Inherited a pond, trying to turn it into a pool!

My other half and I have recently bought a house, and inherited a +/-45k gal in-ground vinyl-lined pool. It wasn't opened last season, the cover had fallen in, and we have a season's worth of leaves (several large oaks on the property) and other accumulated organic matter in there. It's very brown!

Had a local contractor out to open it this week. The DE filter has been hooked up, the pool's been shocked, and algaecide added. The filter pressure rose 10lb in 10mins, but he recommended I leave it running overnight. It rose another 10lb (to 30psi), and all water flow seemed to have stopped. Since then I've been backwashing, cleaning the "fingers", and replacing the DE at least once daily as time permits. Planning to dedicate the weekend to making some progress, since so far there appears to be very little...

...which is how I find myself here. I saw lots of good info on the forum, so I've signed up. Of course now, I can't get at any of the info I had before, so rather than continuing to lurk it's time to speak up...

I'm a complete pool novice, but from what I've managed to learn here, the plan of attack is as follows:

Test the water (I have the recommended kit(s)).
Add generic bleach to get the pH to between 7.2 and 8.0
Keep working over the filter, including cleaning the fingers, as often as necessary
Repeat until the water starts to clear - re-testing and re-dosing about once every four hours.

I know there are a lot of leaves in there. We've tried to remove as many as we can with rake and leaf master, but the water is so murky we've no idea how many there are left. What I'm really trying to achieve is enough clarity in the water to be able to see what I'm doing to get the rest out!

Is there anything else I should be doing, or any of the above I shouldn't do?

Thanks in advance.
Mark

Hi Mark and welcome! We need you to post a complete set of current water testing results for us to take a look at. Then, somebody here can better advise you.

The generic bleach is not to keep the pH in range. It is your source of chlorine. With this large of a pool, you're gonna need lots so go ahead to Walmart and load a buggy up with bleach. Ignore the strange looks you'll get from other shoppers! If they ask, tell them your clothes are extra dirty!! You might also pick up a couple boxes of 20 Mule Team Borax (laundry aisle at Walmart) which will be used to raise pH if necessary.

Post with some numbers and we'll go from there. Again, welcome. Glad to have you here with us.

Thanks Watermom. Results as follows:

K2006C Test Kit

Chlorine
10ml Sample - 2 doses R0870 resulted in no color change = no Free Chlorine
5 drops R0003 gave a very slight pink color.
1 drop R0871 cleared the water = 0.5ppm Combined Chlorine

pH
5 drops R0004 in 44ml turned the water yellow = pH below 7.0
10 drops R0006 = pH 7.0
12 drops = pH 7.2
14 drops = pH 7.4
15 drops = pH 7.6
17 drops = pH 7.8
18 drops = pH 8.0

Total Alkalinity
1 drop R0009 turned the solution red = 10ppm Total Alkalinity

Calcium Hardness
7 drops R0012 turned the solution blue = 70ppm Calcium Carbonate

Cyanuric Acid
The dot never disappeared = less than 30ppm Cyanuric Acid

Samples taken from the deep end by the skimmers, at arm's depth.

Pool was shocked Tuesday evening - I guess this isn't a good set of results?! Any advice on next steps much appreciated!

Thanks in advance,
Mark

Most critical is to get the PH up above 7.0 ASAP. Add a couple of boxes of 20 Mule Team Borax (laundry aisle at Walmart) at a time slowly into the skimmer, while the pump is running, breaking up any clumps. Wait a couple hours, retest the pH and redose until you get the pH between 7.2-7.8. Once the pH starts to move, you may want smaller doses of Borax. You also need to raise the alk. Add 4 lb. doses of baking soda at a time. Over the next few days, continue adding baking soda until you get the alk somewhere between 80-120. (By the way, it is ok to add bleach, borax and baking soda within minutes of each other.)

In this big of a pool, it is going to take a lot of bleach. Every gallon (4 quarts) of 6% bleach will add about 1.3ppm of chlorine. You need to shock the pool back up to about 12ppm. Go ahead and add 8 gallons slowly in front of a return jet. Test as many times per day as you can -- at least two -- and more often than that is even better and will clear the pool that much faster. Each time, add enough to get back to 12ppm. When you get to where you can go from sundown one evening til sunup the next morning without losing more than 1ppm of cl, then you can let the cl drift down and keep it between 3-6ppm all the time. While you are clearing it, run the pump 24/7 and backwash the filter as needed. Lots of bleach! Scoop out as much debris as you can.


