Calcium Preciptate Cloudiness:How Long Will It Last?

[Branzer]

I'm a newbie to this forum (although I've been reading for HOURS). This is our 6th season with a 15X30 AG vinyl lined pool, and we've never had any real problems before. We usually open it sometime in May (Lower Michigan), but this year my husband had surgery and we couldn't open it till July 3rd. Slimy, green/brown mess, of course. After several days of shocking with powdered shock and algaecides, it was a very very pale green (barely) and cloudy. Trip to the pool store for computer analysis by the proverbial semi-trained staff. This resulted in a two page list of chemicals and instructions which ($88 later) has resulted in a profoundly cloudy (white, milky) pool. They had us add 6.75 lbs. of pH decreaser followed (immediately) by 14.75 lbs. of Calcium Hardness Increaser (don't worry, I now know I never needed that), then liquid clorine the next day(they didn't tell us to wait, my husband forgot it).
After all of my reading here, I'm pretty sure I have calcium preciptate cloudiness from the sequence of chemicals they prescribed and the powder shock. The last two rounds of powdered shock just floated around on top for about an hour.

Since then we have changed the sand in the filter (it was 5 years old...saw that on the 100 reasons list), new Nature2 cartridge, added a little bit of blue clarifier and have achieved (I think) "balance".
I will be getting a better test kit tomorrow, but all I had right now are test strips (sorry...I fell for the change in packaging and bought them by mistake) and a basic OTO, phenol red kit.
Results, such as they are:
OTO: pH7.6
Phenol red:0.4 after 3 seconds, 1.0 after 2 minutes

Test Strip:
TH: 200
FC:0
pH:7.5
TA: 120
CYA: 30-50

As mentioned, we do have a Nature2 and pucks floating around. We had shocked with powder and with liquid; this morning my clorine was "above" 5 with the OTO, but now down to 1.0 (it held overnight)(sunny day). The pool store test on the 6th stated Green Algae "light", on the 8th "none".
I'm not sure how to vacumn to waste, either. Our water level is low (we have a mediocre well) and I can't imagine losing all of that water!

MY QUESTION IS: if it is a calcium precipiate problem (I saw "us" described to a t somewhere on the forum, 4" visibility etc), how much POP (Pool Owner Patience) will this require? Will it ever clear up? Is it safe to swim in? Can I help it along?
Sorry to be so lengthy, but I'm hoping for some wisdom here. I've read enough to think this is the problem, but no one has mentioned how long it will last?
Thanks for your (anticipated) patience.

[mbar]

You really do need to get a good test kit - the strips have too big a range between them. You need to add a lot of chlorine - it will clear up your water. At a cya of 30 - 50, you should shock your pool by raising your chlorine to 15 and keep it there until it holds overnight. You probably have dead algae that is causing the cloudiness, and since your chlorine is getting used up so fast, you are still fighting it. The only way to get rid of it once and for all it to be very consistant with keeping your chlorine level at 15ppms for a few days without letting it drop lower. Your water will clear up - if you keep up with chlorine.

[Branzer]

Thanks, Marie, I will add what liquid I have tonight ( a partial gallon of 10%) and get more in the a.m.
It does look marginally better today than yesterday.
I would appreciate any and all responses!
Tammy

[Branzer]

Hi, all,
Hopefully someone can help me...I think I have the HTH 5 way kit here (It says Poolife, with hth in the upper corner). My water is still very cloudy (white), though possibly arguably improved. Or maybe not.

Last night I put in 3 gal. of 6% Clorox, which gave me the highest possible reading (3) on my old OTO kit, which held till morning.

At 2 p.m. the new kit results are:
FC 5 (adjusts to 6 using the 1 part pool water/2 parts bottled water method)
TC 5 (same)(6)
CC 0
pH 7.3 or 7.4
TA 210 (to compare, the test strip said 150)
TH ???? was blue at the outset (said it would be red if hardness was present, then do drop count till it turned blue)
CYA ??? Less then 30, since the black dot was still visible at the 30 line, but disappeared a few mm later at the very top.

I know this is still imprecise. The water is cloudy, but not at all greenish, only white. I have read about lowering the pH then aerating, but I'm not sure how to proceed. I have 1.75 lbs. of CYA on hand, 2 gal. of 12% and 1.5 gal. of 6% bleach on hand. I've not been able to get through to the BleachCalc...the link is "not found".

