A cavat for anyone buying a new pool

If you are going to have a new pool installed, yes- price matters, but getting the right contractor will get you a better pool. Go with a contracter who specializes in the type of pool you are getting. When I worked for a company that specialized in 'shotcrete' pools, we also did a number of liner pools -our attitude was ' 'you're paying 1/2 for a pool, you get 1/2-a** job" I'm not proud of the 1/2 a**ed work I did on those pools, but that was how we handled the 'discount' pools. I'm saying this to let anyone who is buying a pool know to go with a company that specializes in whichever type pool they are buying, if you don't, you may get an inferior product.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by waste

Go with a contracter who specializes in the type of pool you are getting.

---

I did exactly that when I decided I wanted fiberglass. There is only 1 fiberglass pool contractor in my area. I checked him out, looked at installations he had done, talked with previous customers. All seemed good.
My pool was supposed to be finished in June 2005. It is still not done. There have been a lot of problems and many are still not fixed althought the pool itself is operational. We have not passed inspection. Yes, he is licensed and insured. While Waste's suggestion is a good one in my experience building a pool is a craps shoot. If the dice are in your favor you win. Most of the problems with my pool stemmed from the fact that the contractor was NOT overseeing his work crews and subcontractors because he was too busy on other jobs. At least that is the excuse he gives me every time he apologizes for the the problems! He just discovered last week that my skimmer was never cemented in and that is why I keep losing water fast.
The right contractor is one that is actively involved in all phases of the pool construction....Just my 2 cents!

Sorry that that was /is your experience. What I was trying to say is that if a shotcrete company says that they 'can' put in an above ground pool, go with the company that does all above grounds (or whichever type you're interested in). In your case, you may not have had the option of getting a fiberglass specialist, I've never installed one and have only worked on 4 in 18 years

What Waterbear says is oh so true. I was fortunate in that the company I used was a small one that I think did about 45 pools a year at the time. The owner was about 60 years old and was the salesman and head construction worker. He operated the backhoe and dug the entire pool himself in about 3 days. The entire project was done in less than 2 weeks for a 20 x 40 IG vinyl pool. This was done in the fall about 8 years ago. They filled the pool and closed it. In the spring they came back and poured the concrete decking around the pool, opened it and showed me how to run everything. It was the best dealing I ever had with a contractor. The told me what and when they would do things and did it better and faster than they said they would.

When I worked for a company in Va., that specialized in 'shotcrete pools', we did install a number of liner pools. I currently work for a company that ONLY does in-ground liner pools. The difference in the product is amaing!

We build our pool with one of the biggest builders in VA and Maryland. Around 400 pools a year.
Everything went OK until the first bad contractor showed up. (Coping and Tile). I had them come out 6 times to replace tiles and coping. Now the pool is leaking and we are not very happy. Also they did not mount the pump correctly with the result that this thing is very loud. One thing after an other comes up and I’m getting very mad. The builder Forman only showed up when a check was to be collected the rest of the time I had to check everything. This is my first pool and I’m sure if I would have known more about it many things would not look like that. Now I have to fight for every little thing to get fixed.

BUT THE SUMMER COMES AND WE WILL SWIM NO MATTER WHAT!!!!!

Guido

I wrote the following long recommendation for my poolbuilder, detailing my process. I spent over 8 months in research and construction and got the pool of my dreams. It was my diligence in finding my builder, Horizon -- in Pearland, Texas (South Houston area) that was key. I think my story might pertain to anyone looking to build his first pool, however...

15 July, 2005


To a prospective pool buyer:

I’m writing this in hopes that buyers considering Horizon Pools will be made aware of just how great their overall customer experience is. Though I am an advertising writer, I have no connection with Horizon Pools outside that of being their extremely happy customer.

The pool business, from my experience, is a loosely regulated one where misinformation abounds and often, “expert” opinions are anything but. I came to this conclusion after a couple of months of online research, talking to other pool owners, etc. There are some pretty horrible stories out there of shoddy construction, oversold promises, misrepresented equipment and broken contracts. It’s enough to discourage even the most enthusiastic shopper.

