Metal in the water (Fiberglass 35K pool)

[blk133]

Since I added Ascorbic acid from the plastic cup around the walls of the pool, stains came off that were close to the walls at the begining, then water became cloudy and after that they came back.

Now (as it was before) the whole floor of the pool is covered with a layer of stain.

As you know I bought 5 lbs of Ascorbic Acid and 4 bottles of Sequestering Agent, I used 4lbs and all 4 bottles on day one when I started all that.

Yesterday I poured in 2 more bottles of Metal Out with the pump off. Direction was to have the pump off for 8 hours (for stain removal process). It didn't do anything to the stains.

I had about a pound of Ascorbic Acid left in the bag so I droped it in and as soon as Ascorbic Acid touched the floor of the pool stain started to disappear around those spots. So I know that it is deffinately a metal.

CYA went down for no reason, I already put in 6 lbs of CYA into the pool and now it is back at 20-30. Haven't shocked the pool yet since the time I started all of this.

Now I don't have Ascorbic Acid anymore, all 5 lbs are gone, stain still there, sequestering agent is gone LOL. And I am out of $130. Expensive treatment that didn't do much. Don't get mad guys it's not your fault. Thanks for helping me. I am out of ideas on how much more of this freaking acid do I have to add.

[DavidD]

B,

So sorry to hear that. Don't spend another dime yet. How's your PH? Go ahead and post all your numbers. Also, you may want to take a sample to a "reputable" pool store, if you can find one , and get them to test for metals so we know which metal is giving you the problems. Bring a sample of your tap water as well for testing.

Dave

[mbar]

So sorry to hear of the trouble you are having. Can you post your numbers so that maybe I can see something that would make sense as to why the sequestering agent isn't keeping the metals in suspension after they are lifted from the pool. Having the cloudy water really seemed to be that the metals went into suspension. Is there something that could be putting more metal into your pool? Do you have copper pipes? I am just trying to figure out what is going on. Your clacium level is not high - so it can't be that - and the ascorbic acid is taking the stain off - so something is either putting more metal in the water, or the sequestering agent isn't working, maybe there isn't enough in the water - You may have to add more - if you had a lot of stain, maybe there was just too much metal for the amount of sequesterer you put in. I would take the ph down to 7, add more sequestering agent and see if the stains get lighter.

[blk133]

Guys,

I am back to step 1, Stain is even worse than it was before. Floor and walls are covered with this brownish/yellowish layer. Looks very dirty. As soon as I drop vitamin C it disappears around the vitamin.

I went to the local pool store (Leslies) guys checked the water for metal and said 0 metal in the water. He couldn't even sell anything to me just said that my numbers are perfect.

Chlorine 4ppm
Total Chlorine 4ppm
PH 7.2
Alk 80-90
Cal 120-130
CYA 30

We had a heavy rain here and maybe that caused it to stain even more than it used to be.

I don't have anything in the pool that could cause it to stain. Pool heater is Aquacal h155 that has a titanium heat exchanger, filter Hayward DE EC-75 and polaris 380.

All pipes are PVC.

[gerri]

Today the water looked crystal clear, for some reason all of my CYA is gone. Added 6 lbs.

You know, I thought it was weird or maybe my test was off or something but all my CYA dissapeared during my AA treatment too. I have got to get some more in the water. I didn't lose any water or do any water changes or anything, just can't find any CYA in my pool anymore when I test. I was at around 40 before the treatment.