At that time, you'll want to add some CYA. Sometimes it is labeled as stabilizer or conditioner. Check the ingredients and if it says cyanuric or isocyanuric acid, it is the right stuff. Add about 6 lbs. slowly to the skimmer. Run the pump 24/7 for the next 4 days while it is dissolving in the filter. Don't test for it for a week and then when you do retest, post the reading so we can help you decide if you need to tweak it any. Until that week passes and you get a CYA reading, you'll probably have to add bleach at least twice per day. Each time, take the cl up to about 6. After a week, you should be able to test and dose in the evenings only.

If your pool store sells liquid chlorine in 10 or 12.5% concentration of sodium hypochlorite, use that if the price is good. It will save you from having to buy so many jugs of bleach. Let us know if you find any and what the strength is and we can calculate dosages for you. Another option since your CYA is also low is to use dichlor shock instead of bleach for awhile. It will add CYA as well as chlorine. If you use it, you won't want to add any CYA separately. But, you'll need to keep an eye on the CYA level and when it gets somewhere around 40-50, quit using it and switch to either bleach or liquid pool store chlorine. One other thing, dichlor is acidic, so get the pH raised before you start shocking the pool and monitor the pH. PH CANNOT be checked accurately when the cl is over about 10ppm -- assuming you are using the K-2006. With other kits, it can't be tested accurately when the cl is over 5ppm.

Good for you for getting the good kit. That is going to make this a lot easier. I know this is a lot to absorb. Hope this helps. Come back with further questions and keep us posted with your progress.

Excellent, thank you for the advice. The water chemistry was a little intimidating to start with, but once I'd worked it out it wasn't so bad. I feel much better knowing I can actually measure these things, rather than just blindly throwing chemicals at it. One question before the fun starts - when you say "while the pump is running", do you mean running through the filter, or recirculating? I would guess running through the filter.

The problem with that is the rate at which the filter clogs completely. I've been adding one scoop (as opposed to the recommended-by-the-pool-guy 2-3) DE to the skimmer after any backwash to try to keep the water flowing a little longer. 2-3 scoops sends the pressure shooting quickly up to 20psi above the level it sits at without DE, at which point there seems to be no perceptible flow of water into the skimmers or out of the jets. It'll go +10psi in a matter of ten to fifteen minutes, at which point there is still some very weak flow, but it'll hit +20psi within half an hour, at which point the water doesn't appear to be moving at all. I can keep on top of that over a weekend, but work gets in the way during the week. Do I need to keep the water moving through the filter for the above to do what it needs to do, or will recirculating (or even stagnation) still do the trick?

M

I'm not the equipment expert around here and can't really help you with your DE filter. (I have sand.) If you have to put it on recirculate for today while you wait to get the filter working properly, I guess that is better than nothing. Go ahead and get some Borax in there ASAP and then some bleach. Hopefully, someone will come along who can help with your filter. Chlorine can kill the algae but you're gonna have to have a working filter to get rid of the dead algae.

Understood. The filter works just fine, I think - too well, really! I believe it's clogging quickly because of the amount of material it's trying to remove, rather than any fault. Unless I hear otherwise I'll just run it on recirculate for today while hopefully the Borax and bleach start taking effect, then run it through the filter over the weekend when I can be there to keep it cleaned and the water flowing. Thanks again.

Live algae clogs DE filters almost instantly -- the solution here is to kill the algae. It will then filter more normally.

If the algae is not dying at 10 ppm, take the levels to 15 ppm, and then 20. You've got to kill the algae, in order for your filter to work.

Ben

It's all starting to make sense, thanks!

OK, so yesterday afternoon I added 8lb Borax, 8.4 gal (6x1.4Gal bottles) 6% Bleach, and 4lb baking soda. I didn't get a chance to test again until this morning, when I had 3ppm Free Chlorine, pH still below 7.0, and 40ppm Total Alkalinity. An hour ago I added another 6 gal 6% bleach, 8lb Borax and 4lb Baking Soda, and will test again in another hour.

Meanwhile I've managed to pick up some 12.5% Sodium Hypochlorite - is it reasonable to assume that 4gal 12.5% is roughly equivalent to 8.4gal 6%, so I should halve the volume to add the same dose?

