New Salt System, algae is recurring regularly

[SunnyOptimism]

Yeah, I also keep borates at about 60 and use boric acid so I don't have to add acid with it.

I did use borax at spring opening when pH was a little low.

I like seeing the bubbles as it lets me know the cell is still working.

Me too. I like to tell my little kids that the pool is farting, makes them laugh like crazy. I also do the TA and FC tests in front of them and when the TA test goes from green to red, I tell them that someone pee'd in the pool. They all go wide-eyed and start blaming each other. It's totally hilarious!

[JimK]

Lol!

[CarlD]

Mine produces visible bubbles at the returns as well. I use to have rising pH, but since lowering TA to about 80 (I use to keep it around 100) the pH rise has pretty much stopped. It's been 2 full seasons since I've added acid.

I've kept my TA between 60 and 80 for the last several seasons, and only have the SWCG for the last two, so that may be why I've never had a rising pH problem. I haven't pushed borates, hasn't been necessary so far.

[SunnyOptimism]

I've kept my TA between 60 and 80 for the last several seasons, and only have the SWCG for the last two, so that may be why I've never had a rising pH problem. I haven't pushed borates, hasn't been necessary so far.

I believe there are also some other @chemgeek posts which show that low TA is desirable in an SWCG in order to minimize calcium scaling as the local environment inside the cell is so alkaline that the CSI is very positive relative to the bulk pool water. Also borates help to reduce scaling inside the cell as well because calcium borate does not or can not form.

You might give borates a try someday after you get bored with solving the world's problems I was quite impressed with the changes to my pool water chemistry. Plus, it adds a little extra algae-death insurance to the water.

[CarlD]

I believe there are also some other @chemgeek posts which show that low TA is desirable in an SWCG in order to minimize calcium scaling as the local environment inside the cell is so alkaline that the CSI is very positive relative to the bulk pool water. Also borates help to reduce scaling inside the cell as well because calcium borate does not or can not form.

You might give borates a try someday after you get bored with solving the world's problems I was quite impressed with the changes to my pool water chemistry. Plus, it adds a little extra algae-death insurance to the water.

If you don't like my style you don't have to participate in threads I'm commenting on. If you don't like that the administration team of Pool Forum actively participate in threads, you don't have to participate in Pool Forum. I'm a volunteer, like my fellow moderator, Watermom, and our PF Support Team. We've all been helped by those who came before us, and try to help those who've come after us. I've been here about 12 years now, I think. We get NOTHING but the satisfaction of helping other pool owners--and maybe learning something new along the way.

Some forums allow and even encourage members to treat each other with disrespect, discourtesy and condescension, to insult and demean each other. Pool Forum isn't one of them.

[SunnyOptimism]

If you don't like my style you don't have to participate in threads I'm commenting on. If you don't like that the administration team of Pool Forum actively participate in threads, you don't have to participate in Pool Forum. I'm a volunteer, like my fellow moderator, Watermom, and our PF Support Team. We've all been helped by those who came before us, and try to help those who've come after us. I've been here about 12 years now, I think. We get NOTHING but the satisfaction of helping other pool owners--and maybe learning something new along the way.

Some forums allow and even encourage members to treat each other with disrespect, discourtesy and condescension, to insult and demean each other. Pool Forum isn't one of them.

Carl,

Dude!! Obviously I am totally miscommunicating here with you. I WAS JOKING. That was meant to be funny, not an insult.

I realize that writing posts on a forum removes all visual/non-verbal clues from normal human conversation and that we have to be careful in how we write things but I've read that post back a bunch of times and I just don't see it as an insult.

Is there some way you prefer, in written format, to offset things in order to indicate sarcasm or humor, because i seem to be leading you into inferring malice with what i write and that is totally NOT the intent.

You have my apologies again for a poor post but can you please help me to understand you a bit better? Or, at the very least, just take a lot of what I say with several grains of salt....

[FormerBromineUser]

I have been on edge lately with links outside of the pool forum. Just my state of mine right now. More pizza might help.

[SunnyOptimism]

I have been on edge lately with links outside of the pool forum. Just my state of mine right now. More pizza might help.

Thanks FBU.

I get what you're saying and I get the fact that being a forum moderator, especially on a site as big as Pool Forum means being in contact with lots of different personalities, not all of whom are friendly and/or nice. And yes, a lot of people are down right rude and demeaning and purposefully argumentative....that's called being a "troll". I am NOT a "troll". Anyone who knows me personally knows that I am a friendly person with a kind demeanor and willing to give the shirt off my back to help others. But yes, I do like to joke around and have fun with my writing and I find sarcasm funny...

I also realize that I am new to the Pool Forum and I know very few people and I don't have much insight into other user's personalities and writing styles. However, one thing I try really hard to do (and I by no means get it right all the time) is this - I don't assume malice in what other people write. I always try to assume that a person writing a post is writing out of a genuinely inquisitive and benevolent nature and that they are not trying to hurt others or offend. Perhaps, after being here for years (assuming I don't get banned for writing something stupid), my attitude on that will change, but I hope not....

[chem geek]

Let me clarify a few points since there are some conflicting pieces of information or conclusions taken from my threads. As was noted, SWCGs produce hydrogen gas bubbles. If you don't see them during the day when the SWCG is on, then set it to operate at night with pool lights on and you'll be much more likely to see the tiny bubbles.

The production of chlorine in an SWCG is the same as adding hypochlorite to the pool so it raises the pH when the chlorine level rises. However, the usage/consumption of chlorine is an acidic process that exactly counteracts this effect so if one is maintaining the FC level then using an SWCG is pH neutral. There are other ways that the pH can rise including carbon dioxide outgassing. This is why lowering the TA level can help since it relates to how much the pool is over-carbonated.

As for reducing scaling in the SWCG cell, it's not just the TA but maintaining a slightly negative saturation index (say, -0.2) that can help. Using 50 ppm Borates also helps because it cuts the amount of pH rise near the hydrogen gas generation plate roughly in half.

There are other ways the pH can rise including curing or degrading of plaster, but also if chlorine gas from the SWCG doesn't fully dissolve and outgases instead. This can happen with short pipe runs from the SWCG to the pool. To minimize both the increased aeration from the hydrogen gas bubbles and the amount of potential undissolved chlorine gas outgassing, a higher CYA target (with proportionately higher FC target) can reduce the chlorine loss from the UV in sunlight and let one turn down the SWCG on-time.

As for the pH effect from Trichlor, as others have noted, the effect will vary depending on whether the pH would be rising if Trichlor were not used. Nevertheless, for every 10 ppm FC added by Trichlor it not only increases CYA by 6 ppm but also lowers TA by 7 ppm (after accounting for chlorine usage/consumption). If one doesn't replenish their TA level (or have significant evaporation and refill with water high in TA), then the TA can get to zero and the pH crash which can cause pretty serious damage.

[CarlD]

Carl,

Dude!! Obviously I am totally miscommunicating here with you. I WAS JOKING. That was meant to be funny, not an insult.

I realize that writing posts on a forum removes all visual/non-verbal clues from normal human conversation and that we have to be careful in how we write things but I've read that post back a bunch of times and I just don't see it as an insult.

Is there some way you prefer, in written format, to offset things in order to indicate sarcasm or humor, because i seem to be leading you into inferring malice with what i write and that is totally NOT the intent.

You have my apologies again for a poor post but can you please help me to understand you a bit better? Or, at the very least, just take a lot of what I say with several grains of salt....

It's simple: Treat other people with the same respect you want to be treated with. Hiding a disparaging insult inside a "joke" is generally not how to do it.