Oval Pool Set up with pics and tips?

[Aranon]

I will be installing my pool in a couple of weeks with a beaded liner. Tahitian 18' x 40' x 54" buttless resin frame with aluminum track. Made by Sharkline. I am thinking of using Styrofoam for the bottom with cove foam and gorilla pad.

I have several questions, especially about after the frame is set up and I add 2" of Dow Chemical Blue Styrofoam board (Blue Board) will my beaded liner be to high to fit, or do they make the liner shorter by design and assume you are going to add 2" of sand in the bottom. Please explain.

Does anyone have any pictures of setting up an oval. hrsdennis had some great pics of setting up a round pool on sand. Maybe Dennis has some of setting up an oval, or anyone else. I am sure several people here would benefit from these. And if possible, does anyone have pics of using Styrofoam for the bottom that could show some pics. Maybe someone is putting one up in the next week that could take pics of the install and share them and any tips, tricks and any other information on installing a buttress-less oval. And tips on the beaded liner would help too.

Thanks,
Aranon

Tahitian 18'x40'x54" Resin/Metal (Sharkline)
Rolling Rock beaded liner 25 ga
Pentair 150 cartridge w/ 2 speed 1 1/2 Dynaflo
Dolphin Pool Rover
Diamond solar cover

[matt4x4]

My Recommendation to you is to build a 2" wall base out of compacted screenings (crusher run), this will "lift" your walls to accomodate the 2" of styrofoam and put everything back on the same level. The compactor will likely run you about 30 bucks for the day, you'll probably need 2-3 yds of screenings since you'll want them to go well beyond the edge of your bottom rail.

[Aranon]

Compact Screening, Cursher Run? I'm so confused. Whats is that. Please describe. I thoght I might just pour a small concrete rail about a foot wide to set the rail and post on. What is Compact Screening?

Thanks

Aranon

[hrsdennis]

Aranon, I will go through some old photos. I am sure I have some that might help you. I don't feature an oval on my site because there are just to many styles of side brace setups. I think it would be to confusing.

Beaded liners are supposed to allow for a 2" base. But as I have said before that does not mean much. It could be big, small or just right. With an oval pool you cannot raise the outer level to allow for the foam. I believe you have straps with your oval pool and those must lay at ground level. And they must be covered by sand or foam.

later, Dennis

[Aranon]

This sounds like good news. You saying that I just put my pool up on my Laser Leveled ground that I scraped with a tractor and blade and used mason sand to make perfectly level.

If I understand you right I set my rails on the level ground and I will set my buttress-less post on leveled concrete or patio stones. I will try and get the patio stones perfectly level and at the same height within and 1/8 of an inch of each other. I have a couple of lasers ( rotary and split-beam) and a transit.

After I set up my track and sides. I lay (cut to fit) my 2" Styrofoam Blue board. Stick my foam cove on it and put in my liner and it should line up with the beaded receiver track because it expects 2" of something under the liner within the walls. Correct? When do I put in the Gorilla Liner? Do I put it on top of the foam cove or under it. I am assuming I go in this order:
1. Leveling sand
2. Styrofoam
3. Gorilla Liner
4. Foam cove
5. Liner
6. Water
7. Margarita
8. Suntan Lotion
9. Sun glasses
10. Jump in

Does sound about right Dennis?

Thank you,
Aranon

[chazzilla]

To be honest with you, I would skip the gorilla pad. Mine came in today, and I was kind of disappionted. It seems to me that it is just heavy duty felt, and yes it is a cloth, that is about 1/8" thick. The pictures on most website make it look like it is thick or has some substance, it doesnt. I am not saying it will not do it's job (protecting the liner!) whick is why we intalled anyway, but if I had it to do again I would have just used styrofoam instead. In my opinion you shouldn't need to use both.

Good Luck
Chaz

[hrsdennis]

Chaz, thanks so much for that update on the gorilla pad. In the nick of time.

I installed a pool yesterday where the customer had ordered a pad like that. I had the option of putting it above or below the sand. He bought it to protect the pool from gophers. It was a good heavy fabric but since it would not lay flat I opted to put it under the sand. I felt I could smooth the sand much better than the fabric. As for the gophers, I think it was an excellent idea.

I wasn’t sure if the Gorilla pad was fabric or foam. Foam pads do make a nice base for liners. I am not crazy about fabric. Just a little tough to get smooth.

Aranon, Once your wall is up of course, I would do the pad then the foam and then the coving and then that other good stuff.