I'll be testing and dosing every couple of hours today, tomorrow, and probably Monday, hoping for some decent progress!

How can I tell if the algae is dying at 10, 15, 20ppm? Will the water clear, or will dead algae just turn it a different color until it's filtered out?

Thanks!
Mark

Each gallon of 12.5% should add 2.8ppm, assuming it truly is 12.5%. You never know. Glad you found it. It will mean few empty jugs. You'll be able to tell when the algae is dying as your water will be cloudy and grayish instead of green. Keep working on the pH. Keep us posted how things are going.

When I tested this afternoon the pH was still low, so I've added another 8lb Borax. Total Alkalinity was up to 60ppm, so another 4lb Baking Soda has gone in.

I'm not convinced I'm testing for chlorine properly. When I tested this morning, the first drop of 871 cleared the solution. By the time I'd made a note and was about to start the next test, the solution had regained a slight pink tinge. Assuming that I hadn't measured all of it yet, I kept going.

When I tested this afternoon I was careful to wait a minute or so between drops, and each time the tinge returned. It wasn't much in the way of coloration, but I could see that the drop of 871 was clearer than the solution around it before mixing, so I kept going. I stopped when my FC count got over 15ppm, since I don't think I've added enough bleach to hit that sort of level, especially if the bleach deteriorates in the sunlight.

I retested the chlorine once I'd completed the other tests, and stopped at the point where the returning tinge seemed to be the same color as before. That gave me about 5ppm, which seems more sensible, so I've added 2gal of the 12.5% (which has 12.5% Sodium Hypochlorite listed in the active ingredients, so I'm hoping it's the real deal!).

So my silly question of the afternoon is, just what does "clear" mean in this context? When the solution first clears completely, when it stays clear after mixing, or when (if) it stays clear a minute or so after mixing? I never was much good at chemistry...

Hi Mark;

=> You can assume that you'll need about 1/2 as much 12% bleach as you did 6% bleach.
=> Dead algae is not green. It typically will go from green to grayish green to a greenish gray to bluish gray. The pool is not usually blue till it's clear. Dead algae filters MUCH better than live algae.

Thanks Ben, I think I get that. It's water clarity when testing (specifically for chlorine) that I'm trying to get my arms around now. I don't want to muck up bleach dosage because of bad testing technique.

Appreciate the input (and patience, you must have answered these hundreds of times before!).

Mark

Quote:

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Originally Posted by barma16

...So my silly question of the afternoon is, just what does "clear" mean in this context? When the solution first clears completely, when it stays clear after mixing, or when (if) it stays clear a minute or so after mixing? I never was much good at chemistry...

---

I heard that letting the sample sit after adding the 5 drops of R-0003 reagent to test for combined chlorine it will revert back to pink. When I test for FC with the R-0871 my sample turns completely clear (after so many drops)--even the undissolved crystals of the R-0870 DPD powder. My tests are right on the mark when I test before and after I add a known quantity of bleach according to the Pool Calculator.

May I ask why you wait a minute after each drop of the R-9871 reagent? I add a drop, swirl a second or two and add my next drop and so on. Sometimes I'll add up to 6 drops in rapid succession because I know that I have at least 3ppm in the pool and then swirl. Maybe I'm doing it wrong.

There are videos on the Taylor website that show FAS-DPD test procedure - might help to see.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Yeggim

May I ask why you wait a minute after each drop of the R-9871 reagent? I add a drop, swirl a second or two and add my next drop and so on. Sometimes I'll add up to 6 drops in rapid succession because I know that I have at least 3ppm in the pool and then swirl. Maybe I'm doing it wrong.

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Most likely I'm doing it wrong! I started waiting after I had a sample turn clear, then turn pink again while I was making notes (Just with the 871, still testing for FC). I'm really on day 1.5 of trying to get the hang of this, so I'm learning as I go. I just made an assumption that the pink coming back was a sign I hadn't accounted for all of it. Sounds like my FC is probably much lower than I thought...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BigDave

There are videos on the Taylor website that show FAS-DPD test procedure - might help to see.

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Excellent, I'll check them out, thanks!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BigDave

There are videos on the Taylor website that show FAS-DPD test procedure - might help to see.

