Is It Normal For New New Ig Vinyl Pool To Be Slightly Unlevel?

[webfeet]

Pool is full. Close inspection of the water line on the liner border and the skimmers reveal that the water is about 1" higher on the deep end. I noticed it because the tile border pattern has a part of the pattern that is above the water line on the shallow end, but begans to get beneath the waterline near the middle of the pool, and finally disappearing at the end of the deep end. is this acceptable? The new pool is 40'6" long. It bugs me because I am paying a PC to install the pool, and I think the water should be even along the border.

[bobyoe]

That is not acceptable. Either the pools was put in un-level, or the liner was installed wrong. Is the liner in the track the same amount all the way around? If so, your pool is off, and I'd be very mad. Heck, I'd be mad either way!
Boby

[Waterworks]

Measure from your coping (where the liner actually beads into the track) down to the water level. If it is even all the way around, your liner has just stretched in a bad way and the tile border is just stretched more in some places than others. This is easy to fix.
If the measurement is not even all the way around the pool is off level. This could be very difficult to fix, depending on how far along the PB is.

Brad
www.waterworkspools.com

[webfeet]

I really think the pool walls are unlevel. The skimmers look the same distant below the coping, and I measured the waterline from the coping and it is about 3/4" different at each end. The deck has not been poured, but the PC has started the backfill. He plans on washing it in tomorrow and rebackfilling before he levels and builds the forms for the deck. He gave us permission to swim in it this holiday week end. The skimmers and filter are not working yet, but the pump is circulating the water. When ever I mention a concern to the PC he says that I worry too much. I have some other issues to address with him, but it is uncomfortable, and I feel like I am being hard to please. For example, I have been disturbed that the poolcrete surface is rough in several places, which I mentioned to him, and at his and Waste's advice I rubbed over the rough spots with my thumb, many of the rough areas do not flatten out, but remain. I have also found some small low areas, about the size of half dollars or a little bigger, under the liner. I mention the rough spots on a separate post, but if you have any advice on how to handle these issues, please tell me. I want to be fair, but I want what I paid for- a professional installation. Any input is more than appreciated.

[South_Texas_Sun]

I really think the pool walls are unlevel. The skimmers look the same distant below the coping, and I measured the waterline from the coping and it is about 3/4" different at each end. The deck has not been poured, but the PC has started the backfill. He plans on washing it in tomorrow and rebackfilling before he levels and builds the forms for the deck. He gave us permission to swim in it this holiday week end. The skimmers and filter are not working yet, but the pump is circulating the water. When ever I mention a concern to the PC he says that I worry too much. I have some other issues to address with him, but it is uncomfortable, and I feel like I am being hard to please. For example, I have been disturbed that the poolcrete surface is rough in several places, which I mentioned to him, and at his and Waste's advice I rubbed over the rough spots with my thumb, many of the rough areas do not flatten out, but remain. I have also found some small low areas, about the size of half dollars or a little bigger, under the liner. I mention the rough spots on a separate post, but if you have any advice on how to handle these issues, please tell me. I want to be fair, but I want what I paid for- a professional installation. Any input is more than appreciated.

Hi Webfeet, (love the screename

When it comes to pool contractors, we're all pretty much in the same boat. We are ALL at the mercy of the PB until the job is done, at which time we're either pleased with the ability to swim and enjoy the beautiful addition to our homes, OR.......ready to hire a "junkyard dog" lawyer and go for the PB's (usually non-existent) assets.

My wife.......(and I'm saying this tongue-in-cheek...honey ) is a pretty good "junkyard dog" when she doesn't get her way, and ......what I'm suggesting is:

Get a 3rd party to offer criticism about your objections, so that the PB has to offer the explanation to THEM while you look at him questioningly.. This could also be a neighbor, pool shop salesman, off duty building inspector, etc.

If this has no effect, your PB has the "siege mentality" that so many of them do, because they're fairly LOUSY at their profession and constantly get complaints.

In other words, do a "good cop, bad cop" on em......apologies to Mel Gibson, et. al.

STS

[webfeet]

STexas,
Thanks for advice. Please explain your last two statements. I don't know what you mean.

Also, I am convinced my walls are not level. EDIT: DH shot pool with optical level and says the walls are 1/2" to 5/8" out of level- not quite 3/4". However, it will be a very difficult and expensive job ( if possible) to correct, since the walls are cemented into the ground. I guess what I want to know is - Will I have any mechanical or funtional problems because the pool is about 5/8" lower l on the deep end than the shallow end? I expect my PB to try to get me to accept it the way it is, and if the only problem with the slight unlevelness is with the appearance ( like looking at a crooked picture) then I will probably settle for an appearance damage concession from him. It really bugs me that part of the border pattern disappears underwater for the last 20 or so feet of the length of this 40'6" long pool. But if it may cause me problems in the future, then I want to have it fixed before I let him do anything else.
On the other hand, If it is an appearance problem only, what is a reasonable finanical concession that the PC should allow me? I am thinking $1000.00. I am paying about $27,000.00 bucks and I think I deserve a level pool. I could have put it in unlevel pool myself, and saved myself thousands of dollars. I bolded my main questions - hope this does not mean I am yelling, mad, or being rude. I need this specific info asap. Thanks for your help!

