Quote Originally Posted by paulvzo View Post
Thanks Ben and Waterbear for your time and answers. A few replies:
and a few answers for you


Quote Originally Posted by paulvzo View Post
3. Sure, drain cleaner is dangerous in the wrong hands. I can understand why it wouldn't be sold to the general pool public. But for those of us who have handled dangerous things of any category and know how to do so safely, it seems to me a good way to go. The Red Devil brand appears to be pure SH.
However, Reckitt-Benckiser, the manufacturer of Red Devil discontinued the product a few years back and most stores have pulled other brands of lye off their shelves because it is used in meth labs (as any soapmaker can tell you!) It usually has to be ordered from a chemical supplier these days so it is not a readily available option anymore, making this a moot point.
Quote Originally Posted by paulvzo View Post
4. I like my pH meter. At least as accurate as trying to interpolate colors. And "to the tenth" is all anyone needs.
Sorry. to burst your bubble but just becase the meter reads to one decimal point does not mean your readings are that precise, paricularly with a one point calibration meter. As I said before I have used pH meters in the lab and know their ins and outs very well.
Also, if you have ever used a high precison pH comparator such as found in the Taylor 2000 series kits or midget comparator kits (as opposed to the pH comparators found in inexpensive 2 way or 4 way OTO test kits) you would not need ot 'interpolate colors. In fact, phenol red has distinct color changes for different pH so that it is possible to read the color itself and not rely on the comparator once one is familiar with it. The main point here is that a pheonl red test with a quality comparator is going to be much more precise than an inexpensive, 1 point calibration pH meter. Period. (I use the term 'precise' because there is a difference between precise and accurate. Accurate means that the result obtained is repeatable. Precise means that the result is correct. If you have a meter that is not correctly calibrated or has an electrode that is near the end of its life ti might give you the same results upon multiple tests of the same sample meaning the meter is accurate but is does not mean that this repeatable result is the correct one!)
Quote Originally Posted by paulvzo View Post
5. I want to minimize chlorine due to the expense. I am on a very limited income until my mother dies and I can go back to work. There is a thread just recently about a gentleman going ten days on vacation and the water was clear when he got back.
That 'gentleman' was me. However, that was just because the borate kept the algae from growing so the pool did not turn green (as it nornally would here in FL in just a few days). It does not mean the water was safe to swim in and, as I said in the post, the first thing I did was shock the pool. A very important point is that clear water does not always mean safe water. This is an important distinction to remember! How do you determine safe water? By making sure you have the appropriate amount of an EPA approved fast acting residual sanitizer in the water. Borax is NOT a santizer. I normally keep my FC at 5 ppm (SWCG with CYA at 80 ppm so minimum FC would be 4 ppm for me). I repeat, 50 ppm borate does NOT allow a reduced FC any more than copper/silver, ozone, UV light, etc. does if you want to maintain SAFE water!
Quote Originally Posted by paulvzo View Post
6. BTW, just how DO you measure the borate level? I can understand the math for the initial blast, but after that?
with either borate test strips or a drop based borate test kit. As far as the strips go, the ones from LaMotte are the easiest to read because the color changes are from rose to tan.
http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/showthread.php?14994
scroll down to #5
The AquaChek ones are very close shades of tan and very difficult to read.
The only drop based test still on the market that I am aware of is an add on for the Taylor K-2005/K-2006 test kits from Piscines-Apollo Pools in Montreal, Canada. It uses two of the reagents in the Taylor kit and the large tube on the Taylor comparator for the test so you MUST have one of these two Taylor kits (and should have the K-2006 anyway. It's the best test kit to own if yo have a pool.)
Proteam used to make a stand alone borate drop based test kit but discontinued it and now sell the LaMotte strips rebranded with their name.