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Good idea. I forgot about those.
http://www.taylortechnologies.com/pr..._slideshow.asp

barma16, go to the "catagories" on the left and choose "POOL/SPA"

Quote:

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Originally Posted by barma16

Most likely I'm doing it wrong! I started waiting after I had a sample turn clear, then turn pink again while I was making notes (Just with the 871, still testing for FC). I'm really on day 1.5 of trying to get the hang of this, so I'm learning as I go. I just made an assumption that the pink coming back was a sign I hadn't accounted for all of it. Sounds like my FC is probably much lower than I thought...

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Hey Mark, you're doing great. That's a big pool you took on and even though it's a bigger swamp than a lot of pools, the principals are the same. You have to kill everything in the water with chlorine and then it has to be filtered out.

Try and keep it simple. Get a solid free chlorine test number.
Next test your Ph. If your free chlorine is 10 or below you can pretty much trust the Ph reading and make adjustments based on those readings. If your free chlorine is high and your ph is in range, or a little high, leave it alone. High chlorine will skew your ph reading toward the high side and if it reads low and you have a solid free chlorine test that reads 15 or above, throw a couple boxes of Borax in just as a precaution.

Now, on to the kill zone. Bleach. You know first hand that you're gonna need a lot. Don't be caught short. Stock up on that 12.5% stuff. I used a little over 5 gallons of 12.5% on my pool and it's 1/6 the size of yours and my water was barely green.

Assuming we have your test problems sorted out, I'll bet your FC is low or gone. If that's the case, dump 5 gallons of the 12.5% bleach in. Test an hour later after it's circulated. Odds are that it will get eaten up fast. Bring it back up to 15ppm. Test again and repeat as often as you're able. If your swamp is eating it up as fast as you can pour it, jack it up to 20ppm.

While you're feeding the monster swamp the chlorine it needs, you have to filter it. DE filters are very good at this. As you kill the algae it will settle to the bottom and little by little the water will clear. As your pump circulates the water and filters out the suspended particles, you should be able to see deeper and deeper as time goes by.

Don't kill your motor and pump. If your filter fills up in a few hours, you cant run it unattended. Let that stuff settle. Don't rile it up. Once you can see the bottom, you can vacuum to waste if water replacement is not a problem.

You need to keep your water circulating as much as possible. If your filter is clogging up quick, back off on the amount of DE. Use a little less than the manual calls for.

Oh boy!

My testing technique was completely wrong. All my chlorine results have been massively overstated. As of this morning I have about 0.6ppm FC, and 2 gallons of 12.5% left. The pool store doesn't open until 10 :(.

pH is 7.4, and I've got 100ppm Total Alkalinity. Is it worth adding CYA at this point to stabilize the bleach and avoid too much UV breakdown? There's none in there at the moment - levels were <30ppm when tested Friday, and I haven't added any.

Also, before discovering this site, my local pool store sold me some "Turbo Shock" powder which is 78% Calcium Hypochlorite. 5lbs was $25, but it did make a (color) difference quickly. This may be a sacrilegious question here, but would that sort of concentration help me any as a kick-start to getting my FC levels up?

Thanks,
Mark

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Yeggim

...You have to kill everything in the water with chlorine and then it has to be filtered out...

...While you're feeding the monster swamp the chlorine it needs, you have to filter it. DE filters are very good at this. As you kill the algae it will settle to the bottom and little by little the water will clear. As your pump circulates the water and filters out the suspended particles, you should be able to see deeper and deeper as time goes by.

Don't kill your motor and pump. If your filter fills up in a few hours, you cant run it unattended. Let that stuff settle. Don't rile it up. Once you can see the bottom, you can vacuum to waste if water replacement is not a problem.

You need to keep your water circulating as much as possible. If your filter is clogging up quick, back off on the amount of DE. Use a little less than the manual calls for.

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Thanks for the encouragement :) I don't mean to be pedantic (and feel free to call me a pompous ass if I am - my boss does, regularly!), but when you say kill it "and then" filter it, do you mean once it's all dead, or filter as I go?

My filter currently clogs in minutes rather than hours, even after stripping it down, hosing the fingers clean, and adding minimal DE - I understood from Ben's earlier post here that live algae will clog a DE filter very quickly, so I've just been recirculating while I try to kill it all off; planning to start running it through the filter when most of it is dead. Water replacement is not a problem, so running the dead stuff to waste is an appealing alternative to back-washing every half an hour!