With this in mind, I was willing to let my pool-buying experience run the course of 9 months to a year, if necessary, to learn all I needed to avoid the problems others had faced. Looking back, I now realize I was very lucky to have found Horizon and to be living within their service area.

I started by choosing area (Clear Lake, South Houston, Webster etc.) builders to interview, with particular attention paid to getting a variety of company types. I chose nationally branded companies, regional ones and small companies that only focused on the Bay Area. I even had a creepy interview with one of those “back-of-a-pickup” contractors, who didn’t have an office, just to be sure I wasn’t prejudging any part of this business.

Horizon’s professionalism and genuine concern for customer service instantly put them ahead of all the others. Melisa, my representative, met me at home, well after business hours, to accommodate my busy schedule. We spent a lot of time talking about what I wanted and clearing up some misconceptions I had about pool ownership. She instantly understood that I had some custom ideas in mind and did not try to force me into any packages or designs that I didn’t want. She explained not only the equipment and purchases required, but why they were needed – in terms that I understood. I never once felt like I was being “sold”. Melisa takes on the role of “consultant” throughout the design process and she is excellent at it.

After sorting through a few other companies over the next four weeks or so – some, who wouldn’t return my calls, forced me to go to their office before they would consider a visit to my home, gave me some hard-sell nonsense, etc. – I was ready to go with Horizon, based on Melisa, alone. One highly reputable Clear Lake company, after forcing me to go into their office for a preliminary visit, promised me an on-site estimate, for which I took time away from work. They never showed! When I called, the receptionist explained that their designer had simply forgotten the appointment and would be happy to reschedule it (if I’d like to take another 2-3 hours away from the office to meet him). I told her to forget it.

Melisa’s colors really came out through the design process. She was incredibly accessible and helpful through a barrage of questions and probably 5-6 major design changes. I’ve heard that many companies charge extra after the second design change. Melisa never even suggested that. Her attitude was “whatever you need to make it right.”

Concurrent with my designing and spec stage, I was doing online research of all the equipment Melisa was specifying. Through this, I learned that pools are not an exact science and applications are not universal across the country. At every turn, Melisa impressed me with how knowledgeably she was able to dispel rumors and/or recommend the best ways to achieve results specifically geared to perform in our hot, humid, Texas climate. What may work for pools in New Jersey or Arizona simply doesn’t work as well here. With Melisa, I have no doubt that my combination of equipment, design and materials has resulted in the lowest-maintenance, best performing pool I could imagine for my yard. She even steered me away from some costly upgrades that might have lined her pockets, purely out of a concern for my pool. From what I’ve heard, that is rare in this business.

Through my research, I found that Horizon specs the highest-quality equipment, vendors and subcontractors for their pools. I can’t tell you how reassuring it was to see an entry on my invoice, go to the Web to look it up, then find page after page of consumer and pool professionals who rated that item highly and reported great results. I found this to be the case with every facet of my design.

For construction, Melisa turns it over to Janie and Elaine for scheduling. I found them to also be quite helpful, even though, by this time we had gotten into Horizon’s “busy season”. Things happened when Janie said they would and kept a really nice pace throughout the process. From the beginning, I was told to expect a realistic 6-8 week build and Horizon hit their mark. Moreover, they did things in the right order and gave plenty of time between steps for concrete to properly set and tile and flagstone to be properly installed and grouted, before trying to rush on to the next step. The workmanship in my pool’s details is the product of craftsmen who evidently care about their work.

On just a couple of occasions there were the smallest of imperfections I noted on my nightly inspections of the site. I was a little embarrassed to even bring them up, because they seemed so minor. In each case, however, they were addressed by Janie and fixed immediately. In one instance, nearing completion, I noticed a small piece of grout had chipped away from flagstone beneath the waterline at the pool entry. Not only did the crew partially drain the water to fix this insignificant spot, but I watched the worker take that opportunity to “blend-in” the repair work very skillfully and even touch up some adjacent areas that didn’t look bad, just so they’d match the repaired spot. From what I’ve read online, this is also uncommon attention to detail.