It sounds to me like you have it well under control. I could be much more helpful if I had photos to work with. If of course you were to need it.

As for the liner, if it does not seem to fit correctly, there are work a rounds.

Later, Dennis

[Aranon]

So I have the order down right? At least at the beginning. Is this how you would do it? Still waiting to see if I'm going about this correctly. Gee, it seems that that is an awful big liner to be fighting with. Any ideas on how to lay it out and set it up and where to start with the bead and I can't figure out how a vacuum would help hooked up on one end and the other end of the pool is 40 ft. away. Please help with all of the above. Please. Aranon

[chazzilla]

Man, I hear ya. Maybe Dennis can drop us some hints. The first liner install we did 4 years ago, we tried the vacuum thing, and it didn't seem to do anything. It was a jhook, but still. We just did our best, and had wrinkles all in it.:( Sure makes you respect all the Professionals out there. Our family has nothing to do with thinking that I can do as good of a job as them, and save a boat load of cash while Im at it, but more for the challenge that it presents. Ive always thought if I can do it half as good as them, then Ill be satisfied. The main thing is thinking realistic!

[huskerfan]

Here's a pic of the base framework of our 18x34 buttressless oval pool. The most important part of setting up any type of pool is getting the patio blocks set as close to perfectly level as possible, and use larger ones on the sides under the side uprights as that's where the most of the pressure will be. If you have to "fill" in anything - use stone dust/ aka crusher, screenings... like Matt said. I had to drive 3 hours to a Quarry to get some in Nebraska. Local gravel places... don't carry it here. It's basically crushed limestone. Not powder limestone, though- don't confuse that. As said- you can't build up an oval because of the strapping system underneath it. you can see the metal straps in the photo on ours.

After assembling the walls- we put on the wall foam, coving strips on the bottom (the kind with the peel away tape are wonderful), then spread our sand and compacted it good, then put on a blue wave pad, liner, water, steps... we were too tired for the margarita part, lol. The pool pad helped to keep footprints out of the sand, but it was really hot the day we put ours up, and the liner didn't slide well on it. Don't forget to pile your sand and liner inside the pool area before putting up your walls. Not sure exactly why you want to use styrofoam??? Also- make sure you have some slope running down and away from your pool.

Matt gave me very good instructions for vacuuming the liner while you fill it - it worked great for us and saved us a bunch of wrinkles. My 9 yr old manned the switch on the vac for me, as it'll make an aweful sound when all the air is out, and you'll have to shut it off then. Wait a little bit- then run it again.

For us - the strapping system and the extra details that come with an oval, took as long to assemble as probably a whole round pool. Just a price you have to pay if that's all your yard will accomodate. Professionals charge more too- for that reason, to install an oval vrs. a round. I'm confident mine is every bit as sturdy and secure as any round out there.

DIY is a lot of work - would I do it again, probably not, lol, mainly because my hubby isn't fond of our pool, and it was a big job, don't kid yourself! Great pride in it now, though! Even my 9 year old helped a lot with both our pool and deck, and tells everyone who comes to swim. It's all worth it in the end!

[Aranon]

Thanks Donya for the info and the picture. Surely you took more pictures during your project. Please say you did. Would you post more pics. The one you sent really helps. I now am starting to grasp what I will be doing. Please send more.

Aranon

[matt4x4]

Aranon - the pic from donya - huskerfan, shows you what screenings look like, copacted screenings - I just meant don't just put the stuff down, it HAS to be compacted using a power compacter - available for 30 bucks a day at your local tool rental.
Screenings is what they're called in Canada, I believe they're called crusher run in the USA, but don't quote me - essentially it 's the little bits and pieces that fall out the bottom of the crusher that makes 3/4" gravel from stone, the pieces are rice crispy sized right down to stone dust and compact extremely well with moisture.

[huskerfan]

Unfortunately, when we lost all the info. on the old forum, we lost a very detailed letter by Matt explaining step by step how to install a pool. When we put ours up - I posted, usually with pics every night to show our progress. Here are some more photos that might be of help.

Use the instruction manual with caution - sometimes just go with your instincts and common sense. After your ground is as level as you can get it - go ahead and assemble your bottom rail and boots. We started out measuring and setting our blocks that way, and it wasn't coming out, so we scrapped the instructions, set up the bottom of the pool, placed and marked off where the blocks should be - then set the blocks. The main area that needs to be level is all the way around where the pool wall will sit. We left the middle of our pool flat and didn't dig a deep end or anything. My daughter was borderline touching the way it was with our 54"wall. Some say if you dish out the middle your liner will stretch more and you'll have less wrinkles, this only applies to rounds, not ovals. With the strapping system underneath you need the ground to support it.