OK, forget the Turbo Shock...

I added 5gal 12.5% and was at 11.4ppm FC after an hour. Added another 3gal, and an hour later the count had shot up to 27.5ppm. Is it reasonable to assume that the first 5gal hadn't fully dissipated by the time of the first test? I reviewed and followed the Taylor video, so I'm pretty sure I'm testing correctly now.

I can see a marked improvement in the color already - it's definitely lightening. I'm letting the levels calm down a bit now (just tested and still have 25.5ppm after another hour). I guess that at these levels I don't want to be adding any CYA yet?

Wait on the CYA. You probably don't want to go quite so high with your chlorine since it is a vinyl liner. I'd probably go 15, 20 max.

if you have cal-hypo on hand, it is fine to use that for awhile since your calcium level is low at 70. But not for too long. High calcium can cause cloudy water issues. I probably wouldn't let it go higher than 200-300. Then just bleach or liquid chlorine. Or else, just forget the cal-hypo and stick with bleach. From your last post, you seem to be making some head way.

Thanks - getting that high was accidental. My second dose was based on the results an hour after the first, but I don't think the initial dose was fully dissipated by the time I added the second. I'm down below 20 again now (19 when tested on the hour); and planning to stay below. I just have bleach at this point, but it seems to be doing the job :)

It will do the job if you consistently maintain shock level. Keep us posted .......

Consumption, if that's the right term, is slowing - only lost 0.5ppm in the last hour. There's less sun at this time, which I expect makes a difference. I've been wondering about volume all day - the 40-45kgal I quoted in my first post was the contractor's best guess, and seems high to me.

I've been crunching numbers since, and I don't think there's more than 35kgal in there. The pool is L-shaped; 44' long by 16.5' wide with an additional 6' at the bottom part of the "L". It's 3' deep along the shallow first 19', dropping to 8' deep at the deep end. The corners are all cut.

I also reckon 1gal 12.5% is adding about 3.4ppm based on measurements. If 1gal of the 12.5% should add 2.8ppm to 45kgal, then 3.4ppm/gal means 35k is in the ballpark. Seem reasonable?

Here's how it looked at 12:00, in case the visual helps make sense of my ramblings...

Attachment 795

Quote:

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Originally Posted by barma16

Thanks for the encouragement :) I don't mean to be pedantic (and feel free to call me a pompous ass if I am - my boss does, regularly!), but when you say kill it "and then" filter it, do you mean once it's all dead, or filter as I go?

My filter currently clogs in minutes rather than hours, even after stripping it down, hosing the fingers clean, and adding minimal DE - I understood from Ben's earlier post here that live algae will clog a DE filter very quickly, so I've just been recirculating while I try to kill it all off; planning to start running it through the filter when most of it is dead. Water replacement is not a problem, so running the dead stuff to waste is an appealing alternative to back-washing every half an hour!

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Hey if you can't filter yet then you can't filter. But you definitely have to keep circulating your water. If I had to break down and clean a DE filter every hour, I'd be at my wits end. Don't abandon trying to filter but if it has to be one or the other, keep it on recirculate. If you stay on top of the chlorine you'll be able to run the filter for longer periods once you kill all the algae. After you filter the dead stuff that's suspended in the water you will be able see the stuff that fell to the bottom.

Another thing--the word SHOCK is meaningless. Chlorine is chlorine. It's the amount you put in that determines if you're shocking or not. As they say on this great forum, "shock is not a noun, it's a verb."

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Yeggim

Hey if you can't filter yet then you can't filter. But you definitely have to keep circulating your water. If I had to break down and clean a DE filter every hour, I'd be at my wits end. Don't abandon trying to filter but if it has to be one or the other, keep it on recirculate. If you stay on top of the chlorine you'll be able to run the filter for longer periods once you kill all the algae. After you filter the dead stuff that's suspended in the water you will be able see the stuff that fell to the bottom.

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That's the plan - looking forward to turning the filter on... but not quite yet. I'm on recirculate 24/7 at the moment.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Yeggim

Another thing--the word SHOCK is meaningless. Chlorine is chlorine. It's the amount you put in that determines if you're shocking or not. As they say on this great forum, "shock is not a noun, it's a verb."

