Algae Problem with Cloudy Water

This is my 3rd year with the pool and by far the most frustrating. I can't tell you how much money I've spent trying to get it right only for it to look like it did before I started dumping stuff in.

I live in central NY and the pool gets sunlight from 8 am until 8pm. Its a mountain lake shape and holds approximately 24,000 gallons. I have a salt system and as of today have only used strips for water chemistry and took a sample once a few weeks ago to my dealer which really didn't do much.

Today I checked the chlorine with the strip and it read 0. My salt system was reading add 160lbs so I went to the store and got the salt and 5 gallons of liquid chlorine and dumped it all in.

I have been brushing more than once a day and usually vacuum in the morning. The water never seems to be crystal clear and when I brush I always seem to get the green cloud as the brush moves across the floor.

The guy at the store said the one 5 gallon jug should be good to shock my pool. I said it was reading 0 so wouldn't the one jug just bring it to normal and I should do two and he said no. So I'm a little confused on the whole shock thing. It was 12.99 for 5 gallons. Is this a good price or should I buy bleach from the store and what kind?

Anyways I know I need a good test kit and post some results, so can someone post a link to the ones on amazon so I can support the forum.

Is there anything I can do while I wait for the kit?

My latest readings, from a strip, I know but better than nothing:

FC: 3/6 Bromine
PH: maybe 7.8 or higher
Alklinity seems fine between 80-120
Hardness seems around 200
CYA 30-50

Pete In NY

Alright I really need some people to look at this post and help me. I don't think you get the views in this newbie forum. Anyway I left the pump running all night and the salt system on boost. Checked this morning and I have almost no chlorine in the pool again. Something might be wrong with my salt system or something is eating up the chlorine. Like I said in the previous post it was probably 0 yesterday and I added 5 gallons of liquid, but that seems to be all gone or close to it. My CYA was high for the first time at around 100+, and I can see green/brown algae on the floor already.

I order the k2006c from amazon through someones link in their signature, but won't be here until next week.

Please someone help.

Hi bmlocal,

First off, you should probably go ahead and turn the SWCG off until you get the water cleared up. The SWCG is not capable of producing the amount of chlorine you need in a short enough time, and you're just wearing out the cell by trying.You'll need to manually chlorinate the water. Do you know what percentage of chorine is in the chlorine jugs you're buying? If it's 12%, then each 1/2 gallon you add should raise your FC by 2.5 ppm, so you can use that as a guide to know how much to add, once we know your CYA level. If you see brown/green algae in the pool, then you're going to have to kill it off to eliminate your chlorine demand. For now, until you know your CYA level, I would add 2 gallons of the chlorine nightlyto at least keep the problem from getting any worse until we can determine your true shock level.

Second, you are going to have to get a good kit in order to clear this up. Strips simply aren't reliable enough to help. You are going to need a kit that can accurately measure free and combined chlorine--the Taylor kit will help this project immensely.

Third, you're going to need an accurate CYA level before you even can begin to know how high your 'shock" level is. You report a CYA of 30-50 on one day, and then 100+ the next. That's not nearly close enough to work with. If your local WalMart sells the hth 6-way drop kit, it has a CYA test and enough reagents for 2-3 tests in it. You can get that and at least test for CYA until your Taylor kit gets here, so we know how much chlorine you need to be adding.

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Alright Just got back from Walmart with 12 jugs of the 6% Great Value Bleach at $2.98 ea. and the 6 way HTH kit. Is this a good price?

It seems a little cheaper than the 5 gallons from the pool store but not sure if there's was 6 or 12%. I'm holding off doing anything until someone on here tells me to because I'm sick of spending money.

Anyways did some tests:

TC: The kit goes to 5 but it was darker than that by a little meaning 6
pH: The kit goes to 8.2 but the color seemed darker by a little meaning 8.3-8.5
CYA: wife said about 46

Turned the purifier off on the salt system and now I'm just filtering. Should I brush, vacuum, to filter or to waste? I'm below half of the skimmer now so if I vacuum to waste I will probably need to add water to keep pump running.

Waiting for some help. Thanks for the help so far.

