Bromine Chemistry Question

PoolDoc: I bought the borate LaMotte test strips as recommended. May I test borates with distilled water instead of tap? Our tap is softened well water....

ChemGeek: Your borax/volume ratios agree better with my results although it appears I am testing higher than 50. Maybe Ben can use your ratios to compare with his other "info sources". The placebo effect works for me if it makes my husband happy with my new water recipe: pool forum vs. pool store! But he is ADAMANT about the improvement since adding borax. I can't speak to it; 75 degrees is way to cold for me. I read that you use borates, Richard. Have you gone swimming in water without borates to see if YOU notice a difference? Just a thought.

I've noticed the shimmering effect and a lowering of surface tension with the water meniscus being more flat, but I haven't noticed effects on the skin or hair nor has my wife, but she does water therapy exercise in the pool every day for about an hour so she's in there a lot. She didn't make any comments when I boosted up the borates this year after it dropping by dilution from the winter rains. Everyone's different though.

Hello!

While I am waiting (and waiting) for my CYA to reach 30, I have been thinking. p.s. I am adding dichlor every few days and keeping FC between 2.5 and 3.5, CC=0. And, yes, Ben, I am keeping the pool open for several hours a day, but it's hardly being used because IT'S SO COLD!

Anyway, a month or so ago I took a pool sample to Leslie's to get some metals tested and they told me my phosphates were high. I haven't worried about it as everything I had read said as long as you don't have any algae blooms not to be overly concerned. However, I have been following the "ozinator experience" which led me to: http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/showthr...+my+phosphates ...and that's what got me thinking.

I have enlarged the views on my profile and avatar pictures and emailed Ben larger images of them. I am hoping that you will be able to see the extent of my "greenery" around the pool. There's usually more plants and flowers but we had a killing-winter and I lost a bunch of plants. I do not use plant food/fertilizer but I have a LOT of mulch around the pool.

Hopefully you experts will be able to see the pictures and can offer advice as to whether phosphates may be an increasing problem in the future and need to be dealt with. So far, thanks to you all, everything seems to be perfect except for the weather and resulting low pool usage.

Thanks!

Randy

Hey.

I have been "patiently" waiting until it looked like things had settled down after the July 4th rush and it looks like they have.

Here's my news: My CYA finally hit around 42 (my son and I are familiar with logarithmic scales so it's our best guess). I have been using LC to sanitize. My pH is incredibly stable (thanks for the TA adjustment, Ben!). I check FC, CC, and pH daily and I seem to lose 1.0-1.5 ppm FC each day. I'm not exact with my LC dosages as I am trying to learn how to judge quantities myself and NOT use a calculator. :-) Twice I have had CC between 0.1 and 0.5 but that was after little kids were in the pool....

Here are my numbers:
FC: aim for 4.2 (10% of CYA)
CC: 0
pH: 7.4
TA: 80
CYA: 42 (>40)
CH: 60
Borate: 60 .... I THINK it's 60 but I can't read those LaMotte strips very well
Metals: 0 (according to bucket test) I have only added rain water so far

So.... Is there anything else I should be doing with my new water? I still have concerns about Leslie's telling me I had >1000ppb phosphates. If you think I am saavy enough, I will be happy to be an additional test case for the phosphate project. I know the axiom is "if it ain't broke..." but it seems like there's a good argument for preventative medicine too.

Oh, and my pool is really 26K, not 30K, but I can't change my signature.

Products on hand: plenty of 12.5% LC, 10.5 lbs 68% cal-hypo, 3.25Q 60% polyquat, 2 bx borax, 2.5G MA

I'll let Ben tell you if he wants you to do something with his phosphate project. All of your numbers look pretty good.

Regarding your signature, if you click on the link in my signature, you'll be able to edit it to show the correct volume.

Thanks especially for taking a look at my numbers, Watermom! I tried to use YOUR signature also, and it still won't let me edit. I get the error message:
Your signature contains too many lines and must be shortened. You may only have up to 3 line(s). Long text may have been implicitly wrapped, causing it to be counted as multiple lines.

Well, shorten it a bit. It would be better if it was shorter anyways --- less to read. When we glance at signatures, it helps if it is concise and only the most necessary info in there.

OR, are you saying you can't do any editing at all --- not even to delete part of it?

It looks like everything is OK. Unless you want to pursue using a PO4 remover now, I don't see a reason to do so.

But . . . it looks like I'm going to be putting together a 'winterizing kit' containing PO4 remover + a clarifier, with the intention of selling it to up to 100 in-ground pool owners who want to avoid spring-time slime. I hope to make an announcement about this by mid-August.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PoolDoc

It looks like everything is OK. Unless you want to pursue using a PO4 remover now, I don't see a reason to do so.

But . . . it looks like I'm going to be putting together a 'winterizing kit' containing PO4 remover + a clarifier, with the intention of selling it to up to 100 in-ground pool owners who want to avoid spring-time slime. I hope to make an announcement about this by mid-August.

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Interesting.....up until last winter I used a kit that contained a PO4 remover (it's designed for pools with mesh winter covers). Last winter I didn't use the PO4 remover based on what I'd been reading here about phosphates not being an issue when when properly chlorinated. Maybe I'll go back to using a PO4 remover at winter closing?

Again, using a PO4 remover ONLY has value if you take the PO4 level down to a measured 125 ppb (0.125 ppm) level OR LESS. Simply lowering the PO4 from 2,000 ppb to 500 ppb is probably useless. Also low PO4 levels only make it EASIER to kill resistant algae; low PO4 does not kill algae by itself.

If you have been successfully maintaining a clear pool on opening without messing with a PO4 remover, using one probably serves no purpose.