The pool is like a private, exotic resort. Everything works as designed and the fit and finish of all the components is first-rate. Because of its excellent design, care and maintenance are extremely easy. The landscaping package, which I almost nixed in favor of the $700 credit offered, has turned out to be worth much more than $700. Clearly, Curt, the owner of the company and landscaping guy, also takes pride in his work and sent out a package that I believe to be a bit larger than described in the initial paperwork, presumably to get the job done “right” and exceed my expectations. Cleanup of the site after the job was great, as well. Again, I’ve heard stories of pool companies that leave hazards like rebar, broken concrete and garbage behind on jobs. I saw the Horizon guys walking my yard and picking up individual rocks and debris before they left. In all, they showed a lot of respect for my home, while doing a job that, by nature, tears up a lot of yard.

There are, of course, down sides. I found Horizon to be slightly more expensive than a couple of other companies their size and considerably more than the companies that advertise simple pool packages in the newspaper for really low, all-inclusive rates. I have no reservations about Horizon’s quality, however, and feel that perhaps, in the pool business, you really do “get what you pay for.” My peace of mind through this process has been worth any premium Horizon charges, anyway. Horizon’s package included everything I needed – a water test kit, care equipment and a start-up course from a pool guy. Many companies, I’ve heard, simply leave their customers on their own, once the final check is paid.

Another down side, to some anyway, might be that Horizon seems to be more of a traditional pool builder. If you’re looking for the most cutting-edge equipment and radical new techniques and materials, they may not be the best choice for you. I found that they did have all of the latest equipment available, from salt generators to “reverse-osmosis” sanitation machines, to fiber optics, pre-cast water features and more, but tended toward more traditional setups they advised were more effective in this climate. After two months of ownership I can say that I completely agree with their approach. My pool has a very natural look, with the latest equipment, but remains a mostly traditional setup that is easy to maintain in conditions where my city water supply has a ridiculously high pH and my water temperature routinely goes over 90 degrees. I’m glad Horizon advised me in ways to keep as few variables as possible in my system. My water has, thus far, been nothing but the cleanest, clearest and freshest pool water I have ever seen. Friends and family have all commented on how they can’t believe how clear and bright blue it is.

Horizon only builds a few pools at a time, which seems to be of great benefit to their customers. Curt, Obil and their team work long hours to keep things on schedule and exhibit a high degree of accountability in the work they do. Again, this seems quite rare in this business. More than anything, they are nice people who seem to enjoy what they do. That goes a long way toward building trust and confirming my decision to go with this small Pearland company for my project. If I had it all to do over, I wouldn’t change a thing.

Sincerely,

(Signed)

dal,
That's the way buying and having a pool installed SHOULD be, a happy customer all the way through the process. I've never been on the buying side of pools, nor the selling side, for that matter, but, having installed/ serviced/ repaired well over 1000 pools - I've been exposed to a lot of 'horror stories' (some that our company caused, and lots that we had to go and fix. {this holds true for EVERY pool co., I've worked for - it must be me ;) }). I'm glad that you had such a great experience - all companies should strive to have every customer feel as you do!

Yes, Melisa from Horizon is very professional and knowledgeable . . . in the beginning, but that's where the service ends. We were very impressed and taken by her, however once that contract is signed, you become a nuisance. We should now . . . had our pool built by Horizon 5 years ago and had problems ever since. Problems such as DE draining back in our pool, tiles popping off, unusually-sized drains, uneven pea-gravel decking, uneven slopes, etc. My husband and I took a vacation day at beginning of last summer to personally visit Horizon's office since they wouldn't return our calls for help. We walked in and were snubbed . . . "Oh, you can call so-and-so for that." They didn't even want to look in our records to see what all they had installed. They continually referred us to their sub-contractors. To this day, we have a spa drain uncovered because we cannot find a replacement that fits! We told them we would pay for someone to come look at our system and give us re-training and they just weren't interested.

