pool opening delayed until i can uncloud my pool

hey guys just stumbled onto this site via google searches. my pool is pretty cloudy. a few days ago it was dark green with two dead birds in it, so ive made some progress but its not useable yet. i have an above ground pool , 24' round. sand filter.

so my levels are all good besides my ph. ph is pretty low. i added 30 pounds of some stuff from the pool store but after two days the ph has dropped again. initially i was going to go back to the pool store and buy some more stuff. but i saw how you guys gave tips and pointers on alternatives to overpriced pool stuff. such as bleach instead of chlorine. i briefly remember baking soda ...for alkalinity possibly..?

anyway. is there a cheap alternative to raise ph that i can get from walmart of sams club etc?

ive been running my pool filter nonstop but the pool just wont clear up. i did try some clarifier but so far its a no go.

im sure this is an extremely overanswered situation, but since im new here i have a bit of restricted access so my best bet was to start this thread.

thanks in advance guys. and thanks for having me on your forum

The answer to your question is "20 Mule Team borax" from the detergent section at Walmart or Kmart. Add a box at a time, and test with a cheap OTO/phenol red kit (Walmart, again) an hour after each box.

Add the borax one box at time SLOWLY through the skimmer with the pump running. Test your pH an hour after each addition.

Ben

Unless you are chlorinating your water, you won't be able to clear it up.

BTW, Bleach IS Chlorine. "Liquid Chlorine" from the pool store is merely concentrated bleach, unless it's 6% strength. Then it's exactly the same as ultra bleach, which is also 6%.

Carl

Welcome to the Forum!

I'm glad that you found us (and so is your wallet). :cool:

I don't like adding chems through the skimmer (not to start a debate) except for water and DE. Speaking of DE (diatomaceous earth), adding a little to a sand filter will help clear the finer particles out of the pool - I believe there is a sticky on this. (* I had 1 pool this spring that had ? stuff in it that just bypassed the filter when I vacuumed and by adding the DE, I was able to get the pool crystal clear in 3 days:))

thanks guys. i was reading some things here and there on the forum today and saw the borax answer as well. im going to hit the local walmart tomorrow. lol@ the wallet comment. i agree with that, i wish i had found this forum a week ago, before i spent 150 dollars on chlorine and ph stuff. but hey better late than never. ill keep you posted. and thx again

also, just so i can try to understand this. what exactly is the culprit here, if it can be pinpointed. low ph which allows algae growth? free floating particles that cant be filtered because they are too small? impossible to really tell via posts on a forum with minimum details?

the cloudy water can be any of several things, or a combination of any of them.
nascent algae bloom
suspended particles of dead algae
suspended particles of dirt/sand
poor chemical mix (usually causing 2 or 3 above)

the algae bloom is fixed with chlorine
2 can be fixed by chlorine, but easier/cheaper to filter
3 is fixed by filter
4 is fixed by balance

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Originally Posted by resp215

also, just so i can try to understand this. what exactly is the culprit here, if it can be pinpointed. low ph which allows algae growth? free floating particles that cant be filtered because they are too small? impossible to really tell via posts on a forum with minimum details?

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adding 30 pounds of anything probably didn't help much......

Janet

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Originally Posted by aylad

adding 30 pounds of anything probably didn't help much......

Janet

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yeah initially i went to the pool supply store and they tested the water and said that the ph was low. so in total it was 24 pounds , two 12 pd bags, of some stuff to bump the ph. luckily i found this forum otherwise i would have been back there again.

an hour ago i went to walmart and bought some generic brand bleach, 6%, 1.5 gallon jugs. i also bought a few boxes of borax. came home and put 1 jug of chlorine in the pool and a box of borax into the skimmer. a few minutes ago i checked the levels. i only have test strips that you dip in the water so until i purchase the K-2006 i will have to wing it. the alk was good, ph was still slightly low so i added another box of borat, and the chlorine was high which i thought may happen.

i will test the levels again in an hour and see where the ph falls at. i really do appreciate all the help. i was thinking about adding a bit of de into the skimmer to help my sand filter but i figured i would get my levels where they should be first and then see what you guys thought about the de idea.



