10% bleach

[ShelleyAnn]

Hello all :)

A friend of mine just mentioned she works for a chemical company and can get me 10% bleach in a 15 gallon drum for $.82 a gallon! Lucky me. My question is...how to store it. It comes in this drum that weighs who knows what (no that is not the question) and as you all know I will need it in smaller doses on a frequent, regular basis. Since I have all these generic 172 oz. bleach containers hanging around (:o), do you think I can just refill these and store them under the basement stairs as usual? Will they handle 10% v 6%? I would need about 11 of them to handle the 15 gallons, but I think I have the room.

I'm also thinking of doing this now as it will cost me $12.30 and I will probably go through that much in the generic from WalM between now and closing and may have some left over for next May. Will it turn to water being under my stairs from now till then? Savings is savings huh?

Thank you all for your thoughs and suggestions

15x30 AG

[chem geek]

The more concentrated 10% bleach (or liquid chlorine) is less stable than household 5% or 6% bleach. It is very, very important to store it at cool temperatures and absolutely keep it away from sunlight. Half of the chlorine will breakdown in about 220 days at a temperature of 77F. At a higher temperature of 96F, it will lose half its strength in around 100 days.

So this is probably something that you won't be able to buy once and store for an entire pool season, but it is something that you could buy and replenish once a month or two (assuming you can store it at 77F). So you probably can't keep it from one season to the next and you probably can't keep it throughout a single season either. It won't go completely to water (actually, to sodium chloride salt plus chlorates and chlorites), but it will likely turn into something closer to the 5%/6% household bleach. Since it's so darn cheap, however, you could just experiment and see what kind of concentration you get by carefully measuring portions into your pool and seeing the resulting chlorine rise (do this at night) after circulating for about an hour. Once you've got this huge drum (and it's so cheap), who cares if the chlorine weakens over time (unless it weakens to less than household bleach).

As far as your jugs handling 10% vs. 5%/6% the answer is yes. The plastic should handle the 10% without a problem and as far as I can tell the plastic in the 12.5% chlorinating liquid I buy is the same as found in Clorox jugs.

Richard

[ShelleyAnn]

Let's see, it's 11am and it's 75 degrees currently in my basement office on the east side of the house on what will be the last of a 90+ degree week. I plan to store it in the closet under the stairs, a tad more interior to the house. Will I be able to calculate accurately when it begins to degrade? It sounds like I might be guessing towards the end of the supply. For that matter, what is the generic WalM bleach measuring at right now after being manufactured, shipped, stored, shipped again, stored and put on the shelf? Hmmm.

[Spensar]

The higher concentration is less stable and breaks down quicker. But like you said, this drum will likely be mostly gone by the end of the season. For that price, keep it cool and don't sweat it for sure!

How are you going to get it of the drun into bottles? Is there a pump you can get, or do you have to tip the drum. Maybe a tap so you can have the drum on a bench or something and use that. Just wondering how you will handle it, as I have enough clothes with nice white specks from javex splashing.

[Poconos]

Since Shelly brought up the issue of Walmart bleach, I should say something now. I'll start a separate thread soon if I find something odd. A few weeks ago checked a sample of the 6% Ultra and found it somewhere just nder 3%. Kept thinking I was doing something wrong. Tried again today, different batch of bleach, two different dilution techniques to get a 10,000:1 reduction and came up with 2.8 & 3% respectively. 1st try was a two step, 10:1 reduction then a 1000:1 to get the 2.8%. Next tried a 10,000:1 directly using a 1000 ml fleaker and an insulin syringe to get an accurate 0.2 ml bleach volume. result was 3%. Now I'm wondering what's up with the Walmart stuff. Also plugged the numbers into Michaels bleach calc and got about the same concentration knowing how much 174 oz raises the pool. Next time at Malwart I'm getting a small jug of their generic and one of Clorox and will check them both.
Al

[ShelleyAnn]

Oh I am sooooo eager to see how your experiment comes out! Wouldn't doubt the generic stuff would loose so much considering WalM and the path it takes. I'm thinking I'll truly get very very close to 10% with this suppier.

Shelley

[Jakebear]

Next tried a 10,000:1 directly using a 1000 ml fleaker and an insulin syringe to get an accurate 0.02 ml bleach volume. result was 3%. Now I'm wondering what's up with the Walmart stuff.

Is your mix ratio correct?? --- I use .1 ml bleach in a 10L sample of my well water (no chlorine to start) this gives me a free Cl of 5.8ppm with fresh Clorox Ultra consistently. You need .00001L/L to do the ratio

I derived my mix from Carl's 1.88 per 5gal h20

http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/showthread.php?t=4781&highlight=1.88

If I'm wrong please let me know!!

[Poconos]

You're diluting more than me. 100,000:1 with the 0.1 ml per 10L ratio. Diluting 10,000:1 with 6% should yield a 6 ppm concentration.
6% is 60,000 ppm so dividing by 10,000 is 6 ppm. I actually did a 5000:1 dilution for the check which should have yielded a 12 ppm concentration.
Likewise, if I'm doing something really stupid I'd sure like to be enlightened. Fact that the rise in FC in the pool after adding a big jug is about what is expected if the bleach is 3%.
My friend grabbed a jug of Clorox at K-mart today so I'll try that tomorrow.
Al

[Poconos]

Just a followup....results of checking Clorox vs Walmart bleach are inconclusive. Not sure why but the results are all over the map in spite of trying to be as precise as possible with the dilutions. All I can say is I never got any bleach concentration at or above 5.25% with any samples. Wish I had a pool store closeer than a half hour away but in any case next time I'm there I will check on the higher concentration stuff.
Al

[Phillbo]

I'll bet the walmart stuff sits on a dock or in a wharehouse for a long time before being shipped to the stores.

[Spensar]

I'll bet the walmart stuff sits on a dock or in a wharehouse for a long time before being shipped to the stores.

Then again, they do such massive volumes, there is a great chance it is fresher than anywhere else. Walmart also has very tight inventory controls and doesn't have months of commodity products like bleach sitting in warehouses tying up room and cashflow.

[rlanthony@excite.com]

To get the bleach from the large 15 gal. to the smaller bottles, buy a small bellows fluid siphon. Probably can get for $3-5.00. Just pump the plastic bellows pump to get started and fill away. The big jug need to be above the smaller jug for the siphon to work. To stop just put the end of the hose above the big jug and put another small jug on the floor to fill.
Rick