need advice

[bbluvbasket]

Okay, I usually just scan your posts and keep quiet, but this year I have opened my pool and have a little problem.

Here are my measurements for my 32,000 vinyl IG covered pool:

Chlorine ---really orange
pH >8.2
Alk 100
Cya 100
Temp 62

I opened last week and just threw in what chlorine I had left over from last year, figuring it had probably lost some of it's umph from being in the garage all winter. We live in KS. I dumped around 7 gallons. I had zero chlorine to start with so I thought it would be a good shock. HOWEVER, I am shocked that there is still a TON of chlorine a week later in it. Especially with such high CYA levels. I used the FC test and added a ton of drops and it still stayed pink. So I went to my quick kit and that is how I can tell it is really orange. I never got the second chemical to figure the combined chlorine with my kit.

So, I have added 2 cups of Muriatic acid. Somehow I don't think that will be enough. Any ideas as to how much I should dump in at once?

Secondly, I was going to start my heater, but with High pH like that, should I wait?

Third, Why would my CYA be so high?

Thanks for all your help.

BB

[duraleigh]

Hi, BB,

Chime in more often....no one bites!!

1. Download mwsmith's calculator....you'll need it.

2. Get your pH under control......you'll need way more than 2 cups of muriatic...use the calculator

3. Get your Cl under control....dont add anything with Cl to your pool 'til you can get it in a range that you can measure.

4. Resist words like "threw" and "dumped" for water chemistry.....I can't shake a mental image of giving a 5 gal bucket of unknown chemicals the "old heave-ho" right into the bottom of the pool.

5. I'd be in no hurry to run the heater but I would sure turn the pump on....you've got some mixing to do.

6. Why such high CYA?.....Pucks!!!! If I'm wrong and you don't use them, you have inadvertently "dumped" (please don't misconstrue my intent....I try to keep good humor in my posts and it doesn't always work) WAAY too much CYA in your pool. My bet is on the pucks, however. Stop using them.

7. Post your numbers back up when you do the above (well, at least, 1, 2, and 3) and you'll get lots of good help from everyone.

Dave S.

[aylad]

CYA of 100 came from use of trichlor or dichlor for chlorination, or maybe from a very large dose of stabilizer added last year. The only way you're going to be able to lower it is to partially drain/refill. The high stabilizer level is also why your chlorine is still in the pool--that's why I intentionally run my CYA high so that I don't have to add chlorine as often.

I'm not sure if I'm reading your post right, but the muriatic acid that you put in is not going to lower your chlorine levels--it will lower your pH. It appears that you're going to need a good bit more, however, I agree with Dave's advice to use the calculator, and get the pH down to between 7.0 and 8.0.

Janet

[CarlD]

Yipes, BB!

"Really Orange" is not a measurement.

You need to get a decent measure of FC before you get into big trouble. If you only have an OTO kit but it goes to 5ppm, use my shotglass method:
Get a gallon of steam-distilled water from the supermarket or local discount drug chain--nothing else!
Take a shotglass of pool water and a shotglass of distilled water, mix them and test that in your OTO kit.

You've now doubled the chlorine range. So when it reads "5" it's really 10. If your kit only goes to 3, it now goes to 6.

If you STILL have so much chlorine you cannot get a reading, start again, but this time use 2 shots of distilled to 1 shot of pool. Now you've tripled your reading to 15ppm of chlorine (or 9 if the max is 3).

You lose accuracy as you add shots of distilled to do this but it allows you to get an idea of where your chlorine level really is.

You can get a pool store to test it for you too...

[PoolDoc]

"Really Orange" is not a measurement.

Actually, it is.

There's just not a color chart for it. But, now that I've got a color laser printer (just purchased to make the new PS234 bottle labels), I'm looking into making a high range scale for the PS200, that I can put on the inside label.

Very roughly, though:

really dark yellow (darker than the darkest on the PS200) => 5 - 15 ppm
light orange => 10 - 20 ppm
dark orange => 15 - 30 ppm
brown => 30+ ppm

I've got to run tests to actually define that better; the colors above are just 'seat of the pants' guesses, based on prior experience.

Ben

[CarlD]

Actually, it is.

Sheesh...I guess I'm just not up-to-date.

Which of those is "Really Orange"? Light Orange or Dark Orange...

[bbluvbasket]

I guess I am in the light to Medium orange area. :-) Originally, when I put in the seven gallons that should have brought me up to around 13, but I didn't realize I had used that much puck last year towards the end, but I guess in thinking back, I must have. I had NO IDEA my CYA had gotten that high. I will dilute and remeasure the water for a more accurate measurement tomorrow. I've gotten the pH down to 7.6. I am happy with that. I left the cover off today all day. It was a bright sunshiny 93 most of the day. Who would of thunk it! LOL It's the middle of APRIL! I am hoping to have things resolved enough to have swimmers on Easter day since I am hosting a huge party. I will leave it open again tomorrow to expose it to some more sun. Again, what is a safe level for swimmers?

How do we order new supplies with this new site? I really need to reorder some stuff. Please point me in the right direction. Thanks!

BB

[PoolDoc]

Which of those is "Really Orange"? Light Orange or Dark Orange...

Why Carl, I'm surprised you aren't aware of the OIS (Orange Intensity Scale). It goes like this:

• Not Really Orange aka Light Orange with a Yellow Tinge
• Almost Really Orange aka Orange with just a flavor of Yellow
• Really Orange aka Just Orange; Ain't No Yellow Here!
• My GOSH Are We Swimming In That Orange aka Dark Orange with hints of brown
• Beyond Orange aka Brown.

. .

But seriously, those colors are meaningful. I think I've also descibed then as being "Brown = Don't Panic, but Get Everybody Out of the Pool" and "Orange = Don't even THINK of adding more chlorine. Meanwhile, they can swim, but only with OLD swimsuits!!" As it happens, I've found kiddie pools at "Brown" several times. We got the kids out, without panicking anyone ("Folks, the chlorine's a little high, and we need to close the pool for an hour or so."), and apparently, with no ill effects.

The fact that those colors EXIST is one of the major reasons I LIKE having the OTO kit in the PS23x series -- the OTO test is quick, easy, meaningful, and almost bombproof.

Most of them, you can operate quite successfully with the following verbal scale:

• Yellow to Dark Yellow => Ideal
• Light Yellow => Add chlorine
• Orange tinted => Swimmable, but too high, unless you are shocking or have high CYA
• Orange => Old swimsuits only! Ideal for algae cleanup.
• Brown => Too high for people and vinyl pools.
  (Not dangerous, but it will fade things, and sting eyes. You might get a little chapped where the sun doesn't shine, too.)
  Great for concrete pool cleanup.

Now, you can get meaningfully better results using the DPD-FAS, and tracking things more closely than that. But, using that scale alone, probably 1/2 the pool owners in the US could do better than they are now!

Ben