[tenax]

i would expect frankly compensation in the neighborhood of what it would cost to take out the liner and adjust the surface, if that's what would do it..i highly doubt 1,000 would even come close, but still far cheaper than replacing. given the compensation i would be going after, i'd be trotting off to my lawyer if the guy didn't agree to do it in writing with committed dates and such. you could also for refund money back as a "bond" to ensure the work is done. that way if he did walk away from it, you would have the money to correct (if that is possible)

i know what you are saying..to some people slight out of level would be "c'est la vie", good enough. i have a garage that was out of level at the roofline by about 1.5 inches over 40 ft span from sinkage at the corner..once i noticed it, it haunted me until i got it fixed.

[webfeet]

Thanks Tenax for the reply. I edited my previous post after your reply- because DH shot the pool with an optical level. Pool is about 5/8" lower on deep end. You are probably right, I bet $1000.00 will not touch what it will cost to level the pool, if it is possible to fix it. I am still wanting to hear from Waste and others that install IG liner pools and get their opinions concerning what is fair, and what I should do. PB didn't show today, but I called him and told him about the problem. (He has not seen the pool, since we completed filling it.) He didn't sound happy when he said he would "look at it tomorrow." I concluded with, " I need my pool leveled before you do anything else." I hope to get more advice before I talk to PB tomorrow.

[waste]

Web, when a 'damsel in distress' calls, and I can hear it in time, I will answer (to the best of my ability). What I'll do here is recount 3 jobs that I've been on in the past few years where a pool has been severely (more than ~ 1/8" out of level [a LASER level has a +/- 1/16" margin of error]) out of level. I can not criticise a job I've never seen nor the company that did the job, so I'll let you infer what's going on with your pool.
1) A few years ago I personally was responsible for the steps in a pool being ~ 1" higher than the rest of the pool (thankfully the 'rep' option is gone ). This wasnt noticed until the pool was backfilled. The fix we made was to excavate the step area (to ~20' either side) and jackhammer out the collar so that we could lower the affected pannels to their proper heigth and repour the collar and rebackfill - all by hand, guess who got to do all the 'drudge work'?
2) Last year, a portion of one of the walls, collar and all (after a week of very heavy rain) sank over an inch, causing the wall to actually buckle (and thereby be ~1 1/2" low at it's lowest) right at the skimmer. Our cure this time was to excavate and cut the 'tops' off of new pannels and attach them to 'recreate' the beam that had failed.
3) Similarly, on a 'rehab' job 3 years ago, the original pool was so badly out of level, we cut new pannels in half and attached them as to raise the entire pool to the level we wanted (they were getting a new deck, so we had the leeway we needed).
The comparitive expense of these, I don't know, but I'm sure none of them are cheep. Talk with your PC and see what he will or can do to correct the situation.
I wish you well, again, with your situation and hope all turns out fine.

[webfeet]

Thanks Waste. Although what I infer makes me sick. I think that you are saying that you believe my pool is 'severely' out of level, (granted that I am on target about it being about 5/8" lower at the deep end.. How unlevel does a panel, ect, have to be, to be "severely" unlevel? In our case, near the middle of the pool, the pool appears to begin getting lower until it reaches a max of 5/8" lower on the deep end. So it drops about 5/8" over about a 20' span. The PB will be here today. I've already told him I want it fixed, but like I said, I expect him to try to get us to accept it. I know you can't critique someone else's work, but I feel like you believe, (granted- I am presenting you a correct scenario) this should be repaired now. Is this correct? If so, I need to be sure that I get it fixed now, before the deck is poured. Do you think we could have problems in the future, like you described? Possible additional sinkage from heavy rains or shifting ground? We are (have started)backfilling with concrete sand (flume), following the PB's advice. Our yard is the clay, gumbo stuff that expands and shrinks a lot during wet/dry seasons. Either being very mushy, or drying out and cracking on the surface.
My husband is the non-confrontive, passive, peacemaking type. If I left this to him, he would probably just accept the unlevel pool. He would probably complain to me about it, but let the PB get away with it. Consequently, when we have to deal with something like this, it is usually me that does the dirty work. I can say whatever needs saying to anyone-but I want to be diplomatic, well-informed, reasonable, and on target when I have to be assertive. I don't want to take advantage of anyone, or be difficult. That is why I am relying heavily on the experience adviced from the kind folks of this forum. I do not have any other "voices of experience" to call upon. This is our first "real" pool, and I want what we are paying for- a professionally installed pool. I really appreciate everyone's input- and I do my best to follow advice from people that I feel are more knowledgable than m self. I know that you all have to "assume" that I am accurately describing the problems, since you are not here and cannot see for yourself. In different threads, different people, especially Waste, have eased my mind concerning what I thought were major problems. This time I am not eased- but I want the truth, no matter how much I dislike having to deal with it. P.S. Hubby just told me that he plans to called Hydra Pools, the manufacturer, today and get their input, too. I am proud of him! Yea! I had not thought of that. Duh. Will let you know what Hydra says.