AG vinyl pool, 15X30, pool store says 13,300 gallons. Using the lengthXwidthXdepthX5.9 formula for ovals, I get closer to 11,000 gallons, which could be part of my problem.

Carl, Waterbear, Watermom, anyone...help!
Thanks in advance,
Tammy (if you read my previous post on Calcium Preciptates, you'll get my background)

[Watermom]

In a pool this size, each quart of 6% bleach will raise your chlorine level by about 1 ppm. A quart of 12% should raise it by about 2.5 ppm. Since your water is still cloudy, I'm going to suggest that you try and shock it up to 10 and try and hold it there. Test 2 or better yet, 3x a day and each time, add enough bleach to bring it back up to 10. Run your pump 24/7. Don't worry about your alk at this point. In a vinyl pool alk of 210 is not insanely high. Just worry at this time about clearing the water first. Is this a new fill? Have you ever added any cya? If it is not a new fill, what have you been using to chlorinate with?

EDIT -- Since you have two threads going about your pool's water problems, I merged them together. It makes it much easier to help if all the info is in one place.

[Branzer]

Thanks, Watermom,
I haven't added any CYA yet this year, but have those pucks floating around for whatever they are (or arent') worth.
Should I add the CYA (and how much?)(it seems to be less than 30) before I add tonight's dose of chlorine?
Glad to hear I don't have to worry about the ALK right now. One thing at a time sounds good to me.
I really appreciate the help!

[Watermom]

For now, I would just shock and maintain shock level for a few days before I worried about cya.

Then, after your water clears up you can adjust your cya. If it were my pool, I'd not use the pucks. I would just add a little cya. Since you aren't sure of the exact reading, you'll need to go slow. I would add enough to the skimmer while the pump is running (per label directions) to raise the cya by 10 ppm. Then, wait a week to let it dissolve completely before retesting it. That way you should be able to get a more accurate reading. Then, if it is still too low, you can add more later. (Also don't backwash for a week.) Other people prefer to just use the pucks to slowly let the cya rise. It is just a matter of preference. If you do decide to use the pucks, just monitor your cya level every few weeks.

[aylad]

In addition to Marie's and Watermom's advice (which is great, as always) you need to have your pump/filter running 24/7 until your water clears. Shock levels will kill whatever algae you might have in the water, but will not remove it from the water--your filter does that. Same thing with the Ca precipitation. If that's your problem, (and it sounds to me like the problem may be a combination), the filter is what will take it out once the chlorine kills.

Janet

[Branzer]

Thanks for the further advice and encouragement. We have had the filter running 24/7 and we are starting to see some improvement. I agree, I really think it is a combination of calcium and dead (or lingering live) algae. This afternoon my daughter said "Mom, why is the pool brush at the bottom of the pool?" I had no answer for that, but was thrilled that it could be SEEN at the bottom of the pool, even if "through a cloud". Couldn't see a thing a couple days ago.

Am continuing to test 3x a day; Cl is holding overnight and went down only slightly during the day today. We had a lot of rain yesterday and pH is 7.5 now.

My husband is no longer threatening to bring the John Deere home to smash it to pieces and we can (kind of) see something at the bottom, so we're making progress and all thanks to the Pool Forum!

Thanks so much!!!!

[gordyjamz]

I had the same problem opening this year. Lots of algea from the winter. had the cloudy water too. I read on another site about breakpoint chlorination, which is basically bringing the free chlorine level high enough to burn off whatever combined chlorine there is. This results in a 0.0 CC reading, leaving your entire CL reading as FC. I brought my FC to 25 ppm for 2 days, then let it gradually go down to 10 and held it there for a week, all the while running the filter 24/7. Once I reached the 0 cc reading my water cleared beautifully. I imagine if I had a cart or De filter, it may have cleared quicker, but nonetheless, it cleared. The cloudiness is the dead algea and Cl floating around. Another thing to keep in mind is to get the ph and alk balanced BEFORE trying this. PH tests are not to be trusted in very high CL readings. I made this mistake and have had the added job of bringing the high alk down, because I added baking soda thinking it was low, all the while getting a false test reading. Hope this helps.