Tsp ?? Whats this, Super green pool Help !

[spankypsl]

Help. My sister has been fighting what the pool store calls "Tsp" aka. phosphorus. I am totaly sold on the Bleach ( you saved my pool !) Now WE have to save hers!! Where do we start... Can this be fixed with just bleach ??? They said to drain the pool and to use ton of acid, chlorine. Whats your call.....
I thank any and all help.....

[spankypsl]

I forgot to state it is a above the ground pool.

[CarlD]

"How many psychologists does it take to change a light bulb?
One. But the light bulb has to want to change."

If your sister believes that the pool store guys know more than us, there's no point..."the light bulb has to want to change."

But if she worries they are BS'ing her, then we can help. Phosphate fighting is the latest expensive scam pool stores are pushing.

First, we need test values posted. If the pool store ran them, then post them. We'll need FC, CC, pH, T/A, CYA, and CH.

What are the dimensions of the pool? Is it round, or oval and how deep? (the water depth, not the wall height.

With those numbers we should be able to tell what's going on. But I expect that, as usual, massive dosing to shock levels with good ol' bleach for several days will fix it.

[poolmimi]

"How many psychologists does it take to change a light bulb?
One. But the light bulb has to want to change."

Amen...I tried to get my sister-in-law to read the forum and use these methods last year after she kept complaining about how she couldn't keep algae out of her pool, couldn't keep PH down, all the chemicals she'd bought, etc.

No go, she didn't think it would work and couldn't believe my water was clear using bleach. Finally this spring, she asked if I could help her get her pool cleaned up. It was VERY green.

End of the story, she states now "My pool never looked so good!"

[JohnT]

Amen...I tried to get my sister-in-law to read the forum and use these methods last year after she kept complaining about how she couldn't keep algae out of her pool, couldn't keep PH down, all the chemicals she'd bought, etc.

No go, she didn't think it would work and couldn't believe my water was clear using bleach. Finally this spring, she asked if I could help her get her pool cleaned up. It was VERY green.



Same story with one of my neighbors. Even after her daughter commented on how my pool water "glitters" and I told her about using bleach and keeping the CYA down, she still thinks I just spend more time taking care of my pool than they do. She's always trying magic chemicals and fighting algae and cloudy water, and said she'd never be able to put bleach in her pool. Oh well...

[CarlD]

Same story with one of my neighbors. Even after her daughter commented on how my pool water "glitters" and I told her about using bleach and keeping the CYA down, she still thinks I just spend more time taking care of my pool than they do. She's always trying magic chemicals and fighting algae and cloudy water, and said she'd never be able to put bleach in her pool. Oh well...

Tell her to try liquid chlorine from the pool sto... no, never mind. Not your problem. You told her how you do it, she didn't believe you--stay WELL away!

[JohnT]

Tell her to try liquid chlorine from the pool sto... no, never mind. Not your problem. You told her how you do it, she didn't believe you--stay WELL away!

Tried that. You know the drill.....When she asks for help, I'll be glad to give it.

[spankypsl]

OK here is her numbers.....

chlorine - 0

Water ph - 7.6

Total Alkalinity - 120

Calc. hardness - 200

Cyanuric Acid - 0

Above Ground, Round, 12,000, Sand Filt. & 4 feet aprox.

She added 6 bleach 4/25 showed chlorine this morning but 0 now.

NOW here we go all help and basic walk though please !!

( Should she drain any water ?)

[Watermom]

No, she doesn't need to drain any water. She has algae simply because she has no chlorine in her pool. Even though she has added some bleach, without having any cya in there, the chlorine isn't going to stick around long especially if it is hot and sunny.

For now, she needs to test her water at least 2x a day (and 3x a day would be better) and each time, add enough bleach to get her chlorine reading back up to 8-10. This is the only way to kill algae -- to sustain a high chlorine level. If it yo-yos up and down, she'll never defeat it. Also, run the pump 24/7 while trying to clear the water.

