Green Pool Water tried everything Please Help

[VickiP]

We have a 27 ft round pool. We have had water problems for years but this year is horrible. We opened the pool in late April adding 15 gallons of bleach over two weeks time. Got all the leaves out and started the pump. We added our well water too. I brought our water to be checked at pool store and sold me slo and lo, alk stuff, 2 gallons shock, ph decreaser. I add all of it and water turned green after the shock. So we have a well and brought water back and a small amt of copper was detected. Added Metal out and waited two days, still green and looked worse. Brought water to another pool store and she said add 5 gallons of shock and let is sit a day turn pump on and clean it. Well we did that and it was greener the next morning. So back to the 1st pool store and they are clueless but bought $40 bottle of Banish. Did that and still looked bad. Today added 4 bags of powder shock and some ph up. It is a bit lighter green now. My PH is at 7.6, chlorine is off the charts at 10,, alkalinity 120, stablizer 0. Any idea what is wrong or what we are missing???? Thanks

[VickiP]

Sorry I have a sand filter and 18,000 gallons of water

[Watermom]

VickiP --- I'm going to move your thread into the "algae" section of the forum. This Forum Q & A section is for questions about how to use the forum rather than advice on how to clear a pool. By the way, welcome!

[Watermom]

Don't add anything else at this point. If you have metal in your water, shocking causes it to fall out of suspension. I'm going to ask Marie to look at this thread for you. She is our "go to" on pools with metal issues.

And, stay out of that pool store! Not only are they emptying your wallet needlessly, but they are also giving you bad advice.

[VickiP]

Thanks so much, I will wait to hear. They did check the metal again it is no iron and very very low copper reading. Thanks again.

[CarlD]

That last is good news.

Pool stores complicate stuff for two reasons: 1) to sell you lots more stuff 2) they have no idea what REALLY works and what does not.

You are going to need to follow some basics to get your pool clean, but first you will need to get us all these numbers:
FC
CC or TC
pH
T/A
CH
CYA

You've given us some of them. You can ask the pool store to test your water and get us those numbers and say something like "I just want to see how your advice is working" and DON'T BUY ANYTHING FROM THEM!

We have some sections on dealing with algae. You should read them.

You'll need to keep chlorine levels high, clean all the detritus from your pool, vacuum to waste once a day. Brush the walls and bottom once a day, and check and keep your chlorine up 2 to 3x / day.

You'll also need lots of POPP--Pool Owner Patience and Persistence.

[VickiP]

HI,
I have the print out from the pool store from yesterday
FC (free chlorine) 7
TC (total Chlorine) 7
PH 7.6
T/A (Tot Alkalinity) 114
CH ??? dont see it on the list what is it
CYA 30
TDS 700
Total Hardness 100

We did add the 4 bags of shock and 5 (96 oz) of bleach today. We scrubbed the walls and should we vacuum to waste today too? Still same color of green. Also I did add last week a bottle of algeacide and yesterday the bottle of banish.
Thanks for the help

[VickiP]

We just opened up our sand filter because is seemed to bog down every once in a while. We replace it years ago and we found lots of pieces of pine needles and chunks of leaves it was gross. So we are going to empty it and clean out the canister and get new sand tomorrow. Do you think this could be a problem too?

[mbar]

I don't know what all the chemicals you have added contain. Don't add anything else but bleach or chlorine shock. It sounds like you may have an algae bloom - a chlorine level of 7 is not enough to kill an algae bloom. With a cya of 30 you have to bring the chlorine up to 15 to really shock the pool. You also have to keep it at 15 until the chlorine level holds overnight. You should also lower your ph down to 7.2. It will help to keep any metals from falling out of solution until you are finished shocking the water. The only other thing you want to add to your water is a metal sequestering agent. Any product that says "Metal Out" will do. Make sure it is a good on it should cost between $16 and $22. Once you have a stable chlorine level, and if the water is still green we can address the metal problem further. You must make sure that any of the chemicals you are using do not have copper - this may be how copper was introduced to your pool. Even some of the chlorine pucks contain copper now. Keep us informed on your progress:)

[aylad]

CH ??? dont see it on the list what is it ....
Total Hardness 100


CH means calcium hardness, which doesn't apply to a vinyl pool, as long as it's not over 300 or so. Yours is fine, despite what the pool store will tell you....just don't buy anything else from them and stick with what Watermom and Mbar are telling you. They've helped clear up more pool problems in a week or two than you'll see in a lifetime, and Mbar is THE resident expert on metal problems (besides Ben, of course)!!

Janet

[VickiP]

I wish I found you guys last year!!! We replaced the sand today and WOW, the pump works so much better. We can actually see a bit of the bottom of the pool today still green but much better. It didnt hold the chlorine level overnight so we will just keep vacuuming, scrubbing and adding bleach everyday until it does. I will keep adding udates!! Thank you so much for the help!

