New pool build -- pipes and pump sizes

[jasontx]

I know each skimmer is a separate 1.5" line, and the drain is separate but I'm not sure if it is 1.5" or maybe larger (it is also an MDX drain so it has a single floor drain and side wall drains so the way that ties in I don't know).

So I guess that is kind of my question. Is 1.5" still bad if you have at least 3 separate lines to the pad for your suction? You get the sense that pools are built somewhat differently in different parts of the country and I just want to make sure that I am focusing on real issues -- because there are plenty of other things to worry about in a pool build.

The pump thing does seem off. Although if you had a big pump and big lines and you could do your 1 to 2 turns in less time is it really all that much worse? I guess it is better to have longer times of circulation at lower rates. While the non-HP centric Intelliflo seems like it could get me out if some of that, I worry if everyone here builds normal pools oddly how will they handle next generation stuff?

[mas985]

If I had to choose between 1 - 2.5" line and 3 - 1.5" lines, I would probably choose the later since I would have some control over each line that way. 3 - 2" lines would be even beter but make sure the lines are dedicated to each suction port (i.e. not shared) and they go all the way back to a large header at the pad. For three lines, a 2.5" header should be used although you could get away with 2" since the pump, heater and filter are all probably 2" anyway.

Shorter turnovers are not that bad but if I had my choice, I would design the pool with longer turnovers/run times. Skimming, chemical distribution and filter all seem to work better with longer run times and lower flow rates. So to save money, it is best to design with longer turnovers.

Ideally, I would design for the low speed of the pump for a 12 hour turnover so I could run at low speed 24/7 and still have 2 turnovers. Also, that would allow for up to 4 turnovers a day at high speed if you really needed it.

However, with 13k gallons you only need 18 GPM for a 12 hour turnover. Even with the lowest HP pump available at low speed, you will still have much more than that. However, the Intelliflow may be able to get that low and you could still use it for the spa with multiple strengths for jets. Even though it does cost a lot, it may be your best choice as it has the most flexibility and allows you to get away with a single pump for your entire pool and spa.

[divnkd101]

Jason,

Congrats on choosing to build a tool. As Mas has stated, I am putting in my 2 cents worth as well. Eljefe and I built our pools about the same time. I am plumbed with 2" throughout my pool and plumbed 2.1/2" in my spa. I was given a free upgrade on my pump (Northstar 3HP). Everybodies eyes popped out of their head when I mentioned that. However, I love alot of agitation in my spa and I made that perfectly clear to my builder from the get-go. I have heard alot of people talk of savings on electricity. I can turm my pool over 3-4 times within a 5 hour period. My electricity bill jumped about $90/ month when I first started my pool running it 12-15 hours a day. I am now down (winter time) to running it 3-4 hours a day with good water chemistry. My electricity bill is up about $30/month from average. I have compared to other neighbors with smaller pumps and there is not much of a difference between 1HP/ 2HP/ and my 3HP. Is my 3HP overkill?? Probably so, but I love my spa and I love the fact that all 8 of my jets are perfectly balanced. Good luck on your build and keep us up to date.

Divnkd101
22 x 36 Custom(21K gallons)
8' Spa
SWG
Polaris 280

[jasontx]

Thanks to everyone who replied for all information.

As my quote was for Jandy before they switched to Pentair (they told me they would be changing in the future), it would have been $1600 to switch to the Pentair system and get the Intelliflo pump (I never got whether it was the full Intelliflo or 4x160). In either case I'd gotten used to the idea of Jandy and decided to stay with that. I did upgrade to a 2 speed pump and the relay to control it all from the PDA -- so hopefully I should get the power for the spa and the efficiency for the pool. The spa will be plumbed with 2.5" (I was wrong about the 2"), the pool will have 3 separate 1.5" lines and I've decided to live with that. I kind of feel liked I've pushed them out of their normal bubble enough (I know not a good reason) and I think the three separate lines should be sufficient. I definitely get the feeling no one else usually questions choices / requests changes, but that interest is what makes us all more particular.

The dig will start either Friday or next week depending on weather. Even though I feel like I have already learned so much here, I'm sure I will have many more questions and hope to contribute when I'm a little smarter about all this.

Jason

[tphaggerty]

As mentioned above, I would just make that the 3 lines tie into a 2" header prior to the pump and that you get ball valves on all 3 lines. My builder wanted to do 1.5" all around, including on the pad, which I wasn't going to let happen. Your pad should be all 2" (header to pump, pump to filter, filter to return headers).

[msm859]

the pool will have 3 separate 1.5" lines and I've decided to live with that. I kind of feel liked I've pushed them out of their normal bubble enough (I know not a good reason) and I think the three separate lines should be sufficient. I definitely get the feeling no one else usually questions choices / requests changes, but that interest is what makes us all more particular.
Jason

Umm it is YOUR pool -- question everything if you want. I am having 3 separate 2" lines going back to the pad all going into a 2 1/2" header. The return line is 2 1/2". My pool builder refers to me as the "troublemaker" -- jokingly, but I have questioned about everything. I am really into the mechanics of it. I am going with the Pentair Intelliflo pumps 1 for the spa and 1 for the pool. Pressure thus becomes even more important.

[Big_D]

Jason,
I was also a troublemaker, so much that I and my builder parted ways. In the end I did an owner builder. I did make some mistakes, but I also have a great pool today. You are way ahead of the game coming here to read up on how to maintain that pool. Builders build, and very few ever maintain a pool. I would make sure they loop the returns also, this will allow for more consistent even return flow. Who is your builder? A&S, Riverbend, Hobert I talked to about 10 in the DFW area. PM if you need to ask any questions.

[jasontx]

Thanks again everyone. I will ask about upgrading the sizes of the 1.5" lines to be 2". Even if the pipes were fine for this pump -- I'd like to build it so it could handle the next generation pump as well if it isn't a big $$ upgrade (which it doesn't sound like it should be). He did mention the header would be larger but I don't know the details. The Jandy Stealth pump I selected has a 2.5" line but I don't know that it matters when you also have a filter and heater to go thru that are probably 2". Dig day got pushed back until next week as we are expecting rain all day tomorrow and all weekend. Bummer.

Big_D - I talked to 4 companies and went with Hobert. Riverbend was a close second place. So far Hobert has been great -- any stress I have had about pushing and changing things has been my own, they haven't been negative about it. A friend built a pool with them 4 years ago and had a generally positive experience (nothing is perfect). Thanks for the offer to answer further questions -- I may be taking you up on that. I think owner builder would have stressed me out too much.

[beary]

Jason,
I was also a troublemaker, so much that I and my builder parted ways. In the end I did an owner builder.

Troublemaker here too. I didn't part ways, but both the builder and I wished we did. Learn as much as possible so that you know what you want. I didn't get in-floor cleaners because I could find a builder in this area who understood them. later on I found out my subcontractor had installed serveral in Texas and he would have don't it had he known.

Remember, building a pool is not rocket-science. But it can be built wrong. If I had to do it over again, I would be a builder owner, but I'm not suggesting that you go that direction because it takes a lot of time. However, I would start talking to subcontractors because you can learn a lot about from them. Diggers, truck drivers, plasterers, anyone other than the Pool campany owner. I learned more from one of the truck drivers who hauled off the dirt from our dig than any of our builders.

And, have a drawing made before you start and give a copy to everyone foreman who works on your pool so that everytime you have to talk to someone, you can point to the drawing. Language seems to get in the way everytime something needs to be pointed out.

Beary