Our instructions said that with our liner we didn't need to use the white plastic coping strips, but they really should be used as extra insurance.

You'll notice the scallop effect on the sides - we still have that - not quite as noticeable, but it still is there. I've seen other oval pics and they had it too, so due to the design of the pool I think they're inevitable. You don't notice it so much after the top rail goes on.

I "luckily" missed out on spreading the liner out, had to return the compactor while that was being done. There are marks/arrows on it showing where they need to go. I don't think anyone can get a pool completely wrinkle free - but we're pretty close.

To use the vacuum to suck the air out between the wall and the liner, take cardboard and cut it a few inches bigger than the shape of your skimmer and return holes. On the piece that goes over the skimmer hole- cut a hole in the middle of it, big enough for the shop vac hose to go through it. Go ahead and push a couple feet of hose through it, then tape around the edges of the hose. If you use wall foam, cut a circle out of the middle of the skimmer hole just big enough to put your vac hose through. DO NOT CUT THROUGH THE LINER! Run the hose in between the wall/wallfoam and the liner and tape all the way around the cardboard to the outside wall of the pool to close off the skimmer hole, then tape a piece of cardboard over the return hole also. Have someone manning the switch on the vac, as when the air is all removed between the wall and liner ours made a heck of a noise and needed to be shut off. Keep turning it back on and off and I stayed inside the pool and worked the wrinkles out on the floor with a good garage broom. The water was mighty chilly to be in, but worth the effort. After we had about a foot of water in the pool we put our walk in/wedding cake steps in, and secured them down with 5 sand bags. I used a piece of vinyl underneath them for added protection to the liner.

We never had to adjust the top of the liner when it was filling, actually it went pretty smooth all in all.

Matt was VERY supportive all the way through our installation - you have to keep reminding yourself of the finished product and the fun and relaxation you'll have with it for many, many years!!!

[ShelleyAnn]

I know I read that the patio blocks on the round ends aren't really necessary as there is really no downward pressure on the ends--just outward. We are ready to put the sides up and I need to know whether to stop everyone and go get some 12 x 12 or continue. Akkkkkkk!

[huskerfan]

I would highly recommend to use the 12x12 blocks on the oval ends. They're cheap and keep the bottom boot of the pool cleaner too. I'm all for overkill when it comes to something you want to last 30+years!!

You shouldn't be using 12x12 blocks on the sides where the buttress free uprights go - there is a thicker heavier duty block made: I believe they're approx. 3 inches thick x approx. 14 inches long- don't quote me, but close to there. Get the solid ones - not the ones with the holes in them. That is where your pressure lies- you need the heavier ones there. You can find them at Menards, Lowes - or wherever you bought the other ones from. If you look closely at one of my pics above - you'll see them and they are set back outside of the uprights as pictured.

[huskerfan]

Sorry - the blocks should be approx. 3inches thick x 6 or 7 inches wide x approx. 14 inches long. It's a standard size - there are no other sizes to choose from.

[huskerfan]

You do realize the blocks will have to be set in the ground - so the top of them is level with the top of the ground, right?? It's going to take a little while to set them all - but I sure would do it- all the way around the pool, 12x12's on the oval ends, and solid 3x6x14's on the sides!

[Aranon]

Thanks for the pics Donya (huskerfan). They really help. Waiting for my city permit to be approved before I start the electrical.

[ShelleyAnn]

Too late on the sides, Huskerfan, they've been burried per specs for a week now. Our instruction manual required 12 x 12 along with crusher fines and said the round ends were optional since there is no downward pressure there, so that's what we ended up going with. Our soil is black clay that was professionally tamped. By the look and feel of it, I think we're going to be okay...maybe for only 20 years though. :)

Shelley

[hrsdennis]

Here is one I came up with. It is a 15 x 30 oval just before the wall was installed. It shows the side supports in place, the sand in the middle and the bottom rails leveled. On this model I install the pressure plates after the wall is up and before spreading the sand.

Dennis
108

[NWMNMom]

In our area, the standard for the solid blocks is 4x8x16, the 3x6x14 are not available. Ask the local building supply about solid cinder/concrete blocks, they will direct you to what is available.