oh man i almost forgot, there is another part of my setup. we just bought this house over a year ago so this is our second summer here. its a nature 2 above ground pool thing. lol i dont really know what to call it. anyway its set up but there i didnt replace the cartridge in it yet. they are pricey. is this even necessary with the bbb way of maintaining the pool? or can i eliminate it. if it is not needed can i just leave it hooked up until i shut the pool down or do i have to detach it off my setup

ok so i just got a chance to go check the pool again to see how the borax effected the ph. here are my results:

pool check 3n1 test strips
{ppm}
total alk80-120ish
free chl/bromine 10/20
ph 7.2

im going to add a bit more borax to get the ph to 7.8 since i think i read that is ideal.
the pool smells like a pool lol. just doesnt look like one yet

I wouldn't adjust the pH higher- it will probably rise on its own as you filter/aerate it.
The nature2 thing, I think, is a Silver and/or Copper based system- I don't think you want it, but the equipment experts will chime in!
Keep up the FC as best you can, and watch the pH, and your pool will clear up soon!

im not exactly sure how to keep the fc up. i suppose by keeping the chlorine level up as a general rule it will allow for an ample amount of fc? the sun is beating down on the pool all day so ill check it again in a few hours and try to keep on top of it.

All you have to do about the Nature system is... nothing - just don't waste your money replacing the cartridge and simply forget the thing is there. :)

Check out Ben's Best Guess Chart for your chlorine v.s. cya optimal level.

well its morning, good morning to all. no idea why i woke up at 5:30 this morning but i did lol so im up. i went out a bit ago to check on the levels. all are good. the pool is still milky. i didnt expect it to clear up overnight so it was no surprise.

i think today i may try to add some de to my filter. and also start brushing the pool to kick up debris on the bottom and the walls.

other than that i suppose its just a waiting game. i dont know much about this filters history. i was told after a few years you are supposed to change the sand. if this is true i have no idea when this was done prior to me buying the house. im hoping the water clears by saturday or sunday but i will just go with the flow.

btw on a side note. as i was googling for answers i remember someone saying they used oxiclean to uncloud their pool. it was an expensive solution and only a minor fix but it worked. is there truth to this. i have no desire to spend fifty bux on oxiclean, but thats pretty impressive if its true.

I've never heard that about oxiclean but I wouldn't do it. If you stick with the methods suggested here, your pool will clear up.

You do NOT need to change out your sand every few years unless you convert from Baquacil to chlorine. My sand is going on its 11th season and is just fine.

Just Googled Oxiclean . . . no, no, NO! It's a detergent!

Have seen pools with detergent added -- if it's a laundry detergent (and thus stable in the presence of bleach) . . . you have to drain the pool to get it out.

Nightmare land!

Ben

PS. Don't believe everything you read on the Internet. Even here. Unless I wrote it. And even then, only after Watermom proof read it, and made me keep my "ph up" and "ph down", and my "sunsets" and "sunrises" straight. ;-)

hahaha i wasnt going to do it, just figured id mention it. billy mays would say it worked though {he was the infomercial guy with the weird beard}

good to know about the sand thing, im going to tell my friend today after he gets out of work that he didnt need to do it. im also going to link him to the forum, save him a few bux and help him out.

right now im just keeping the ph and chl up. i brushed the pool and some grime and debris floated up a few times. not as much as i expected though. im going to vacuum next time instead of brushing. see if i can get some of the gunk up. i have a vacuum that goes through a hose directly into the skimmer. i guess ill backwash afterwards if the psi gets too high.

after i do this ill add a bit of DE to my filter to try to help it out with the smaller stuff.

sun, borax, bleach....these are my tools for now.

now that i think about it, it was pretty entertaining paying for all of this stuff. i know the lady ringing me up wanted to ask what the heck i was up too. but she didnt. i think im going to say that i have realllllly dirty clothes

good morning pool friends.

so i ordered a taylor kit but with three to five day shipping i probably wont have it until next weekend. my pool is still cloudy lol what else is new.

here are the levels from my awesome strip kit:

ta in between the 80-120 markers
fc/bromine 10/20
ph in between the 7.2-7.8 markers

im really not sure what else i could be doing differently. im just going to try to be patient and allow my filter to do its job. until i get the taylor kit i really wont have better readings. its so nice out today too. would be a great day for a dip in the pool.

man this is frustrating

also had a quick question about recirculating. i set my filter to recirculate and it came out of the backwash nozzle. for some strange reason i figured it would go through the pump somehow and back into the pool. so in the future if i ever have to recirculate, is the proper method to toss the end of the backwash tubing thing i have back into the pool so the water returns?

