot to another, getting it level, then moving on...correct?


Any chance there's a laser level that you set up at ground level, and it'll show you the high and low spots without having to move a receiver around constantly?

I'd love to know there's a solution that makes this process as easy as hanging pictures with the laser levels that'll project a line across the entire wall...

There is, you can mount the tranciever onto a bull dozer and just drive it around until you get it right. But really, if you were to say set it on a block, you could crawl around with a ruler and you would see it on there. It is just not very bright on a sunny day. You will not get anything like the line on the wall with a picture level (isn't that thing awesome!?). The water level is a very accurate method no doubt about it, but personally I would never do it, especially knowing that there are easier ways.

On a side note, I once was in an auger pit that was 37 feet down in the ground, we were augering a 36" pipe under a couple of roads and a set of railroad tracks for a sewer line that had to go through there. The length of the auger was 450 feet. We welded a 1/2" pipe to the outside top of the casing, and it became our water level. When we came out the other side, we were right on where we thought we were going to be. They have their place, that was the only way for us to have checked our change in elevation in that instance, and it worked great.

Good luck
Steve

[badutahboy]

So I'm still not clear on how to use the water level... now that I think about it.

Tell me if I'm right here..

1. Make your water level.

2. Fill the bucket to an identifiable reference point, and create a siphon in your tubing.

3. Tack the tubing to a reference stick (we'll say a 2x4 for our example)

4. Set your 2x4 and bucket together in an area that you KNOW is level, mark reference points on tubing as to where "level" is.

5. place your bucket in the "control" area for your grading.

6. to check level, hold your 2x4 in an area and view the water level in the tubing relative to your reference mark. If the water is below your reference mark, keep digging. If the water is above your reference mark, you're too low and need to add dirt.

7. Repeat this process in enough places throughout your work site to be confident that the entire site is level.

Is this correct?

[sevver]

I don't really know what the bucket is for, I think it is just to siphon through/out of. All you need is a tube full of water, then tape or attatch one end to a board that is beat into the ground (with a reference point on it), and then you could maybe attach the other end to another board, hold it next to the stationary one and transfer the mark accross both boards. Then tape or secure the other end of the hose to the new board. With this done you would essentially have two boards with hoses taped onto them where the water level in each hose is equal to the line. If you wanted to get really creative you should screw a small plywood stand to the bottom of the mobile board. If I were going to do this that is probably how I would do it anyhow, then you could hand the other person a shovel.


This is sort of what I am talking about. Notice my 31337 Paint Skillz.

Carl seems to have a handle on this, and there may be another method for it. But this seems like the easiest way to go about it from where I stand. If you were determined to do it this way...

[matt4x4]

The bucket is supposed to give more accuracy if you change the length of your tube and also make getting your accurate starting point a lot easier without removing/adding a couple of drops of water to get to the right height in the tube.

The way I do it is:

Set up one permanent post to which you mount your bucket with the water level at the same height as what your top of the wall will be - this is your reference/starting point and will be the the exact height of the top of the wall, so make sure it's correct. Tape/fasten the far end of the open ended tube to a second post at least 6" taller than your wall - you can give this post a 1.5x1.5 foot plywood board base or a tripod style base so it's self standing to make life easy on yourself. If you have a tall enough camera tripod, it will work too, but get dirty in the process.
This saves you from pounding it that post you were complaining about over and over...
Set it immediately beside the bucket post and mark off the bucket level on teh tube or the post (water in tube should also be at this mark).
This mark is what your level point will be, as you move your tripod post around the site, the water in the tube will be either:
at the mark - meaning you're exactly at grade
Below the mark - meaning grade is too high by the difference
Above the mark - meaning grade is too low by the difference and you'll need to backfill some dirt.

Hope this makes your water levelling a littel easier.