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Hi everyone, I am looking to install my first pool in 2 months. I am planning to install 18x42x26 true L at 25K gallons. In talking with dealers many are discouraging salt systems and saying use other options. I really want to know if traditional chlorine is the best overall option?
Chlorine sanitation is the most effective way to sanitize a pool. Having said that, salt systems use salt to produce chlorine. Both are chlorine based sanitizers. With a salt system you add salt to the water (3000-4000ppm) and the "cell" breaks the salt down to produce chlorine.
If you opt to not go with a salt system, understand that household bleach (chlorox) is chemically identical to the chlorine your pool store sells. It might be a little less concentrated; walmart sells 8.25% chlorine bleach. Pool stores tend to sell 10-12%. The stuff at the pool store usually comes at a much higher cost.
Here's a good article on the subject of household bleach vs "pool store" chlorine. http://www.poolsolutions.com/gd/use-...ing-pools.html
Now, I have a salt water chlorine generator in my pool and I love it. It allows me to be lazy and only check and adjust my chemistry weekly while having a safe and clear pool. However, there is a big cost difference. If you are using household chlorine bleach you will pay far less overall for sanitizing your pool than you would with a chlorine generator. Also, if your pool has metal sides or other metal components then the salt in the salt water will contribute to corrosion. If you do go salt, make sure you peruse the pool manufacturer's warranty. Some manufacturers will not warrant the pool if you use salt.
The dealer could be discouraging because they are also hoping to have a steady revenue stream selling you chlorine. They could be worried about the warranty.
Any way you go, you will be well served by reading a little on poolsolutions.com and getting a k-1766 test kit to test the pool water yourself. Pool stores to a one are notorious for giving bad results. Sometimes they are sloppy, sometimes they lead you astray telling you to put un-necessary chemicals in your water so they can make money selling the stuff.
This page has a link where you can get a k-2006 FAS-DPD taylor test kit. http://www.poolsolutions.com/testkit-order-links.html You can search the net yourself, but the price on the one linked is pretty decent (amazon.com). Usually pool stores do not keep these in stock.
I take a different twist on the dealers' "discouragement"--but it's compatible with Kelemvor's comments.
I suspect they are going to push you toward alternatives to straight chlorine sanitation. These could be: Baquacil, Bromine, an ozonator, or Nature2. NONE of them work as well as straight chlorine, all of them are expensive to use and maintain and their only "advantage" is transferring your money to the pool store or pool service.
Converting from Bac or Bromine to chlorine (when they fail and your pouring hundreds of dollars of chems down the drain) is difficult and fairly expensive. Ozonators, in the US, because of safety limitations (Ben's far more knowledgeable) don't work.
Nature2 uses lots of vague words but they never really tell you how it works--they just tell you it saves you money on chlorine. What it does is erodes dropping silver and copper into your water (copper is what turns blonde hair green). This can control and even prevent algae, but doesn't sanitize your pool. You just, in theory, use less chlorine because you don't have to use it to kill algae, just the pathogens you don't want in the water. BUT....the cost of installation and the annual cost of the Nature2 cartridges buys A LOT of bleach/liquid chlorine!
What you can do is make sure your installer's plans have plenty of room to install extra plumbing for a future SWCG, and that the wiring for the pump can be easily adapted to add on the SWCG power supply.
Meanwhile, learn our BBB method of pool maintenance, and get a good test kit--We recommend the Taylor Technologies K-2006 or K-2006C. Once you learn how to test and adjust your pool's water, you may find you don't need an SWCG.
I thought about getting one for YEARS but could never justify the cost. It was only when we started travelling more, and would be away for extended times, that I got one to make maintenance easier.
Can't help but ask if you were doing it again would you have installed the SWCG up front? I probably will because of the maintenance and I'm out of town frequently. thanks for all the information and you are right about the dealer trying to sell nature 2 and Macquarie he pushed both as a better and best compared to salt.
I deleted your other nearly duplicate post waiting in the queue. Whenever trial members post, their posts go to a moderation queue to be read and approved before they will appear on the forum. We try and empty the queue multiple times per day so it isn't usually too long before you will see it.
Welcome to the Pool Forum!
Can you find another dealer? Anyone who tells you N2 and/or Baq is better than an SWCG is either a liar or an ignoramus. IMHO. You can actually use Nature2 with an SWCG but I have no idea why anyone would.Quote:
Originally Posted by Clayhole
I am talking to someone else since the pushing of the nature 2 and also the actual pool builder told me the company made a fortune on baq when it first came along. I got the impression building pools is Less a priority, they had rather sell misc. product's. I have received a quote from another company which is actually cheaper and not trying to sell me any extras.
Yeah, that's their whole object. They are not just selling you an expensive in-ground pool chock full of equipment, they see you as an on-going revenue stream to keep their profit line up. Did they also talk to you about a "phosphate reducing plan" where every month or so they come in and add (expensive) phosphate reducer to "prevent algae"? Bet they did! We have better, cheaper, easier and more reliable ways to inhibit algae growth.Quote:
Originally Posted by Clayhole
With care you can find bleach or LC (liquid chlorine) inexpensively. I have a pool store I go to about 30 miles away that sell 5 gallon carboys ( containers) of 12.5% LC. Their stuff turns over so fast that it usually tests out at 14%. That means it's the equivalent of 10 gallons of 7% bleach....and it costs me $19, or $1.90/gallon. Since 8.25% bleach is sold in 121 ounce jugs (not a full gallon), I figure that as long as the bleach costs more than $2.11/jug (121oz of 8.25%), the LC at $19/5 gallons is cheaper. If the bleach goes to $2.11 or less, then the bleach is cheaper. However, I haven't seen bleach that cheap in my area.
If you've skipped that last paragraph (who could blame you?) what it means is that it IS possible to get LC from a (rare) pool store at a lower price than bleach. But you have to do some tricky calculation to come up with that. I also like the carboys because they are "deposit bottles" so no bleach bottle disposal, and easier to store. You DO need to invest in a $4 spigot but that lasts for years and years.
Moving on: You asked if I'd do it differently with an SWCG if I had to do it again.
No.
I could not justify the cost of an SWCG despite the "Gee Whiz" factor based on the numbers. It just didn't add up. I didn't install one with the pool and, even knowing what I know now, I wouldn't have.
But after the 2012 season our situation changed where we'd be away more often and for longer times. Therefore it made perfect sense to install it before the 2013 season. So I did. I wouldn't change that decision either.
But my situation is not your situation, and you'll have to make that decision. However, I would STRONGLY recommend that you learn and study our BBB method and get comfortable using it as if you don't have an SWCG. It's a whole lot easier for a BBB'er to add an SWCG when they already know the BBB method. All the SWCG is, then, is a more convenient way to add chlorine--and everything else is the same. Except, of course, you need to maintain your salt level correctly, but the SWCG tells you what it is and even can estimate how much to add (you program in the volume of your pool).
Until pooldoc validates your account you'll have to log out to do this, but... go over to the baquacil section of the forum. That stuff is a nightmare. Read about other people's experience before you make the same mistake they did.Quote:
Originally Posted by Clayhole
Here's a writeup with general information about the stuff: http://www.poolsolutions.com/gd/phmb...sanitizer.html
Here's a link where you can read about others who have used it: http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/forumdi...%28PHMB%29-etc