When you have the filter on recirculate it's supposed to go back into the pool, not to backwash. Sounds to me like your multivalve may have been reassembled backwards...

Janet

i just checked again. i put it on recirculate and it comes out the same valve that the backwash comes out of. im not sure how this really effects the system. i suppose as long as the filter and backwash work properly it isnt a huge deal?

daily check in. all levels are up, and yup, the pool is still cloudy

lol. i have no idea what else i could do. im starting to feel like at this rate i will spend the whole summer pouring bleach and borax into a huge cloudy washing machine. maybe something is going on in the pool that my test strips dont check for. im half tempted just to drain the pool and start over. itll cost me via the waterbill but i figure if i keep adding chemicals for weeks on end it will pan out being the same cost by the time its up and running. and at least we could enjoy the pool.

meh, im just frustrated, dont mind me. back to adding bleach.

I hope your kit arrives quickly! By any chance, is there a reputable pool store nearby that you could get to test your water for you until your kit is there? Just don't buy anything! Unless I missed it when I just skimmed this entire thread again, I see no CYA level having been reported. Also, can you tell us how much bleach you have been adding at a time and how often? Did you try adding some DE to the filter? is your filter pressure rising? Is there anything else that you have added to the water?

fwew, man i was cranky this morning. my fiance and i have a 10 week old and i think the lack of sleep is effecting me lol.

watermom thanks for trying to help let me see what i can answer here and give a status update.

ok so yesterday i floc'd the pool. i know the bbb method really doesnt call for it, but i just checked a bit ago and it cleared the pool up! so it did what it said, cool. so i go to vacuum the pool via waste and ...nothing is coming out ahahhaah

so im standing there, trying to figure this out. and someone earlier mentioned that the setup may be reversed. i think they hit the nail on the head. earlier in the thread i mentioned that recirculating the pool came out the backwash valve. so in reality, i think i had it on waste ahahahah omg thats not good. two hours of me running it on waste right back into the pool. so i go and switch it to "waste" and it seems to be recirculating ahahah. ok so now i know that the setup is backwards or the sticker was put on reversed. {good grief}

so my plan is to let it recirc a bit and then let it settle and go out to a nice dinner with my fiance while her mom watches our son. {first night out since his birth, gonna miss the lil bugger}

then i will vacuum tomorrow and check the levels again.


as far as your questions. yup there is a pool place nearby, i will have them check my water for sure and post results.

bleach; it varies a bit. anywhere from 1.5-3 gallons a day. the three gallons was more at first. the sun beats down directly onto the pool all day so i think that doesnt help the chl levels.

borax. i add about two boxes a day. im very green at all this so im not sure if adding borax effects chl levels or vice versa etc. its actually not hard at all to maintain the proper levels {according to my test strips}

i have to read up on baking soda but havent added any yet.

i bought de today and plan on adding it after i vacuum. im going to read up on that as well. i believe i read a quarter cup at a time diluted in a gallon of water. then check the psi levels.

heres something that will make you smile at my expense a bit. when we bought the house the pool was in disarray. we put in a new liner and built a deck around it. the deck goes about 1/3 around the whole 24 ft pool. its pretty big. well i thought that it would be a GREAAAT idea to build the deck over the pump setup, to hide it and make the backyard look much more tidy. sooooo. everytime i have to change the setting on the filter, or backwash, or check psi or etc etc, i have to climb under the deck sorta hands and tips of feet and bearwalk my way to the filter. ahahhaahahh oh man if i ever change to a saltwater setup im moving it over. oh yeah, the handle for the valve on my filter...it sits between the joists for the deck. soooo if i want to see what setting its on i have to squeeze my huge head between a joist and the filter. needless to say i used a sharpie to write the setting positions on the front of the filter.

thanks again for the concern and help. i already started to tell friends about this forum via facebook. its really nice to have forums like this where people can just help each other. with all the con artists and people trying to take advantage of others in this world, its nice to see that there are still people who genuinely just want to help others.

