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Thread: Filter delivers dirty de

  1. #21
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    Default Re: Filter delivers dirty de

    That's actually a cool idea - using tiger flex above ground.

  2. #22
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    CarlD is offline SuperMod Emeritus Vortex Adjuster CarlD 4 stars CarlD 4 stars CarlD 4 stars CarlD 4 stars CarlD 4 stars CarlD 4 stars
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    Default Re: Filter delivers dirty de

    Here is some of the TigerFlex running to my skimmer and low drain. Since I drain it and put it away in the fall, in the basement, I have no problem leaving it on the ground. While I've re-plumbed a few times, this TF came with the pool 12 years ago and is still good. You can see the quick-connect/ball valves at the low drain and skimmer, though the handle on the low drain ball valve is gone. Since I'm rebuilding the pool this winter those ball valves will be replaced, but the TF won't be. It works exactly like hard PVC, just a little harder to cut evenly.

    Unfortunately, too many pool installer treat TF like it's hose. It's not. So they put barbed fittings INSIDE the TF with hose clamps...and it inevitably leaks. (the orig installers did that and I had to replace all the barbed fittings because it leaked just after they drove away!) But if you use glue-on Schedule 40 fittings, just like hard PVC, it doesn't leak. I've NEVER had a leak from the Sch 40 on the TF.
    On caveat: You cannot bury TigerFlex, unlike hard PVC or the black flexible plastic pipe used for sprinkler systems and wells.

    Carl

  3. #23
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    Default Re: Filter delivers dirty de

    Awesome!
    Hey - did you know you can cut tiger flex with a length of mason's line?
    And who says TF is not meant for direct burial? I dug some tiger flex up that was buried for 20 years and it's still fine.
    I agree 100% about not using barb fittings - plus they reduce the cross-sectional area.

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Filter delivers dirty de

    ok - so i called hayward with your posted info and got a tech right away. thank you. he thinks the algae cells that i vacuumed up are passing thru the mesh while the DE is trying to re-coat.

  5. #25
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    CarlD is offline SuperMod Emeritus Vortex Adjuster CarlD 4 stars CarlD 4 stars CarlD 4 stars CarlD 4 stars CarlD 4 stars CarlD 4 stars
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    Default Re: Filter delivers dirty de

    Quote Originally Posted by FRANCIS View Post
    Awesome!
    Hey - did you know you can cut tiger flex with a length of mason's line?
    And who says TF is not meant for direct burial? I dug some tiger flex up that was buried for 20 years and it's still fine.
    I agree 100% about not using barb fittings - plus they reduce the cross-sectional area.
    Learn something new every day! I usually just cut it with an 18V Sawzall. There's a wire cutter like a mason's line, plumbers use for cutting PVC in tight places. Does the mason's line cut through the spiral ribs cleanly?

    As for the cross-section: there's other flexible hose, usually clear, that works just fine with the same barbed fittings. Still, gluing's the best.
    Carl

  6. #26
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    Default Re: Filter delivers dirty de

    Clean as a whistle. I had to resort to that method when i dug a post hole right onto a buried obsolete tigerflex. Had to sever the tigerflex to allow hole digging to continue to a deeper depth. Tried welding a sawzall blade to the squashed end of a 3/4" piece of thinwall, but it kept binding. Mason's line to the rescue!! Once you get it going - do not stop or else it sticks. But when it cools, you can continue.

  7. #27
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    Default Re: Filter delivers dirty de

    I looked at Pentair's Quad DE / cartridge filter user manual. it says a brief cloud of dirt is characteristic for diatomite filters. Maybe i can incorporate a motorized valve that reverts discharge water back into the return for 10 seconds during start-up.
    http://www.pentairpool.com/pdfs/178658EQuadOM.pdf

  8. #28
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    Default Re: Filter delivers dirty de

    Quote Originally Posted by FRANCIS View Post
    I looked at Pentair's Quad DE / cartridge filter user manual. it says a brief cloud of dirt is characteristic for diatomite filters. Maybe i can incorporate a motorized valve that reverts discharge water back into the return for 10 seconds during start-up.
    http://www.pentairpool.com/pdfs/178658EQuadOM.pdf
    Hey @FRANCIS, how are you? Did you get a new DE filter?

    Yes, I have a QuadDE filter and I can confirm that it does that but only for a short period of time after initial start up, deep cleaning or backwashing. This past fall, I completely tore down my filter and cleaned out all the old DE from inside the filter body and from the cartridges (takes about half a day). I then restarted my system and performed a full DE recharge (about 10lbs of DE or 20 plastic scoops). For a few weeks after the restart, I would see a cloud of DE come out of the returns for no more than 30sec or so. Basically what is happening when you clean the filter is that you remove all of the DE from the nylon fabric mesh of the cartridges (backwashing partially does this as well). Then, when you start using your filter, it takes time for the DE/water mixture to build up a coating on the fabric surface. Eventually it does and over time the DE eventually gets stuck in place on the nylon and no longer falls off when the pump is not running. It took about a month, but the DE gradually stopped coming out of the returns and I no longer see it anymore during pump start up.

    Here's the trick to maximize the likelihood that the DE coating stays stuck - when recharging the DE after a tear down clean or a backwash, add the DE back very slowly and only 1lb at a time. Take a a 1lb plastic scoop, add the DE to a 5 gal bucket of pool water and mix it up to a slurry. Then pour the mixture very slowly into the skimmer. After that, wait a few minutes before adding the next pound. It also helps if you have a 2-speed or variable speed pump to run it on the highest speed so that you are operating at the highest possible flow rate. DE has a tendency to settle out of water fairly quickly and you want the DE to hit the cartridge material not just settle to the bottom of the filter tank. Using the slow add procedure will maximize the amount of DE that gets embedded into the cartridge and reduce the DE blow back.

    If you constantly see lots of DE coming out of the return or it takes longer than a few minutes to stop, then there could either be a hole in one of the cartridges or something is loose and not seated properly.
    16k gal IG gunite PebbleTec (Caribbean Blue), 18' x 36' free form with raised spa/spillway and separate rock waterfall. All Pentair Equipment pad - 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr heater, QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, IntelliTouch/EasyTouch Controls

  9. #29
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    Default Re: Filter delivers dirty de

    no, i did not get a new unit. especially after reading blowback is normal. the methods you describe take patience. i have a limited amount of patience. i need fast results. i will probably try the non-diatomite media this year - you know - the fiber stuff. if that fails, i will see if i can scrounge up a recycling valve [motorized].

  10. #30
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    Default Re: Filter delivers dirty de

    Hmmm....I never noticed DE blowback with my Hayward Pro Grid 6020 DE filter (installed in 2004) even after a backwash/recharge.

    PS - After backwashing, per Hayward manual, I do run it with the multi port valve in the Rinse position before returning to the normal Filter position. Perhaps this is why I don't get any DE blowback in the pool?
    22'x40' Grecian Lazy L 20K gal IG vinyl pool; Aqua Rite SWCG T15 cell; Hayward Pro Grid 6020 DE filter; Hayward Superpump 1hp pump; 12 hrs; Taylor K-2006; city; PF:6

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