We received the "free training" after construction and even that was a joke - some guy standing around pointing to things trying to speak english. No diagrams or anything!

And as far as Curt is concerned, he's a constant no-show . . . leaves everything to Melissa and never bothers to shake the hand that's paying him $30K for a whole in the ground.

Curt came out to my home and sat on my patio with me to line out my pool. Then, when I decided to re-design it all at the last minute, he came out again. I was amazed by this, since I sent the guys away the morning they showed up with the Bobcat! I thought for sure I'd pay extra for that redesign, but I didn't.

My free training was conducted by an English speaking person, but he probably depends too much on the pool store. His advise was to take all questions there after he left. however, the pool store he recommended (specifically not the local chain store) has been very good and has never tried to sell me anything I didn't ask for.

As for Melisa, I did everything I could to become a nuisance, to no avail. I changed my layout so many times. I questioned every piece of equipment she specified. I called her 2-3 times a week for five weeks. At every turn, she made time for me and answered my questions to my satisfaction.

This was last year -- perhaps they've turned things around in that time? Also, in looking at their BBB rating, I think I remember seeing only 5-6 complaints over the past 5 years and only one that showed "unresolved". Could that one be yours?

I 'm sorry your experience was so different from mine. I'm now in my second season with a Horizon pool and still couldn't be happier.

They have built two other pools in my neighborhood as well in the last 2 years. Both are doing well so far.

I've got a question I hope someone can answer, like yesterday! I just had a fiberglass pool installed this weekend. I researched the product, including the manufacturer & the pool installer. We elected to DIY in order to save enough to get everything we wanted in the project. After muddling through many, many setbacks - excavators who backed out at the last minute, one after another and a crane that showed up with a boom approx. 15' too short, we finally got the pool in. Only problem is . . . . . it's not level. there's a difference of 3.5" between the shallow & deep ends. I spoke to the 2 installers at length during the final stages, as the level difference became increasingly evident. I insisted on speaking to the owner before relinquishing the final check. They all basically told me the same thing - it's not uncommon for a fiblerglass pool to be off like that. That you can compensate for it by building up a "tile wall" on the "off" end to make up for the difference. The water line tile goes over that & you're not supposed to even notice when done. Only problems I see with that solution are: How much tile do you think THAT's going to add to the project? AND what happens when the shallow end - the one that is 3.5" HIGHer than the deep end - is kept full enough for the spa jets & skimmer? Seems like the deep end will get flooded, which may result in water seeping down between the outer wall of the shell & the earth below the concrete deck! . I'm thinking that this is NOT a good thing. I don't want to jump to any conclusions without the facts. My deck is scheduled for deck & form next week, but I'm really feeling like the pool needs to be drained, lifted & reset in a more level base before finishing the project. Anyone have any thoughts? Thanks

I have a fiberglass pool, and the pool is level. I would go back to the people that excavated it, and find out what went wrong. I never heard of "building a tile wall to compensate" that's rediculous! I would make sure it is fixed before you do anything around it - even if you have to get it raised by a crane again - because if you don't fix it now - you will never be able to fix it, and a good fiberglass pool should last a lifetime. I have mine for 7 years, and it is just as good as the first year I had it put in. Don't let them talk you out of having it fixed. Of course this is my own opinion, I don't know the leagal aspects of what you can do. Best of luck, and stick to your guns!

I fully agree with mbars' assesment of the situation, get it right before! the deck goes down. Speaking of which, aren't you rushing the deck? If you pour it next week, without proper settling/ compaction, the 3.5" won't be noticed by anyone trying to get across the cracked and sunken deck ;) I can appreciate that you want the project done NOW, but this is a lifetime investment and getting everything done correctly will save you tons of headaches in the years to come.

