New here. A bit overwhelmed.

I'm new here...sorry it's a bit long winded. I did try and search, but my search skills are terrible.

Just got a Intex 18'x4' metal frame (about 6500 gallons.) We spent the extra cash for the saltwater set up (wife want's to go green!) I filled the pool with well water and put the salt in yesterday. I've been running the pump for about 24 hours now and will start the SWG when I get home. I took a sample to local pool supply place. Aparently my TA is 280. The guy said he couldn't recomend muriatic acid for a vinyl pool (not sure why?) Anyway, I've been reading alot of different things about bringing down the TA and I've been getting just as many suggestions, so I wanted to see what's up? I guess my question is: Will it be OK to use the muriatic acid...and should I leave the pump running when I add it, or turn the pump off for a few hours (I think they were calling that the slug method?)

I saw the method that uses areation (sounds good and makes sense) but I wasn't sure how much acid to add? If I put 1/2 a gallon of acid in while the pump is running and check it again tomorrow would that be the best thing?

The guy at the pool place also said I need to put in 1lbs of shock and 3lbs of conditioner. Does this sound right?

I'm a little confused about why I'm putting in a bunch of chemicals when I'm trying to go to a less chemical set up? Any advise or help would be great.

Welcome to the forum.
It is ok to use muriatic acid in a vinyl pool. You do want to add it while the pump is running. (No slug method.) What is your ph? Do NOT add 1/2 gallon. Repost with your ph and someone will help you go from there. Actually, please give us a compete set of current water testing results taken with a drops-based kit -- not teststrips.

ok. This is what numbers were on the sheet I got from the pool guy.

pH: 7.2
TA: 280
Calcium Hardness: 225
CYA: 0
Phosphate: 0

Does this help? (The kids are going to hang me if they don't get to swim soon....they are getting a crazy look in their eye!)

Have you added any chlorine or do you have any chlorine readings? Since it is well water, I am concerned about telling you to shock the pool without knowing if you have any metals in your water. For now, don't shock but simply add 2 quarts of plain bleach. That should take your chlorine up to 6. You'll probably need to do this a couple of times per day for right now. I'm going to ask Marie to take a look at this. She is the one who knows more about metals. You also might want to take a sample to be tested for metals. Then, you'll know for sure if that is going to be an issue for you.

As for lowering TA, the process is to drop the ph with muriatic acid (which will also drop the TA some) and then aerate the ph back up. Then, repeat the process until you get the TA where you want it. Since your ph is already 7.2, you don't want to drop it any further right now. Go ahead and start aerating until the ph climbs up to at least 7.6 or 7.8. Then, you'll do some muriatic acid to lower it back down to 7.0-7.2 and aerate again. Repeat as necessary. (In a pool this size, 5 oz. of muriatic acid will lower the ph by approximately 0.2)

You'll also need to buy some stabilizer (cya) to add or use triclor tabs to chlorinate with for awhile. (If you use tabs, make sure they do not have any copper in them.) Also, if you do decide to use the triclor tabs, monitor your cya level because the tabs will add cya. When you get to around 30-40, stop using them and switch to using bleach. I would suggest not using cal-hypo as your calcium hardness reading is already 225.

P.S. --- I understand the crazy look in their eyes from wanting to swim, but usually around my house, it is MY eyes that have that crazy look. I am the one who is usually most anxious to swim! Let them get in!!!

Do NOT use the Slug method because it will damage your pool and it doesn't work.

What you need to do is seek out our section on lowering T/A via the rachet method (you "ratchet" T/A down). Where you are now, you want to RAISE your pH without raising your T/A level.

So you want to aerate your pool till your pH is 7.5-7.8

Then you'll add the muriatic. I wouldn't add more than one cup, and add it to a 5 gallon bucket of pool water first, then add THAT to your pool. Watch your pH. If it gets down to 7.0 to 7.2, start aerating again to raise the pH. If it gets lower than 6.8, you'll need to add Borax so your pool isn't damaged.

Each time, before you start aerating, measure your T/A. When you are below 180ppm, you'll be relatively safe. Below 150, you'll be fine.

But read up...

Just to be sure....all this applies to the swg as well? Are there any differences I need to be concerned about with the swg?

Thank you for all your help this far. I've been areating the pool already so hopefully it will be up a bit by the time I get home. I'll pick up a nice kit as well.

The bleach that Watermom recommended is to get your chlorine up for right now so that you don't add an algae bloom to the equation. Once your SWG gets up and running, it will generate the chlorine for you, but in the meantime since you don't have any stabilizer in the water, the sun will quickly degrade your chlorine.

As far as the other recommendations from Watermom and Carl, they all apply even with the SWG running--in fact, the SWG will help raise your pH as well, so it actually will make your job a little easier.

Also, you do need to add CYA to the pool, but do NOT add 3 lbs to a 6500 gallon pool. You want to check the CYA level that your SWG manual recommends, then follow CYA label directions to target just below that level, since CYA takes several days to register in the pool, and it's easy to overshoot....and if you do that, then you'll have to drain/refill to lower it. If you have a sand filter, you can put it in the skimmer but don't backwash for at least a week, or better yet, put it in an old tube sock or knee hi and hang it in front of your return to let it dissolve.

BTW, a pool full of splashing kids is a VERY efficient way to raise your pH!! ;)

Welcome to the forum!

Janet

Ok. For now I will shock, condition, and put keep an eye on the pH. As the pH goes up a bit I'll add the acid to get it down to 7.0 and continue to "ratchet" the TA and pH to where they need to be. Thanks again for the help. I look forward to being a part of this forum.