You WILL want to keep your pool at shock level for your CYA, but if CYA is 30, that would be 15, and if CYA is 100, that would be 25, and with a vinyl pool, if you don't want to fade it, that's important. (My liner is old so I don't give hoot if it fades).
No point in wearing out your SWG trying to clear your pool, but a constant level of chlorine at shock level is necessary.

Carl

Just called my local pool store and they said the 5 gallons was the 12.5% liquid chlorine. So that seems like a pretty good deal I'm guessing for 12.99.

Just tried a strip after vacuuming and swimming a little to see what the FC reading was. It shows around 4.

So hopefully you guys have all the info you need to let me know how much of the 18 gallons of 6% I need to dump in. Not sure how I would monitor it for I have nothing that goes to around 15ppm. The test strips do show up to 10 so maybe a darker color than that.

Found the bleach calculator.. Typed in all of the info and it told me I need to add 16.7L of bleach to raise my ppm by 11 from 4 to reach 15. My pool is around 24,000 gallons which is about 90,850L. So that would be 3 of the jugs I got from Walmart. This thread might have some comments before this gets posted so I'm waiting until later tonight to do this so I can see what you guys think. The water does look a lot better from the 5 galllons of 12% yesterday but still cloudy. Maybe it just needs a little more time but I still would like to shock it to make sure.

"Mountain Lake" is not a geometric shape, or at least not one I've ever heard of -- but if your pool is more or less a rectangle, your volume is more likely to be MORE than 30K gallons, than it is less than 30K. With algae, too much chlorine is much better than too little.

So . . . I'll assume a PF of 3.5 (~35,000 gallons) rather than 5 (24,000 gallons). With a PF of 3.5, a gallon of bleach will increase your FC by 0.5 lbs Cl2 equiv/gal 6% bleach x 3.5 or 1.75. So you need evening doses of 8 gallons of 6% bleach.

You can test with an cheap OTO kit -- you can skip the evening dose, IF your OTO reading in the EVENING is DARK yellow with an orange tint. Otherwise, 8 gallons of 6% bleach EVERY evening till there's no trace of algae left. After the 2nd dose, BRUSH the pool carefully.

BUT . . . if you find that your chlorine has NOT dropped after a full day of sun, THEN we know your CYA is very high. And in that case you need to NOT skip, but go ahead and take your chlorine level into the 30 - 40 ppm range (orange with an OTO kit), and keep it there, until you get your K2006.

By the way, once your chlroine goes above 10, your phenol red pH test results won't be reliable, so if your pH needs major adjustment fix it now. But, if it's between 7.0 and 8.0, you can worry about that, later.

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s...tures/pool.jpg

Here is my pool. The men who set up the salt system have 24,000 listed in the menu so I went by that.

Alright I will wait until evening to check chlorine again. I have the HTH 6 from walmart so that is TC . Your saying if it shows higher than what the kit can show I'm good through the night? Should I leave the filter running all night with the salt system running? I have the purifier running now at about 60% on level 2 just to maintain really what I have. The water does look better but I did have to vacuum up what looked like brown stuff scattered all over the floor of the pool this afternoon.

The brown stuff on the pool bottom is probably dead algae, which indicates that you're making progress. Keep your filter running but turn the SWCG off so you're not wearing it out. Use the bleach/liquid chlorine to keep your chlorine up, and follow Pooldoc's directions...
"You can test with an cheap OTO kit -- you can skip the evening dose, IF your OTO reading in the EVENING is DARK yellow with an orange tint. Otherwise, 8 gallons of 6% bleach EVERY evening till there's no trace of algae left. After the 2nd dose, BRUSH the pool carefully.".

That's a beautiful pool!

Just checked and we were at the top of the walmart kit for TC which was 5. So I just dumped in 8 gallons of bleach and ill let it run overnight and check it when I get up.

Now the kit I have only shows TC up to 5 so in the morning am I looking for the DARK yellow with a little orange look? If it is low do I add more in the morning or another 8 tomorrow night? Do I leave the salt system off all day? Do I check the TC during the day or just again tomorrow night?