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Amen :)

I can see leaves! :D

At least, I can see in the shallow end where some of them are are. I've been sustaining 15-20ppm FC, and it's starting to pay off. I can now run the filter with a couple scoops DE in it for an hour or more between backwashes, which is progress!

I accidentally bought Muriatic acid at the pool shop instead of Cyanuric, and can't return it since the bottles aren't sealed. The woman at the pool store said I could use it to clean the element in the filter (Hayward DE4820) - is this wise?

Thanks,
Mark

I don't know about cleaning your DE filter element or what the procedure would be but be careful - don't just dump it on - wear gloves and safety glasses/goggles, stay upwind of the fumes, avoid splashing. Always Always Always put Acid into Water (A->W). NEVER put water into acid. Muriatic acid can hurt you.
That said, It is great for lowering pH (you don't need to now if your pH is still 7.4). I read a post somewhere here that suggested storing the bottle(s) in a 5 gallon plastic pail with lid fastened to contain any possible spill and store the pail (acid and all) in a cool place out of harms way. It's not a good idea to store it with other chemicals or near metal objects as the fumes can cause corrosion.
To put in in your pool (if you need to), wear gloves, eyewear, stay upwind, hold the bottle in the pool with the lid just out of the water, remove lid, pour acid into pool keeping opening as close to water as possible (to avoid splashing), replace cap, rinse the whole closed bottle (and anyhting else that touched the acid) in pool before removing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by barma16

I can see leaves! :D

...I accidentally bought Muriatic acid at the pool shop instead of Cyanuric, and can't return it since the bottles aren't sealed. The woman at the pool store said I could use it to clean the element in the filter (Hayward DE4820) - is this wise?

Thanks,
Mark

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You can use the acid to clean mineral deposits off the grids of the filter. But it's the last step in a chemical cleaning procedure. Here's a great sticky on DE filters.

http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/showthr...ng-a-DE-filter

Note the addendum in red by POOLDOC. If and when your grids need more than just rinsing, make sure you degrease the grids before the acid wash.

I gotta hand it to you brother. A lot of folks would have had second thoughts by now or been pool stored and start to dump everything but the kitchen sink into the pool. It would start to sound like a Three Stooges routine. I say that with no disrespect or to mock and I genuinely feel for these people but that's the pattern it forms.

Pool Store Guy: I know what's the matter -- you haven't got enough anna canna panna san.

Mother In Law: Wait a minute, -- what that needs is a mixture of enol, plus anna sanna pacan scram.

LOL, thanks! I'm very glad I found this place early, otherwise I'd have spent a lot more money for a lot less progress, and had really no idea what was going on. You guys have all been a great help and kept me positive. Of course, it helped that the weather was nice over the weekend. Hanging out by the swamp with a beer and a test kit wasn't the worst way to spend the time...

That DE Filter sticky is excellent - from the description I don't think I need an acid wash yet, just more time with the filter running.

FC was 16ppm this morning, and still 16ppm at lunch when I ran home to check the level. Does this mean most of the algae is now dead?

Sounds promising .......... especially if you don't lose too much the rest of the day and if you don't lose more than 1ppm overnight.

BTW --- You don't need a swamp to hang out by the pool with a cold beer!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Watermom

BTW --- You don't need a swamp to hang out by the pool with a cold beer!

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Who knows - once it's a pool and no longer a swamp perhaps I'll be able to persuade someone other than the dog to come through the gate :D

You are funny. You made me laugh!

It's been a while, so I thought I'd stop in and give an update, and make sure I'm still on the right track...

The swamp is starting to look like a pool. For the last ten days I've been maintaining >15ppm FC constantly, and testing often enough to be in dire need of more powder and titration agent (delivery tomorrow, phew!).

The shallow end is now clear, and free of leaves and debris. The deep end is getting clearer, and the leaves are coming out, although this clouds things up a treat, so it's time consuming! The filter has been running non-stop, and a full charge of DE will now last two days or more if I leave the water undisturbed. Less when I pull leaves out, obviously... Either way, I'm not usually backwashing more than a couple of times a day.

pH is 7.2 and TA is 100 - I've added nothing but bleach since my last full round of tests.

I've not yet passed the overnight test - on my best night I lost 1.5ppm FC, and usually lose around 3.