[mbar]

blk133, I feel your pain. YOur numbers are perfect. The same thing happened to me too last year. I still don't understand it - my water doesn't test positive for metals either, but I do get staining. I know that if the stain is out on the pool, the water won't test positive for metals , and if the metals are bonded to a sequetering agent, then they won't test positive either. I have read that fiberglass is magnetic, and that you should keep calcium at 300, so the metal doesn't leach out - I just don't know if I beleive it. I know that calcium is a metal, so I would imagaine it would cause staining if there is too much in the water. I had the worst stain the year the pool company put so much calcium in my water it measured 550. So the calcium thing is something I have a hard time with. I haven't had any staining problems this year - I have my calcium level really low because of all the rain we have had. It is only at about 80 and I don't have stains. There is so much conflicting information out there. What I think may have happened to your pool is that there isn't enough sequesterer in the water, and the metals precipitated out again. Waterbear (Evan) has found a product by Proteam called metal magic, that is supposed to bind onto the metals and turn them into crystals which can then be filtered out - which means that they will be gone, and unable to restain! I have ordered some, it hasn't arrived yet. I have a friend that is having trouble with stains this year. I am going to try it on both my pool and hers. I will post the results I have. I am afraid that the water will get cloudy for a while, since the metals will turn to crystals, but it is a small price to pay to get them out once and for all. You will have to do the ascorbic acid again though to get the metals back into solution before using the metal magic. Waterbear said the proteam stain treatment is ascorbic acid, so the regular plain ascorbic acid will work to take the stains off, then you can use the metal magic to crystalize them and filter them out. Here is interesting iinfo I found from the San Juan web site:



METAL PLATING (DISCOLORATION)

Top
Most fill water contains trace to measurable amounts of metals. Because these metals are completely dissolved in the water, they are invisible. Fiberglass acts as a magnet, attracting these metals and plating the gel-coat surface. This plating will not rub or brush off and appears as blotches or shading and may even take on bizarre appearances such as hand or foot prints. Iron deposits appear reddish or light brown, copper will be green or blue green, magnesium or cobalt is black. This plating can be removed almost immediately with the addition of metal removing agents to your pool water. Note: sequestering agents are not effective. Two products are very effective in removing these deposits. Metal Magic by Proteam Products and Jacks Magic by Crystaline Products. Metal Magic attacks all metals and converts them to a metal salt which is removed in the filtering process. Follow label instructions for proper application. Because calcium is a metal, occasionally metal magic will cause the calcium in your pool water to form cloudiness. Continuous filtration may remove this cloudiness. If not, a flocking agent can be used to settle the sediment to the pool floor where it can be vacuumed out. Contact your San Juan Dealer or pool professional for further information on flocking agents.

Jacks Magic will effectively remove iron deposits from the pools surface but will not remove it from the water. An additional Jacks product must be added to coagulate the metals into a filterable mass. Pools sanitized with chlorine must have chlorine levels reduced or removed for Jacks Magic to be effective.




So, there you have it - It just keeps getting more and more confusing - but if this really works, it will be great. I think it is worth a try. All of the advice I give on this forum is from my own experience, or from what I have read that seems to fit to me. that is why I want to try out this product, so I can let others know if it works.

[Tishabiondy@natlmail.com]

Marie, may I ask who you purchased your pool from?

Tisha

[mbar]

I got it through a pool dealer in my area, but the pool itself came from Water World in NJ.

[blk133]

Hey guys!

After my stain returned I thought I could ignore it, but today it looks so bad that I can't ignore it anymore. In addition to the metal on the walls and floor now I have these spots that don't come off with the brush. I don't know if it's a metal or something else, but when I drop ascorbic acid on it it desappears.

Does ascorbic acid removes algea? Because chlorine couldn't remove it.

My Chl=13 PPM I tried to keep it in that range during 3 days.
PH= 7.2 PPM
Total Chl= 13 PPM
CYA=25-30

I am attaching picture of this ugly stain.

Please throw in some ideas.

Thanks,
B.

[mbar]

If the ascorbic acid worked, then it is a metal stain. Have you been putting in a sequestering agent? If you had staining before, and removed it with the ascorbic acid, did you also put in something to keep the metals in suspension? You also didn't post the alkalinity, and another question, has your ph been at 7.2 or was it higher before now? Do you have any calcium in the water? There is a couple of reasons that your stain may have returned. I can help you get rid of them if you give me more info.