You can force your OTO kit to read higher with a dilution method. You do lose accuracy with each dilution, but it is better than nothing until your K-2006 arrives.

Testing Without a Good Kit

If your CYA is around 50, you'll want to keep your chlorine level around 15ppm. Go ahead and test it again in the morning and add more bleach to bring it back up to 15. Each gallon will add approximately 2ppm. You can use that as a reference to help you figure out how much to add when you test. You can test as often as you have time for but at least twice per day and each time, take the chlorine back up to 15.

Run your pump 24/7 while you are working to clear this up but leave your SWCG off.

Hopefully, you'll see a big improvement in the morning.

Water looks a lot better this morning. Have some vacuuming to do of the dead algae. If this is alright to do? I do not have any distilled water to test with the kit I have to get a higher reading. I did the test the normal way and it was medium orange. So I'm not sure where this puts me on my way to 15. I did a test strip which has FC but doing 2 gave 2 different readings but both were under 10 (not very accurate). If I don't hear from someone soon I will dump 3 gallons in which should be close.

I'm also confused on the FC and TC. My Walmart kit shows TC. Don't I want to know my FC, and how do I convert what the test is showing to FC?

Interpreting colors of OTO testing: dark yellow (~10 ppm), orangey-yellow (~15) to orange (~30 ppm) to brown (> 60 ppm).

OTO kits only show TC. Your Taylor K-2006 will let you show FC and CC. FC + CC = TC.

You won't know FC and CC (FC+CC=TC) until you get the FAS-DPD test (in the K-2006).
Stick with the OTO, keep it in the Dark Yellow - Orange range. Ignore the Guess-strips.
You've got the green on the run but you won't know your endpoint until you get the K-2006.

Alright its 2:20 pm on Sat and just got done vacuuming. Pool looks a lot better than yesterday. Checked TC again and was very Orange. I did add 3 gallons this morning just to be safe so I think its holding somewhat. I will check this evening and if still orange I will not add any but if it dropped into the yellow again I will dump another 8 gallons in for the night and check in the morning.

I emailed the company who made my pool to ask them the gallons it holds so hopefully hear back. I called the local pool store who installed the pool to see and he checked a book and told me it was 24,400. Its a 22x44 Mountain lake, picture on previous page. So I hope the higher estimates of 35,000 gallons by PoolDoc won't throw this whole project off to bad.

Quick question.. Can we swim in the pool today or is the chlorine just to high? I'm not even sure the exact number but I'm guessing 15 or higher.

It won't hurt people to swim in a pool with chlorine level of 15 and a CYA of 50 but you might want to wear old swimsuits. Also, if it is cloudy, keep a constant head count. Don't want any tragedies from someone having a problem in the pool and not being able to be seen due to the cloudiness of the water.

I'm still showing orange on my test, so it seems to be holding. I checked the cya and it seems to be 55-60. So for now I take it I can not add any for tonight and check it in the morning?

I swam today and the water seems clear until you go under water and visibility is not that far. Hopefully be better tomorrow.

Yes, you can skip the evening dose.

Be sure you are running your pump 24/7 while trying to clear the water and backwash the filter when the pressure rises 8-10 psi over your clean filter pressure. Is the pressure rising by the way?

Not really. My system usually runs around 20 psi and its still right there. I didn't have a real bad case of algae just enough though where I couldn't get rid of it permanently because I did not shock right. Pool is looking a TONS better. So if I'm orange in the morning go ahead and just run the SWCG like normal and wait for my kit to post full test results? If I'm not orange that means the chlorine was still fighting something and continue to maintain the orange throughout the day again?

Keep the SWCG off while you are clearing up the pool. Using it to superchlorinate to shock level will greatly decrease your cell life. Wait until everything is clear and then turn it on for maintenance doses of chlorine.

You want to keep the chlorine high until the water clears. Has anybody talked to you about doing an overnight chlorine loss test? (This thread is getting long and I don't want to take the time to re-read the whole thing right now to find out.) If so, how long ago did you do it and what were the results?

