our community pool is green again! (THREAD CLOSED HERE)

I tend to be very wary of trying to help community pools, for several reasons:

1. They tend NOT to take our advice, but to mix and match. It doesn't work. Listening to even a bad advisor, is better than blending incompatible advice from multiple sources.

2. Even when they 'take our advice', they don't 'take our advice': unlike home pools, community pools tend to have MANY people who are ALL 'in charge'.

My service contracts with pools like yours ALWAYS specified that I would be paid, if I produced the results promised, BUT ONLY IF my guidelines were adhered to absolutely. If a pool failed to follow, much less tried to 'amend' my guidelines, my contract came instantly due 100% . . . but I could walk. I never had to do so, but I came close a couple of times.

3. Even when one person at a commercial pool -- like you, for instance -- accepted that guidance from here was NOT compatible with ANY other published pool advice (except for the other BBB pool forum), the OTHER people at the pool tend not to accept it. When there as a multi-thousand dollar contract on the line, they would hush. But with 'free' advice from here, they usually won't.

So . . . I'm going to point out some of what's wrong with what you reported; close this thread here, and move a copy to the Commercial Pool forum section, and let you respond there, if you still want to do so.

Quote:

PH was 7.4, TA 120, Chlorine 7.5

First thing wrong: TA is not critical; CYA is. With mustard algae, this is doubly true.

Get a K2006C test kit -- link to Amazon order page is in my blue signature block. I will not help you, and will not let others here engage, unless you get a kit. Without it, you are wasting our time . . . and YOURS.

Quote:

We put 23 jugs os 121 fl. oz. of bleach in pool on Monday night. It turned back blue on Tuesday. Backwashed and added 1,000 gal fresh water.

Good. But what is your pool volume?

Quote:

Had to add 3 containers of Pro Team Reverse (2 lbs each) to get Chlorine below 10 ppm.

It depends on your CYA level, but you almost certainly should not have done this. Read the Best Guess page, linked in my signature block.

This is one of the most critical areas, where EVERYBODY in the pool industry says something different than what we teach. We're right; they're wrong . . . but if you can't accept this, we can't help you. Literally, we've proved the basic data on that page with 10,000's of users. Chem-Geek has exposed the analytical chemical basis for this in excruciating detail, and has labored tirelessly (and far more diplomatically than I would) to get the NSPF and the NSF to acknowledge the errors in literally every pool publication out there, with no effect.

I'm more cynical than he is. I'm suspect BioGuard/Chemtura and Arch/HTH both knew that I was right, 10+ years ago, when I first published that info. (And at that time, both companies 'audited' PoolSolutions.com regularly -- I still have the web server log files!) And I suspect they also know that he has PROVEN that I was right -- which I could not have done. But (and here's where my cynicism comes in) I suspect even more strongly that they know that publishing this information nationally would literally cost them millions and millions of dollars in chemical sales.

They've ignored him. I think the reasons are obvious; he's more hopeful. (I never tried -- I never thought they'd listen.)

And, the NSPF and NSF have ignored, which doesn't surprise me, either. Guess where most of the board and committee members come from?

Depending on how your community is, you may need to find someone who's a chemist or chemical engineer, who is willing to read Chem-Geek's stuff, and then report back. I can dump all of it on them -- O'Brien's original CYA / chlorine studies, Wojitowiscz (former Arch scientist) work, and Chem-Geek's analysis -- if you have them contact me.

Anyhow, you probably did NOT have to lower the chlorine level. In most codes, including the NC code I believe, the 10 ppm upper limit is a 2 point violation, with no re-inspection.

I should caution: I've encountered NC inspectors who were more than willing to go beyond the code. If this is your case, there are work-arounds.

Quote:

CYA level is 100.

Ah! That's what I expected. Actually, it's probably higher than 100 ppm. Once you have the K2006C, I'll tell you how to test and find out.

Quote:

We don't know why it is so high. We use pro guard sticks (stabilized) in a chlorine dispenser.

That's why. Again, it's what I expected. Every pound of trichlor adds about 0.9lbs of chlorine gas equivalent AND 0.5 lbs of stabilizer.

Quote:

What are we doing wrong? PH today at 7.4, TA 100 and chlorine at 12 ppm.

1. Order the K2006C; don't worry about the TA, test the calcium (so you can see if you can use cal hypo) and test the CYA.

2. Read the Best Guess page.

3. Buy more bleach -- if 23 jugs worked last time, try that again. Do NOT lower the chlorine after. Brush the pool AFTER adding the bleach!

4. Empty your trichlor feeder, dry the tabs in the sun, store them in an open bucket, but NOT in an enclosed room and NOT near your pump, any pool heater, or any electrical or mechanical equipment.

5. Do NOT use algaecides or anti-algae products. They either will not work (liquid pool algaecides) OR will shut you down (Yellow OUT, & other ammonia products) OR will send your chlorine consumption through the roof (Yellow Treat, and other bromide products)

5. Consider your operating options:

a) run high chlorine 8 - 15 ppm, and accept the occasional 2 pt violations
b) drain 1/2 to 2/3 of your pool, and refill. This is the only way to lower CYA, in season. (Bacteria will 'eat it' over the winter - but the results of that can be (10 - 20% of the time) VERY bad.)

6. And, your clean up options:
a) maintain very high (15+ ppm) chlorine levels for several days

AND

b) treat with borates (borax, AKA Proteam Supreme, but you can buy it as borax at Walmart)
OR
c) treat with phosphate removers (will cloud your pool; will not work if your local water is high in phosphates. Some sticks now contain phosphates, too)

b) and c) do NOT kill algae, or absolutely prevent it. They DO make it harder for algae to grow.

Best wishes making a decision.

[ open version of this thead: http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/showthread.php?21746 ]