Keeps getting cloudy - Please help...

[myLABSpool]

I have a 24K IG vinyl pool. I maintain the water between 81-85 degree and I watch my chems closely and I still have problems with my pool turning a milky cloudy. I shock with liquid before it gets so cloudy that you can not see the drains, but this propensity to require shocking is getting to be really annoying and makes me wonder if there is something wrong with either my filter or other unidentified water problem.

My numbers (based on my Taylor test kit)
FC 3-6 depending on when I test and add more. When I shock I run it to 12ppm based on my level of cya.
CC - 0
pH 7.5
TA 100
CYA 30
Calcium low, but it's vinyl so this should not matter, right?
Water temp 81-85
I have no sign of algae.
I only use liquid CL, but I did use some pucks until my CYA climbed up from 15 at the beginning of the season.
I do keep the pool covered with the solar blanket when not in use or not at shock level.

I use skimmer socks and I have a sand filter and I do use DE in my filter which seems to help clear things up, but I'm stuck in this cycle of cloudy, shock, clear, cloudy, shock, clear. I'm beginning rue the day that I made the decision to go with a sand filter because I almost went with DE or cartridge instead. When I was a kid I had a DE filter at my parents and I was in charge of maintaining the pool and I never had water problems. My neighbors have cartridge and don't have as much cloudy problems as I do. I am replacing my sand this weekend and I made the investment in Zeo to see if that helps.

Any other suggestions would be appreciated?

[AnnaK]

I can totally understand your frustration. Your numbers look good, you have no CCs and still it gets cloudy.

Have you done an overnight FC test? You would add chlorine after the sun is off the pool, let it mix in well, test, then test again early in the morning before the sun gets on the water again. If you lose more than 1 ppm FC there's something in the water consuming the chlorine.

If that were so, you would then maintain it at constant shock level until the overnight test comes out negative, i.e., the FC is holding.

Have you had your water tested for metals? Could your fill water add contaminants?

Just throwing out some ideas . . .

[myLABSpool]

Anna,
I will give the FC overnight test a try.

As for the metals, I've not done any testing this year, but I can ask the pool store to run that test for me. My fill water is from a municipal water source that is always rated (by whomever those people are that rate water) as one of the purist in the nation. Also, I've never put any Cu base algaecide in and have only use poly quat as needed. I did use the Frog mineral system for the first 3 years, but am not using it this year because I kept having problems with cloudy water by mid last year so I wanted to adjust my routine (and save $100 by not purchasing a mineral pack).

Thanks. I will give those a try.
Andy

[polyvue]

Anna,
I will give the FC overnight test a try.

As for the metals, I've not done any testing this year, but I can ask the pool store to run that test for me. My fill water is from a municipal water source that is always rated (by whomever those people are that rate water) as one of the purist in the nation. Also, I've never put any Cu base algaecide in and have only use poly quat as needed. I did use the Frog mineral system for the first 3 years, but am not using it this year because I kept having problems with cloudy water by mid last year so I wanted to adjust my routine (and save $100 by not purchasing a mineral pack).

Thanks. I will give those a try.
Andy

AnnaK's great suggestions to check for metals and perform an overnight Free Chlorine test may lead you to a solution. I've found the following Pool Solutions link to be helpful in guiding a diagnosis -- it's comprehensive, enlightening and (perhaps unintentionally) quite entertaining.

100 Reasons for Cloudy Swimming Pool Water! (http://www.poolsolutions.com/gd/cloudy.html)

[aylad]

It is possible to have an impeding algae bloom without having measurable CC's. Is it possible that maybe you're just not leaving it at shock level long enough? I have had visible algae in my pool before when I got lazy, and still had zero CC. I agree with the others--I'll be interested in hearing the result of your overnight chlorine test.

Janet

[myLABSpool]

Okay the good news is that my pool is pretty much clear now after shocking again a couple days ago. I have not been able to perform the overnight FC test because the last two nights we've had a lot of rain (3"+) and it's expected to rain most of today. I have the solar cover on my pool and will keep it covered till the weather improves on Tuesday. I will hold the FC at 5ppm and make sure the CC stays at 0 like it has been.