I shocked last night 8 gallons of 6%. I checked in the morning and it was still orange but I put in 3 gallons just to be safe for the day. Checked this evening and it was still orange. So If its orange in the morning it will be over 24 hrs of shock levels and it would of held a full night without dropping. I won't be able to check anything with accurate readings until the 2006c comes. I think I'm on the right track though. Thanks a million.

I'd keep the FC at shock level (yellow-orange to orange) until you can get an accurate measure of FC and CC. Your endpoint for shocking is loss of less than 1ppm FC between sunset and sunrise and less than 0.5ppm CC. We generally reccomend maintaining shock level an additional day for good measure.

Well checked it this morning and its still the same shade of Orange as last night. I'll continue to monitor it today and keep it orange. I've been adjusting the swcg so much before I started this I'm not sure where to put that when I start using that again. I guess Ill just have to experiment with it and keep track of the chlorine.

Sounds like you are finally getting it under control. Great job!

Mae West: Where've you been all my life, big boy?
W.C. Fields: Oswego!

Just remember, chlorine will KILL the algae, but it won't CLEAR the cloudiness from dead algae particles.

What does your pool look like, at present?

It actually looks pretty good. A little better than yesterday. I could see the bottom of the deep end yesterday but its a little clearer today. I will jump in later today and look underwater with the goggles. Yesterday my visibility underwater wasn't very good but better than the day before by a little. I just vacuumed again this morning and did a brush. Less stuff to vacuum than yesterday.

Afternoon check.. Now its a very dark yellow. pH is 7.5-7.8ish. Haven't added anything today and cell is off.

Time for more bleach. When do you expect the k-2006?

Hasn't even shipped yet. I'll dump 3 gallons in now then 5 at dusk for the night.

Pool has been great. Nice and clear. Still waiting for the kit but it has been shipped. I've checked the TC the last two nights and then again both mornings and it is the same each time, so it seems to be holding. I also have been running the SWCG and have turned it off both nights along with turning off the filter and pump.

When I look at the pool in the morning it is clear as could be then I start the pump early in the morning. After a few hours I get some build up in the same areas all the time which looks like a brownish/yellowish something. I'm not sure after turning on the pump, stuff is being blown back into the pool after sitting all night. I'm not sure what it is but it always seems to happen after the pump starts running for the day. Any ideas? Will post full tests when I receive the kit.

texture, color and feel should ID the brown stuff -- for example, gritty may be sand; grayish tan, extremely fine and hard to touch is probably dead algae.

Pool has been looking absolutely stunning. Did some quick tests with the new kit.

I did the FC yesterday and had a reading somewhere between 15-20 ppm and 0 on the CC. Still hovering around that today so I lowered the output on the SWCG a little.

pH: 7.7 noticed in the video they had 2 rows of pink and my kit has one so sort of a guesstimate.
TA: 120? turned pink and stopped. Watch video and seemed he put a drop or 2 more to make sure which would raise it a little.
CYA 44

Glad it worked out for you -- hope things are still going well with your pool.

Well I have been doing a lot of vacuuming and getting some settling in a lot of areas and I thought I was getting algae again. The water was not as clear as before. I tested last night and had FC 6.5 at 40 CYA and this morning I checked it was 6ppm. So I guess I don't have a algae problem. We have a new house going in next door and have several huge dirt piles next to house. I'm hoping this is only dirt settling in the pool and making it cloudy. I tried to swim down and investigate and it just disappears into the water when you brush it.

Well even though I only lost .5 overnight it is algae.

My wife took a sample to school and looked at it under the microscope. Last week I did notice my FC was 2.5 so maybe it came back sometime then. I still have been adjusting the SWCG to get it where it was and must have had the purifier to low.

So it looks like a shock is in my future in the next couple days, whenever I get a chance.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bmlocal175

So it looks like a shock is in my future in the next couple days, whenever I get a chance.

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Tonight would be a VERY good time to "get a chance". You can be sure that otherwise, the algae will be "taking their chance"! If it 'blooms' it will me much harder (by multiples, not %) to clean up.

For a ~22,000 gallon pool, 6 gallons of PLAIN 6% bleach added in the evening would be a good dose . . .