Congrats on the new pool! :cool:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by waterbear

The right contractor is one that is actively involved in all phases of the pool construction....Just my 2 cents!

---

Amen Sista' ;)

It is amazing to me, the differences two different people can have using the same pool company. We are in the process of having our first pool built and so far it isn't going very well at all. Three weeks in and the only thing that has been done is the excavation and steel. With everything they've been running behind schedule. We did not go into this lightly, did everything a person is supposed to do, ie: get several quotes, check BBB, make sure there's a super, check references, etc. We even checked their contractors license numbers out. The company we went with had glowing recommendations, people were so happy with this pool company they'd use em again....pools were done ahead of schedule and whatnot, never behind schedule. They don't even have any subcontracting, do everything in house. Yet, here we are, waiting and waiting for workers to show. It has been nearly two weeks since they finished the steel and have yet to start the plumbing. Whenever we talk to the lady who handles the office she tells us, "I am sorry but we got held up on another job, but you are next in line." They were nine days late starting the dig, and now they're a week late for plumbing. I can only cross my fingers and hope they show up next week. They are members of Aqua Tech, and we thought that would mean something, we thought we'd be getting quality. But now, we just can't help but wonder if we chose the right company. :(

Pretty ironic that others had such good experiences with them.

Luvtlee,

I don't think your pool company is all that bad - 9 days late to start the dig? That can happen really easily since they don't subcontract. You have a couple of people quit or get sick and it can put a small builder that does everything inhouse back a week and a half.

Personally - I have had friends that the pool builder wouldn't come out to start the plumbing without being paid another 20%, and then they wouldn't come out to do the electrical without another check - it took them 15 months to get done and they never came back to clean-up.

A few weeks late I would expect from any builder - even the best ones. Who knows maybe they ran into something unexpected during a dig for another customer - you wouldn't want them to run from your house if they hit a sewer line because they promised another customer they would be there tomorrow.

This is true, Simmons, it is nice to know that they don't just leave behind their customers to get to the next on time. A few weeks behind schedule won't be bad, compared to the horror stories I've heard from some. We're just concerned that ours is going to turn into one of those horror stories. For instance, our designer highly recommended the Dichlor system and told us that it costs the same as the SWG. We went Dichlor since he so highly recommened it, and he told us that if we changed our minds and wanted to go back to the SWG that it would be no problem at all since they cost the same, approximately $1600. Well, now our super is telling us that if we want to switch to the SWG it's going to cost us an extra $1200. Where is the integrity any more? Why are we being told one thing from one person and something different from another? It's incredibly frustrating.

I would talk to the person that you originally got the quote from about switching. Other buyers be aware that construction companies (don't know if this also applies to pool companies) usually charge more for work on a change order than under the original projec. This may be because they have to deliver again to the job site or change the plans and resubmit to the county or they just figure they've got you.

Hope everything works out. We are about 1 1/2 weeks behind. You can see my "neighbors" post in off topic - they have been a pain. The first inspector was late, we had a lot of rain and a cave-in that needed to be repaired.

I don't even know how many weeks behind we are now. :( Best guess, about 3-4 weeks behind. They dug our pool on June 1st and 2nd, and here it is the 21st of July and we just had our gunite completed. They haven't even started on tile, decking or coping. The contract completion date is July 24th (3 days from now). We aren't even getting a big pool done, it's a rather small "pool only" job. Originally they said that it would be done in 6 weeks, 10 weeks at most, due to it being a small job. Here we are 7 1/2 weeks into the project and no end in site yet. How it normally works with this company on our job is they do one day of work and about 10-14 days of nothing.

Anyway, they're a member of "Aqua Tech", that is one reason we hired them (it sounded good), but we are now wondering just what that means? Does anyone here know anything about them? Anyone that had any personal experiences with a member of Aqua Tech, and anyone have any advice? Thanks in advance from this newbie.