Does keeping the solar cover on a pool promote cloudiness or Algae provided I maintain my chems?

Also, while I still have no sign of algae, is it still a good idea to use a maintenance does of polyquat as a preventive measure?

Also, yesterday I dumped my 300 lbs of sand and replaced it with 150lbs of Zeo sand. I know some people here may frown on the additional expense of Zeo, but I figured if there is even a small improvement in filtration over sand it is well worth it to me. I have always been accustomed to DE clarity growing up at my parent house and I just haven't been able to get that with my sand filter.

I will perform the overnight FC test as soon as I can get a night without rain.

Thanks for the assistance so far and I will keep you posted.

[CarlD]

Good luck!

aylad uses zeo sand. Poconos, Watermom and myself use sand and add a little bit of DE through the skimmer after we backwash. That and skimmer socks (combined with good maintenance) can really make your water sparkle!

[Watermom]

As long as your chems are kept at appropriate levels, having the solar cover on should not cause cloudy water or algae formation.

[myLABSpool]

Thanks to all that helped with my recurring cloudy problem. After shocking and holding it at shock level for several days the water cleared nicely. I also ran the recommended "Over night FC test" and found no lose of Chlorine. The weather got cool for a week so I put the solar cover on and tested daily to hold my FC at 4ppm. However much to my dissatisfaction by the end of the week I had a full bloom of Algae! Why the heck would Algae grow now after all that shocking and careful maintenance of my Chlorine?!!!!

So at any rate, I was forced to shock yet again and brushed several times per day. Finally after 4 days of shocking (based on the CYA best guess level) the algae cleared but the water was still fairly cloudy from all the algae particles (no longer green). It was now Friday morning and the weather was getting nice and we'd want to swim but the FC was still above 10ppm. So I added a quart of polyquat and by late afternoon the FC was way down (as I would expect) and the water was continuing to clear nicely.

As of today, my water is the clearest its been and I'm thrilled. I would describe its clarity as closest to DE quality clear as I've seen. It is sparkling and I want to keep it that way!

Because I'm very fussy about water clarity, I've also converted from Sand to Zeo in my 300lb filter. I'm also starting a weekly maintenance dose of a product called Pool Magic. My neighbor swears by it, so I figured I will give it a try. Anyone else ever try pool magic?

Another item I'm going to buy is a good robotic vac system with good internal filtration. I'm currently looking to spend around $1000 or less for either an Aquabot, Hayward Shark Vac, Tiger Shark or Aqua Clean. Seems like many have experience with Aquabot, but does anyone have experience with any of the others?

Thanks to everyone whom provided help.
Andy

[scottturner]

Good luck!

aylad uses zeo sand. Poconos, Watermom and myself use sand and add a little bit of DE through the skimmer after we backwash. That and skimmer socks (combined with good maintenance) can really make your water sparkle!

How much DE do you add to the skimmer? I take it in a regular sand filter that you lose the DE after a backwash? Thanks.

[aylad]

How much DE do you add to the skimmer? I take it in a regular sand filter that you lose the DE after a backwash? Thanks.


For Scottturner: You do lose the DE after backwashing. If you add DE to a sand filter, only add enough (start with a small handful) of DE to make your pressure rise by 1 psi. NOte that it takes a few minutes for this rise to happen, so give it a few minutes before you add more if you don't see it rise immediately. If you overshoot it, just backwash it out and start over.

Janet

[Watermom]

Scott --- you don't say how big your pool is so it is hard to suggest an amount. But to give you some idea --- I have a 24ft AG, a 1/2 hp fullrated inground pump and a 200 lb. sand filter. I usually start out with adding about 1/4 of a cup of DE and then go from there. The first time I did it, I didn't see a 1 psi rise, so I added more and then it was too much. After that, I learned that you have to wait a bit --- maybe even 1/2 hour to see the increase in pressure, so be patient and don't add any more until you give it a little time. If after 1/2 hour, no psi increase, add just a little more. You'll soon learn how much you need after a couple of tries.