After the water clears, then she'll need to add some cya. Add enough per label directions to get a reading of about 25 ppm for now. She can add it directly into the skimmer while the pump is running. It will take up to a week to dissolve in the filter, so during that time, she shouldn't retest for it nor add any more. Don't want to overshoot the target. It is easier to add a little more later if needed, but if you get too much in there, the only way to reduce it is to do a partial drain. Until the cya begins to dissolve, her chlorine will disappear pretty quick so she'll need to continue testing at least 2x a day so the algae won't return. After the cya begins to show up, she'll be able to just test and dose with bleach in the evenings only. Hope this helps.

PH, alk and calcium all look fine.

[chem geek]

The quickest and easiest way to get both chlorine and CYA into the pool is to use Dichlor powder. Just keep in mind that for every 1.0 ppm FC that is added, you will be adding 0.9 ppm CYA. So adding enough Dichlor to get to around 20 ppm CYA should be enough to prevent the huge reduction from sunlight while not being too much until this algae problem gets cleared up. Once the equivalent of around 20 ppm FC or CYA is added via Dichlor, switch to bleach only at shock levels to get rid of the algae.

I just figure using only bleach at this point is going to be hard since it will be burning off very quickly from sunlight in addition to getting consumed by fighting the algae. I agree that you need to be careful to not add too much, but that can all be calculated readily based on what I said above (i.e. don't add more than 20 ppm FC worth of Dichlor to the pool). It takes 3 pounds of Dichlor per 10,000 gallons of pool water to raise the FC by 20 ppm and the CYA by 18 ppm.

Richard

[waterbear]

I wouldn't suggest raising the FC to 20 ppm with a vinyl liner pool. By chemgeeks calculations each pound of dichlor will raise FC about 7 ppm rounded off) and CYA about 6 ppm. I would raise the FC like watermom suggested with dichlor until 4 lbs had been used in total and then switch to bleach to maintain 12-15 ppm until the water is clear.

[spankypsl]

Ok, Wow thank you all so much for all of your help. But... What is Dichlor powder ?? This is my first time hearing of it, When I switched it was just loads and loads of liquid bleach And I'm sorry you lost me :confused: with all of your numbers. How do I figurure this all out on just how much to add, to test and where do I buy this powder? Again I thank you all so much for your time and patience with us. By the way We live in South Florida so the sun has been very hot.

[chem geek]

Thanks Evan for clarifying what I meant which was to use a cumulative total of 20 ppm FC of Dichlor. I didn't mean to use it all in one shot! Shows what happens when I've got a concept in my mind and only some of the words come out in a post.

It will take 3.6 pounds of Dichlor total (cumulative) that you should use, but as Evan says, not all at once. Here's a plan I think everyone will be happy with:

1) Add 2.5 pounds of powdered Dichlor. That should raise your Free Chlorine (FC) level by about 14 and the CYA level by about 13 (Evan, these numbers use the 12,000 gallon pool volume given in an earlier post).

2) Keep track of the chlorine level and if it dips down towards 10, add another pound of Dichlor which will add about 5.5 ppm FC and 5 ppm CYA.

3) Keep track of the chlorine level and as it dips down towards 10, add one gallon of 6% bleach (Clorox Regular, or off-brand Ultra) which will add about 5 ppm FC (and no CYA).

Repeat step 3 (that is, using only bleach) until the algae turns from green to blue-gray to gray to cloudy white to clear. Run the pump 24/7 and brush the sides of the pool periodically (carefully, using a soft brush).

Your local pool store is sure to have Dichlor. It is any of the following brands and is normally used for spas (but there is absolutely nothing wrong with using it for pools when you want to add both chlorine and CYA in a hurry):

SpaGuard Chlorinating Concentrate
GLB Granular Dichlor
Rendevous Chlorinating Concentrate Granular
Leisure Time Spa 56 Chlorinating Granules
Robarb Granular Dichlor
Robarb Sani-Spa
Most any chlorine that says "Dichlor" and is in granular or powder form (not solid tabs).

Richard

[waterbear]

you can find dichlor under a lot of brand names. Look on the ingredients
it will say Sodium Dichloro-s-Triazine-Trione Dihydrate or something very similar (their are variations on how the name is written. Look for the dicloro part and the triazinetrinone part and you have the right thing.

[aylad]

You can also get it at WalMart, Lowe's, or Home Depot, and it's usually cheaper than at the pool store.

Like Waterbear said, just look for dicloro.......... on the ingredient label.

Janet