Have a good night out with your beloved, you deserve it!

I'm glad to hear the multi is between 2 joists! ;) Reason being that you can cut the deck to make an easily accessible lid for when you have to change multi positions, which will blend in perfectly with the deck :cool:

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Originally Posted by waste

Have a good night out with your beloved, you deserve it!

I'm glad to hear the multi is between 2 joists! ;) Reason being that you can cut the deck to make an easily accessible lid for when you have to change multi positions, which will blend in perfectly with the deck :cool:

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yup i thought about doing that. already did it to create an access point for the skimmer.

and man that food was good. went to the ale house which is a pretty good steak type place where i live. had some ribs and a nice 8oz filet. its funny to think how weird it feels to go get something to eat for two hours without having kids or a newborn with you. we were laughing about it as we drove to the ale house. "remember the days when we could just say hey lets go get some dinner, and just leave and go eat. ahahhaahaah ohhhh those were the days"

on the way home i went to target and then walmart looking to re up my borax stock. sold out. they dont stock much as it is, and im sure people were buying it for their pools. when i find another store that has it im buying the whole shelf. im stocking up for summer . running to the store every couple of days is for the birds.

We use OxyClean, but in our laundry. I don't know what else it contains, but, ironically, it contains both Borax and Washing Soda! I'm wondering if just the old-fashioned use of Borax and Washing Soda in may not work just as well as OxyClean?

Carl

Well folks I hate to say it but I'm going to drain the pool. 11 days and no headway being made. Well let me not say that. My levels are good and I am learning a lot on the forum.

So above ground pool with a one year old liner. Can I drain and clean it totally or will that mess up the elasticity or etc. I think I read to only drain two thirds.

Also. Will a sump pump damage a loner if placed on the pool floor.

Draining totally is always a risk. If it were me, with a 1 year old liner, I'd probably drain to leave at least 6" at the shallowest.

And, yes, a sump pump placed directly on the liner can damage it. Don't do that.

Ben

I would not completely drain- 2/3 is max I would do (I would probably only do 1/4 at a time, multiple times- but my well is good, so I got plenty of water with no metals/etc.)
As far as sump pump- make sure it has an adapter on it so it doesn't suck up the vinyl, and it should be fine on the pool floor.
What happened to the warning about another post? my post went straight thru, didn't know Ben had answered already; didn't mean to add to the real expert!
but like Ben said, don't let the suction sit directly on the floor!

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Originally Posted by madwil

What happened to the warning about another post? my post went straight thru

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?????????? Don't know what this means.

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Originally Posted by Watermom

?????????? Don't know what this means.

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I'm assuming like many forums this forum let's you know if someone has posted as you were typing your reply. And it allows you to view it before you reply so you can alter your response if needed.

As he was replying someone else did saying something similar to him and he never was prompted that another reply had been posted whe he was typing his.

Pools 1/3 empty. Cmon sump pump you can do it!

yep, resp has it right; Ben posted while I was typing, so I went back and edited; but I know in the past it's stopped and given me the warning prior to posting my message...

Pools 2/3 drained and I'm glad I made this decision. The pool cover came off during the winter and there is a ton of debris on the bottom. Leaves and dirt and etc. I'm gonna scoop it all out, give the pool a nice wall and floor sweeping and refill immediately

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Originally Posted by madwil

but I know in the past it's stopped and given me the warning prior to posting my message...

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On this forum? I have been on PF for a decade and have never seen that warning with any of our software versions.

Quick update. Pool is cleaned and refilling. Taylor pool kit is here and once it's filled I'll adjust the levels and post readings. Thx all