[ChuckD]

Vicki, I'm also on a well and feel I need to throw this into the mix as something to keep in mind:

If you have added a combination of chlorine and significant amount of well water that has a high iron content, mix in some sunshine and you will get a green pool while you watch. I've reproduced this many times thinking I had an algae bloom. And it sure looked like one too.

I got suspicious when we were not yet fulltime residents in our home. We were in the process of relocating and we'd arrive once a month for a weekend. I had a small leak in the liner and when we'd arrive Friday night I knew I'd have to turn the hose on for a while to top it off, and then add a bunch of bleach, then off to bed.

Next morning I'd get up and pull the opaque cover off, and within 20 minutes the pool would go from crystal clear to deep green. Very, VERY frustrating. Especially when you only have the weekend to enjoy!

After reading something here I decided to instead fill the pool only via the skimmer so the water was first filtered through the DE and this was the solution. So also be aware that this combination, iron-rich well water, chlorine and sunlight will give you a false algae bloom. It ultimately filters out but no amount of chlorine will clear it.

Also, I read you have a sand filter. There are posts here, I think by Carl, about adding a small amount of DE to a sand filter to get all DE's benefits (and there are, once you've seen pool water filtered through it, it's beautiful). See if you can search on that, it's a small amount, like 1/4 - 1/2 cup but you should read those posts to get the right idea.

C.

[Watermom]

Very good advice from ChuckD who has been with us for awhile! (Thank you, Chuck!) This is what makes this forum work. People sharing their experiences with new people who are just learning the ins and outs of pool care.

Here is the thread he was talking about (adding DE to a sand filter).
http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/showthread.php?t=3742

[VickiP]

My pool is pretty clear with a tint of green. I did bleach again today but it is not holding overnight. It is gone in the morning. Why is that?? Do I just keep putting bleach in until it holds overnight and it is no longer green???

[VickiP]

Hi, Just saw Chucks post. What is DE??? I read the thread but not sure what it is. Also we did have the water tested and no iron but small amt of copper and after the metal out the copper was not even reading. Should we still use the DE?

[CarlD]

Short answer? Yes!

If your chlorine isn't holding with a CYA of 30 you are fighting something, almost certainly algae. You need to raise your FC level to 15 and keep it there, checking it at least 3x/day until it holds and your water is clear.

I opened my pool late this year due to the lousy weather and family issues that kept me going from NJ to upstate NY every weekend so when I finally pulled the cover off, for the first time ever I opened to a solid algae bloom. I poured in literally a full 5 gallon carboy of 12% LC figuring my 8 year old liner was already faded so Who Cares if it bleaches more. 24 hours later my pool was nearly clear, and 48 hours later it was clear. Because I didn't mess around and killed EVERYTHING possibly growing in the pool.

Now I don't recommend this procedure but I was (to my shame) impatient and a little annoyed and, with an ugly old liner (installers did a hideous job with the sand) I wasn't worried about bleaching it. I DID, however, add the LC to the return stream so it wouldn't settle anywhere.

My point is you are better off risking a little fading than tolerating algae. You gotta kill it and the best way is with bleach/liquid chlorine maintained at shock levels.

[ChuckD]

Hi Vicki,
DE is Diatomaceous Earth, of course! Everyone knows that. (just kidding).

You can look up a better definition of DE on Wikipedia than I can give, but suffice to say it does the same thing your sand does, but better because it's a finer filter.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diatomaceous_Earth

It also requires a bit more work as you have to flush out the old and replace with new on occassion, sometimes frequently when you're fighting algae. But the results are the clearest water you'll ever see.

And because it's a naturally occuring substance it's fairly safe. When I flush, or more appropriately "backwash", I just run it out onto the yard. Been doing that for a couple years now and there's no trace of it or any damage. The first rain washes it into the ground.

But you can get the benefits of it with a sand filter too by adding a small amount. As you probably read, you'll have to add more each time you backwash the filter but the stuff's pretty cheap.


Hi, Just saw Chucks post. What is DE??? I read the thread but not sure what it is. Also we did have the water tested and no iron but small amt of copper and after the metal out the copper was not even reading. Should we still use the DE?

[VickiP]

Thanks so much Carl and Chuck. I will keep adding the bleach and keeping checking it. I will go to my pool store and get some of that DE and try it and see how it works. Thanks so much for the help I will let you guys know how it works.

[CarlD]

See if they have the 10lb box--the smallest amount. It will last years. Backwash then start with about 1/4 cup. Wait 20 min to 30 min and see if your pump pressure goes up 1 lb. If not, repeat with about 1/2 that amount. When the pressure has gone up 1lb, you'll know how much to use. If you put in too much, your pressure will shoot up and your flow to your skimmer and return will noticeably decrease. You'll have to backwash again to clear it out, then start again.

I don't think it adds anything during an algae fight--you don't need the filtering to be that fine until AFTER you've won the battle as the pressure will be rising every day from just the algae in the filter that you should be backwashing out everyday during the fight. After, the DE will help 'polish' your water till it looks crystal clear.

DE and skimmer socks are two of the cheapest, best additions to help keep your water beautiful.