As I mentioned in my post above, since you are filling from a well, you don't want to shock until you make sure you don't have any metal in your water.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Watermom

As I mentioned in my post above, since you are filling from a well, you don't want to shock until you make sure you don't have any metal in your water.

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Ok. No chlorine until I check for metal.

It is ok to add chlorine. As I suggested, take it to about 6ppm but just don't "shock" the chlorine up high. You might need to reread this thread. There has been a lot of information given and sometimes it is hard to absorb it all on the first read. Hang in there. You'll get it. Let us know when you find out about your well water.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Watermom

It is ok to add chlorine. As I suggested, take it to about 6ppm but just don't "shock" the chlorine up high. You might need to reread this thread. There has been a lot of information given and sometimes it is hard to absorb it all on the first read. Hang in there. You'll get it. Let us know when you find out about your well water.

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OK. I'm sorry...I was a bit confused (I thought that "shock" was Chlorine)
When you say "plain bleach" do you mean just "plain bleach"? Like from walmart?

"Shock" is a verb -- something you do to your pool, not a product. When we say to shock the pool, we mean to super-chlorinate. You do NOT want to do that right now until you find out if you have metals in your well water.

When I say plain bleach, I mean plain, unscented laundry bleach. Clorox or better yet, generic from someplace like Wal-mart where it is cheaper. Most of us here on the forum use bleach as our source of chlorine.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mwil3

OK. I'm sorry...I was a bit confused (I thought that "shock" was Chlorine)

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Just to clarify, as Watermom said above, "shock" just means to raise your chlorine level to a level that will kill algae. What product you use to accomplish that with is your decision. I know it's confusing--pool stores package powdered chlorine and call it "shock", but it's just chlorine in large amounts. You can use

Dichlor--usually what is in the packaged "shock" and will raise your chlorine but also has the side effects of raising your CYA and lowering your pH

Cal-hypo--also packaged as "shock" and will raise your chlorine and calcium (calcium is not needed in a vinyl pool, no matter what the pool store people say!, but will not cause problems for you unless your hardness gets above 250 or so, and then it can cause milky water)

Bleach--plain, generic bleach with no additives, scents, etc. available at WalMart that will raise your chlorine but not affect your other chemistry numbers. Most of us on the forum use this because it's the most readily available, cheapest form of chlorine that doesn't mess with your other chemistry numbers

Liquid chlorine--same as bleach, but usually in 10% strength, where bleach is either 5.25% (regular) or 6% (ultra).

So--you need some chlorine (up to 3-5 ppm) in the pool to keep from growing algae, but you don't want to "shock" your pool (up to 10-12 ppm) until you know if you have metals in your water, because high doses of chlorine with metals in the water cause the metal to fall out of suspension and cause staining. (See the Metals forum if you need more info on this).

Hope this helps..

Janet

You may want to add a sequestering agent before you shock. Anything that says metal out, or metal control. If you have metals in the water, and high ph and you shock you will cause the metals to fall out of solution and stain the pool (it can be cleared up, but to stop it before it happens is much easier!). Put as much as it says on the bottle in, and you will have to add it as you add water to your pool. The sequestering agent will keep any metals in the pool water in solution. High ph along with high chlorine levels is what makes metals fall out of solution. If you have any questions feel free to ask:)

Well....I went by the pool store to get some conditioner and the guy told me to put 4lbs in a 6500 gallon pool (don't worry...I didn't put near that much.) After reading a bit more of the SWG booklet, it said to add about 1/2 pound, so that what I put in (I figured it easier to add more than take some out.) I put in 2 quarts of plain bleach and ran the SWG for about 6 hours (per the directions in the booklet.) I can't get my hands on a Taylor test kit locally, so I'm going to have to order one. I used some test strips, and I got a liquid kit for pH and Chlorine, and from what I can tell, it looks like my chlorine is good. The kids splashed and I have the jet aggitating the water surface and my pH is TA seem to be pretty high (again, that's with the test strip.) I did add about 1 cup of acid last night. I'll take a sample to the pool store and see if they can give me some numbers. Thanks for the help and the warm welcome.

You are right that it is best to go slow with adding cya and it is easier to put more in than take some out. The only way to remove it is to do a partial drain. How did you add it? In the skimmer? Hanging in a sock in front of a return jet?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Watermom

You are right that it is best to go slow with adding cya and it is easier to put more in than take some out. The only way to remove it is to do a partial drain. How did you add it? In the skimmer? Hanging in a sock in front of a return jet?

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Well, I put it in a nylon stocking, but as I was swimming around I noticed that I could rub it around in my hands and it seemed to disolve, so that's what I did. After about 10 minutes of that it had all disolved.

I've got a quick question about "metals"? The swg calls for some copper. Does that count as metal?

I know next to nothing about SWC so I'm gonna let someone else talk to you about SWC issues. Yes, copper is metal but I have no idea how much is recommended, etc. If nobody pops onto this thread to addess that part, repost this issue in the SWC forum. Might be a good idea to go ahead and do that anyways.

ok. so everything is great except the PH which is high. what can i use to lower it. i have intex pool, with the saltwater filter system.

Hi chasamp and welcome! Can I suggest that instead of tacking onto the end of this other poster's thread and problem that you start a new thread for your own situation and let us help you there? It will make it a lot easier to help when we aren't trying to help with two pools within one thread. Thanks!

(Click on the "new thread" button on the upper left above the first thread in this section.)