New Pool Questions

[md_rider]

Hi everyone,

We just had our new IG gunite pool plastered and filled on Monday. The guys came out today for the initial start-up and added 2 chlorine tablets, 6 lbs shock treatment, 5 gallons acid, 4 oz stabilizer/conditioner and 4 oz algecide. They gave me the test strips (how nice of them) so the first thing I did this afternoon was order the test kit from this site.

Now for the questions. I have been following this forum since we first decided on a pool and there were some very good threads explaining new pool start-up which have been lost. I have been searching and can't seem to find the information I was looking for (hopefully I didn't miss it).

Can someone post the recommended ranges for all the different parameters (CL, Ak, CA etc.)?

After reading all the great info on here, I am planning on going the bleach/borax/baking soda route. Is there a recommended procedure to follow? Such as what to get to the correct levels first?

I was told to brush the plaster twice a day for 10 days and keep the pump running 24hrs for 10 days. Also told not to use the heater, vacuum or Ray-Vac for the 10 days. Is this reasonable? Should I brush for a longer period or more than twice a day?

Thanks for all your help. This has been a great site.
Dave

[CarlD]

Sounds pretty reasonable to me. But I'm a vinyl liner.

New gunite pools need to cure so expect to add ALOT of muriatic acid to keep pH down.

You want to keep pH in the 7.3-7.8 range.
Calcium in the 200-400ppm range
Total Alkalinity in the 90 to 125 range (gunite limited-vinyl has a higher limit)
CYA/Stabilizer in the 30-50ppm range
Chlorine depends on your CYA range. for CYA=30-50 you want it Chlorine in the 3-6ppm. Higher is OK. Lower is not.

First: get a reading on these 5 things.

You NEED chlorine in ASAP to prevent algae. So shock it up to 15ppm, just to start.

Adjust your pH.
Then raise you T/A to 90-125. If you need to lower it, follow the thread on doing this.
If your CYA is low, you want to raise it--allow 2 -7 days for the stuff to dissolve in.
Then you can let chlorine levels drop to maint levels.

Once your CYA is where you want it, stop using tablets, powdered shock, and powdered chlorine and only use bleach or liquid chlorine to chlorinate and shock your pool.

And remember that for something like 6 weeks pH will rise steadily and you'll have to add Muriatic Acid to lower it.

[md_rider]

Thanks Carl, that is just what I was looking for. I'll have to wait for my test kit to check everything. Guess I can get a rough estimate with the test strips.

[md_rider]

I have another question after looking through some other threads. I understand when/how to use the bleach, acid, borax and baking soda. However, what about the Calcium Hardness? I saw (somewhere) that you should use calcium chloride to raise and anhydrous trisodium phosphate (?) to lower. Are these only available at a pool store?

Thanks again.

[Watermom]

I can't comment on where to buy them. But, after you get your calcium hardness reading - if you decide that it is too low and you need to raise it, you might want to consider using cal-hypo as your chlorine source for awhile. It will add chlorine and the needed calcium at the same time. Then, when your calcium hardness level is in range, you can switch to bleach. Just another option. Or, add calcium chloride directly and just start out with using bleach.

Watermom

[waterbear]

I have another question after looking through some other threads. I understand when/how to use the bleach, acid, borax and baking soda. However, what about the Calcium Hardness? I saw (somewhere) that you should use calcium chloride to raise and anhydrous trisodium phosphate (?) to lower. Are these only available at a pool store?

Thanks again.

Never heard of using anhydrous TSP to lower caacium harness. Can anyone verify? Also, I would be leary about adding phosphates to the pool since it is a favorite algae nutient at PPB levels! (I have kept Salt water aquariums for 30 years now!) I do know that phosphates will affect the crystaline structure of the calcium carbonate that precipitates out of solution with high phosphate levels causing Aragonite to precititate rather than Calcite. (Research I was involved in at the University of Miami School of Marine and Atmospheric Science many years ago) and that phosphates interfere with the amount that will precipitate under a given condition (you all know it as "Scaling") that has proved disasterous to our coral reefs before phosphates were banned from detergents but I don't see how it can lower the levels that are in the water.

Anyone point me in a direction so I can research this?

[md_rider]

I stopped at Walmart on my way home from work tonight and bought an HTH test kit to hold me over untul I get Ben's. Also bout some bleach. baking soda and borax. I tested the Chlorine, pH, Alk, Calcium Hardness and CYA. The results? No reading on any of the tests so I am low on everything. I did add 4 more pounds of shock as per Carl's suggestion to get the Chlorine level up first. Any suggestions of what to do next? I made a mistake in my first post about what was added yesterday by the pool guys. They added 4 lbs of stabilizer (not 4 oz) and 4 oz of stain protectant. I didn't state the size before but it is a 30000 gallon gunite/plaster pool.

Dave

[SJohnson]

Make sure there was no copper in that algaecide, a little late now, but I'm crossing my fingers for you that there wasn't . . . You may need a titration test to see those high levels of chlorine, as well.

SJ

[CarlD]

No need to add calcium to a vinyl pool...ever. Unless, of course, you feel the need to be charitable to your local pool store and buy useless stuff to keep them in business.

As mentioned, a good way to add calcium is by using Cal-Hypo to chlorinate. Look for 63% or more effective Chlorine--you won't find it in HTH products anymore--they are less than 50%-- but some of the pool stores private label it. Like Sun Pools in NJ here has a private label 63% Cal-hypo.

If you can STILL find the WalMart HTH 5-way kit, GREAT! It was the VW Beetle of good test kits--$15 gets you most of the tests you need, only the chlorine test is limited to 5ppm max. But, with the CarlD ShotGlass method you can get readings to 15 or 20ppm. Simply mix a shot glass of pool water with a shot glass of steam-distilled water and you double the scale (to 10ppm). with 2 shots of distilled to 1 pool you triple it, etc. but you lose accuracy.

Unfortunately, Arch Chems seems to have decided that such a useful kit is too much information in a home-owner's hands and is now pushing "6-way" test strips. I haven't seen the 5-way in the local WalMarts in 2 years--and it was the only reason I go to Wally-world.

[duraleigh]

Hi, Dave,

Lot's of good advice above.

Also, waterbear makes a good point about TSP. I read somewhere it could be used to lower CH as well. When I posted that info, Ben made a VERY CLEAR POINT not to use TSP because algae loves it sooooo much.

Keep reading and asking questions. You're on your way!

Dave S.