I'll bump the pH back up a bit, but is there anything else I should be doing at this stage? Is there a limit to how long I should maintain shock levels, and when should I be thinking about stabilizing?

Thanks for all the help so far, I don't know what I'd have done without it.

Mark

So that we don't have to re-read this monstrous thread, post a current set of numbers including CYA and your volume. You are doing great!

I would concentrate on getting everything out of the pool first. If there's a lot of muck in the deep end, it either has to be scooped out and/or vacuumed to waste. What's your plan in this regard?

If you vacuum to waste, any CYA (stabilizer) that you add will be diluted with the added water that you use to refill. That's probably not a big deal (money wise), considering the amount of bleach you've already bought to date for a 45,000 gal 'pond-soon-to-be-pool'. :eek::eek:

Oh, by the way, outstanding job so far. I think it's almost swim time. Here's what I would do:

Keep up the shock levels
Keep an eye on your PH
A quick vacuum to waste from the deep end.
Filter 24/7

After vacuuming to waste, let everything settle (still filtering 24/7) and go from there. If you still have a layer of debris, muck, whatever covering the entire bottom--another quick vacuum to waste. You'll be able to judge the amount of muck that's down there on the first round of vacuuming by what's coming out of the discharge. It will pile up at the end of the discharge hose if it's bad down there.

As far as CYA (stabilizer) is concerned, I'd bet dollars to donuts that you have some in there. I remember you saying that you tested in the morning and tested at lunch without losing any Chlorine awhile back. That's would lead me to believe that you're closer to 30 than 20 with your CYA--if it was sunny or partly sunny that day.

Speaking of sun, how much sun is your pool exposed to? Are you losing a lot of Chlorine on sunny days? If I were to decide to bump my CYA up, I'd do it in 10 ppm increments. I'd make sure to test first and have enough R-0013 reagent to test at least two more times after that. And last but not least, make certain I had the right numbers for my volume of water.

At 45,000 gallons, 60 ozs of dry stabilizer will raise your pool 10ppm. That's by weight. About 63 ozs by volume will be the same. If you haven't already, check out the Pool Calculator. Plug in your numbers in the 'Now' columns. You can plug in your target numbers it will giver you amounts to add to achieve those target numbers based on your 'Now' numbers. Down the bottom there's a reverse of 'Now' and 'Target'. You plug in the amount of chemical that you want to add and it will give you the result based on that amount. Every computation on there hinges on the size of your pool, so make sure you have that field filled with your proper pool volume.

http://www.poolcalculator.com/

OK, first things first. I'm now quite convinced that I don't have anything like 45k gallons. That was the estimate I was given by the guy who came to open the pool. 1 gallon of 12.5% bleach adds approximately 6ppm FC based on testing an hour or so after addition, and before there's too much sun. Based on some (probably poor) logic, I reckon that gives me about 21k gallons. Could someone point me to a reasonable methodology for estimating volume? Pool is L-shaped.

This morning's test results as follows:

12ppm FC (added 1 gal 12.5%)
1ppm CC
13ppm TC

pH 7.2 (added 4lb Borax)
100ppm TA
90ppm CH
<30ppm CYA (Dot still definitely visible, even when the test container was completely full).

I tried vacuuming to waste a little (multi-port valve to waste, inlet valve to main drain only), but the basket in the pump got clogged quickly, so I'm back to raking the leaves out, which has been my approach so far.

There was some stuff still in the shallow end that was too fine to be caught by the leaf rake, so I vacuumed that out, which appears so far to have been a success, although when I've tried to get it up before, it's taken a while to settle back down to the bottom.

Weather hasn't been stellar recently. Looking back over my notes, I seem to be losing 4-6ppm FC over the course of the day. I didn't make notes on which days were sunny though! Perhaps I was careless when I tested that day I appeared to lose nothing, or perhaps the weather was particularly miserable...

The pool was looking good this morning - I could see the remaining leaves in the deep end quite clearly. I'm going to carry on raking, filtering and (regular) vacuuming for the time being, I think. Anything else I should do at this stage?

As for swim time, I swam my first length this morning :) Probably not the smartest thing to have done; we're not there yet, but I was in the water vacuuming and it seemed to be the best way back to the shallow end. Felt great!

Just to put things into perspective, here's how it looked once vacuumed this morning, before I raked some more leaves and clouded the deep end up again.

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