Recommended equipment for inground pools (Original)

[waterbear]

I agree with these recommendations almost 100%!

I have to disagree with one item, cartridge filters. As I have often stated I am a fan and have one on my own pool. The Pentair Clean and Clear are excellent. The trick with a cart filter is to make sure you oversize it for the size of your pool so your mean time between cleanings is at least monthly or longer,otherwise you will be cleaning it weekly and that is not a pleasant chore.

Then again, I do not believe in backwashing a DE filter but in breaking it down when it needs cleaning and that is more work than a cart any day. The problem with backwashing is you never really know how much DE you have washed out and it is way too easy to over or under charge the filter. Overcharged filters cause DE to bridge the DE can become rock hard when you finally break the filter down, making the grids difficult to clean to say the least. Undercharged filters cause the grids to foul, necessitating breaking down the filter to clean the grids.

There are also "bump" DE filters which I have never understood. You "bump" the dirt covered DE off the filter so the dirt and DE can mix then RECOAT THE FINGERS WITH DIRTY DE?! You are now filtering with a mixture of dirt and DE. What am I missing here? If you want a clean filter you have to break it down, no?

[JimK]

My experience is limited to what was installed with our pool, our first and only pool we've ever had (installed in March 2004).

I definitely agree with oversizing the filter! We chose DE since DE is much cheaper than replacing cartridge filters and were told it would require fewer cleanings. Our DE filter hasn't been near the hassle waterbear suggested. At most I've had to backwash once in the middle of the season. Last year it went all season on one charge. If I do have to backwash and recharge, I put in one less pound of DE than a full charge calls for. When I close down the pool for the winter I break down the DE filter and clean the grids without any problems of DE getting like "cement". However, I have heard of this happening when people didn't clean the DE filter at closing and instead let it sit dry all winter then tried to clean it in the spring (don't do that!). At least in my case, my DE filter has been less work than what waterbear describes with the cartridge filters.

We also use an Aqua Rite SWCG, also oversized (rated for 40k gal). The first cell only lasted 4 seasons, but I believe that's because I was using it to "shock" the pool as well as raising the CL level. I learned after that to only use the SWCG to maintain CL level and use other sources of CL to shock or raise the CL level (starting last season I use bleach). The second cell so far has lasted 6 seasons. Hopefully it will carry me through this season as well. The main board had to be replaced a few years ago. Overall I like having the SWCG. There was a period of a week or so last season I had to manually chlorinate the pool cause the original pump died (Hayward Super Pump, single speed)....what a PIA (I guess the SWCG spoiled me...lol).

Originally we used a Hayward Viper (w/booster pump) pool cleaner. That cleaner was OK at best. Once replacement parts became harder to find I switched to a Polaris 280 (I've had it 2 seasons). It performs much better than the Viper ever did. Also, parts seem readily available and less expensive.

Equipment aside, the best thing you can do is follow the testing and maintenance recommendations here! Since finding this site my pool has been easier, cheaper, and less mysterious to maintain!

Hope something in my ramblings helps.

[willx6]

Thanks, looking to buy my equipment soon y'all have really got me thinking now, would y'all go audimated with the equipment or is it too big of a hassle.

[PoolDoc]

@JimK, Waterbear: Thanks for your input and criticism -- it was very helpful. I'd like to collect as many reactions as I can.

@Willx6: Chemical automation, based on sensor electrodes, is a bad idea for any pool not operated by someone with substantial technical skills. The electrodes do not maintain a stable signal response to the water chemistry: in other words, the signal varies over time, even when the chemistry remains the same. As a result, the units have to be regularly calibrated, and the calibration can be complex. Even worse, the ORP electrodes, used to control chlorine levels, do NOT measure chlorine at all. Instead, they measure the NET oxidizing potential of the water: (chlorine + other oxidizers including MPS) - (reducible chemicals, such as urine and many stain removal agents). Even more complex, on outdoor pools running with stabilizer, strong sunlight reduces the HOCl fraction of the measurable DPD chlorine. This means that the ORP controller will RAISE chlorine levels on sunny days, and LOWER chlorine levels on cloudy days -- a result that confuses the heck out of operators.

OK. With respect to chemical automation, I have a bunch of experience, and some data-based criticisms.

With respect to other automation, my objections are more personal, based on my own preferences, but here goes. Most of USEFUL (in my opinion) functions of automation controls can be achieved with much less complexity and expense and much MORE reliability using a multi-channel time clock. The things that can't be done -- like remote reporting, and using your iPhone to turn on your spa -- seem to be less than useful to me. How valuable is it to be able to turn on the lights or blower with your phone, instead of flipping a couple of switches as you walk toward the spa?

The one exception I can think of, is the ability to turn up the heat on a spa remotely. This would allow you to leave the spa low normally, but turn it up when you and your spouse plan a pleasant evening. But that's a life style issue: if YOU would benefit from that, then it's a benefit. But I'm guessing most people wouldn't actually use it.

There is one objective criticism to electronic controls and programmers: they are way too complex for many people, but those same people are often ashamed to admit it. People who are confused by their AV equipment, should not get electronic controls for their pools and spas! And there's a perfectly good reason that you can give people: just tell them that you realized that the smart choice was electromechanical controls that are cheaper and more reliable, rather than far less reliable 'gee-whiz' controls that local installers often can't service, and that manufacturer telephone support techs often don't understand!

[willx6]

Thanks, I will have a spa waterfall, two bubblers and some deck jets. Is the 3hp vs pump worth spending $1200 for.

[CarlD]

I would add to the discussion with two cleaners I have generally been delighted with:
First would be the Pool Blaster (formerly Pool Buster) rechargeable hand and pole vacuum. I'm on my second and I wouldn't be without it! It's great for spot cleaning or doing the whole pool without a hose. You can use it while you are swimming. It looks like a gimmick but I love mine!
Caveats: First--get the extra-fine filter as well. It's too fine for spring cleanup but gets dust and pollen the regular filter bag doesn't. Second--occasionally the battery-pack fails. If it seems to be running low fast and you're still under warranty, act to get it fixed (changing the battery/motor combo isn't hard, if you follow the directions). Otherwise the replacement cost won't be worth it.


Second would be a robotic cleaner. Personally, I've had great luck with Blue Diamond wireless remote model and far less with the Dolphin Dynamic because of reliability problems. It's really a set-it-and-forget-it gadget. Yeah, it cost more, but it also brushes the walls as it climbs them so you don't have to do more than spot vacuum and you don't have to brush the walls. In fact, one robotic cycle on all the brands is like one full water cycle by the filter and pump.