pink algae and other problems

[PoolDoc]

oh and I had a question about a product called "aquafinesse" several places claim this would really help with biofilm and thus pink slime. Anyone have an opinion of this product?

Here's their MSDS page: http://aquafinesseone.com/msds-2/ There's nothing special in their products!

Do the pool chart, and I'll look at this in more detail this afternoon:

Pool Chart Entry Form
Pool Chart Results

Post when you've completed it, so I know to look back at this thread. I'm afraid you put enough bromine in to be a real problem. It certainly is enough to explain a high chlorine loss rate.

[matthew64]

chart is filled out.

I would agree about chlorine loss, but then again the loss was only 6ppm over the course of 2 sunny days! Only after I scrubbed the pink slime again did that next day the loss was greater (20 to 8) and the water was slightly cloudy that day after scrubbing.

[PoolDoc]

My bad on the chart -- still got to add better indexing.

Yeah, algal and bacterial 'goo' has a HUGE chlorine demand, that must be satisfied before you can make everything 'all better'. However, given your high CYA, the bromine may be helping more than it's hurting, since the bromine creates a larger 'active' halogen residual than you'd have otherwise.

Given that you have a vinyl pool, draining is not a practical option.

But you likely don't have 35K gal; I'd actually flagged that. Here's the calculation:
18 x 40 x 3.5 x 7.48 gal/cft = 18.8K gal (top 3.5' slice of your pool)
18 x 18 x (8-3.5)/2 x 7.48 = 5.4K gal (assumptions: break at 20'; hopper volume is 1/2 of a non-angled bottom - reasonable for most liner pools)
Total gallons = 24.3K gallons.

Still, that's a fairly large volume, and the bromine may not be a long term problem. If it is, you can do a fairly effective drain, if you buy an over sized winter cover. I'll explain how, if that becomes necessary.

[matthew64]

Thanks for the correction. The 35,000 gallon was a quote from the previous owner and I just never questioned it. Anyway so I guess just try to continue to keep it a high chlorine level (20ppm) for the foreseeable future and see how it goes. thanks for all the help.

[PoolDoc]

Actually, with the bromine present, it probably isn't necessary to keep the chlorine so high. The bromine creates a significant unstabilized halogen residual that is effective against biofilms like you have.

I'd let the chlorine drop, at least to 10 ppm, as soon as you've brushed all the 'pink algae' and seen no evidence of new growth.

[matthew64]

So I have been keeping the FC at around 20 (as high as 24) for several weeks now, have brushed and vacuumed the pool multiple times and yet the pink stuff still returns. it mostly appears as more dead particles on the bottom of the pool, but there is new formations on the walls. Im worried that Im creating the most chlorine resistant super bug ever.

[PoolDoc]

Hm-mmh.

My problem is that I have ZERO personal experience with pink algae (it's not actually algae), and very little information about what might be most effective. Complicating the issue is that it is an opportunistic biofilm community that's going to tend to stick around in cracks and crannies even after it's 'all gone'. So, you not only need to get rid of it, you're going to have to keep getting rid of it.

What do you want to do?

Option #1: I looked at your pool online (Google Maps has a very nice image of it!). Since you've got no steps, you can probably drain to 8" deep in the shallow end, without too much risk. That will give you about a 60% drain, reducing your CYA to ~140 ppm. Then you can refill and treat with high chlorine. You can also go to 60 ppm borates, which may, or may not help but will reduce your pool's susceptibility to true algae.

Option #2:Try chemicals till you find what will work. I suspect the cheap quat algaecide at Sams Club will work . . . if you add enough to make your pool soapy and THEN brush. You'd only be out $30, but your pool will be soapy and probably irritating to eyes for maybe 2 weeks. You could try polyquat which is more expensive, and may not penetrate the biofilm well, though it might help if used at the same time, as the other. You could use ammonium chloride, to produce monochloramine which penetrates biofilms MUCH better than regular chlorine . . . but monochloramine is irritating.


Honestly, if it won't bust your budget, I'd probably try this in your shoes:

• Do a 50% drain (8" water in the shallowest stpot) and replace => $###?
• Add 60 ppm borates (19 boxes of 20 mule team, plus maybe 6 gallons of muriatic acid => $100)
• Add 1 pint of polyquat and brush every 3 days for 2 weeks (3 x $20 => $60)

If that doesn't work . . . you can move on to the foamy quat + monochloramine. But the first 3 steps are all stuff that's generally good for your pool, ANYHOW, so there's no waste. And, none of that will put your pool out of service, except for the time it takes to refill.

One BIG caution: do NOT do this if the ground around your pool is wet! If you're not sure, dig a post hole next to your pool. Let it stand overnight. You can drain to 1 foot ABOVE the highest water level in the hole.

[chem geek]

I'm unclear about something. The HTH Spa Non-Chlorine Oxidizer Tablets that were added are potassium monopersulfate (MPS), not bromine or bromide. I don't see where any bromine has been added to this pool. Bromine is often effective at killing pink algae and especially so in this situation since the CYA is so high that chlorine is simply not going to do the job (unless there is significant water dilution first to lower the CYA level). So adding some sodium bromide to the pool will, when activated by chlorine, produce bromine to kill the pink algae.

[PoolDoc]

I'm unclear about something. The HTH Spa Non-Chlorine Oxidizer Tablets that were added are potassium monopersulfate (MPS), not bromine or bromide.

@ Chem_Geek: Thanks for catching that, Chem_Geek. I didn't follow the link -- I just saw that they were tablets and assumed that it was bromine. So that's new info for me, that MPS is being formed into tablets. I see why he THOUGHT they were bromine: apparently they are intended as a MPS + bromide spa system, and are labeled that way.

@ Matthew: The fact that you do NOT have bromine means you can try that, as an option. Adding 1.5 ppm bromide to your pool -- 1/8 of a 2# bottle -- might help. If you want to try it, here are a couple of links:

Nava Chemicals 652072097 Yellow Algae Remover, 2-Pound Bottle @ Amazon
Tropi Clear TC-4402-1 2-Pound Yellow Eliminator @ Amazon

It might be a good thing to try, even if you do drain. Adding the bromide before you drain might allow you to get a lot of it cleaned up, BEFORE you drain. Using it in conjunction with the foamy algaecide might well allow you to eradicate it, and then remove 50% of the algaecide and bromide, so it wouldn't take to so long to get rid of them otherwise.

[matthew64]

Thanks for the replies. I think I sent the wrong link for the bromine tablets. I am 99% sure that it was brominating tablets (at walmart). The link I sent looks similar, but I was looking for bromine specifically and Im really pretty sure thats what I bought and put in the pool (x3). Thanks for looking up my pool, its cool(and sort of creepy at the same time) you can do that on google maps (that picture was taken the day of my birthday last year). I do have steps in the lower left corner of the pool in the shallow end. does that effect if I can drain down to the deep end?

So Im pretty sure it was bromine tablets. So my options are try a foamy algaecide and maybe something like yellow out. I found pink treat which seems to be just really bromine. http://www.swimpool.com/PinkPoolAlgae-pinktreat.htm. We also have been having to add water every week because its been so hot. If I had to add it up its probably been maybe 2ft of water loss that may have brought the cya down some (havn't checked it recently)