Cloudy - shock????

[rferrel1]

First year with a pool in a LOOOONNGG time - first time with BBB

11,550 gal oval 15x30 AG
CYA 40
TC 12.5
CC 0
pH 7.2
water TEMP 88
(temps around here have been up around 95-100 for the last couple of weeks)

had a heavier than average bathing load this weekend BUT for me that was just 3 boys (6-10years) - Will bringing the TC up to 15 for a couple of days (per Ben's best guess CYA chart) help with the cloudiness? I realize my pH is at the bottom of optimal but so far I haven't had to mess with it much to keep it there.

Thanks for any suggestions.

[CarlD]

What are your calcium hardness and total alkalinity levels?

Is the cloud white or green?

[rferrel1]

sorry - I haven't been testing my Ca since the first time as I "assumed" it was unnecessary with a vinyl liner and I have no excuse as to why I didn't do the TA. I will do those tests this evening when I get home. I checked the chlorine this a.m. again with the "blue box" drops test and it still read 10+ so I'm not losing a lot of chlorine at night anyway.

I'll repeat all tests this evening. I am running the filter 24/7 (since Saturday)
We're expecting another 100 degree day today.

thanks for the response. Robin

[rferrel1]

cloudy - white

TA - 60
Calcium Hardness - 110

Although TC is still over 10, I added an additional quart last night to "guarantee" maintaining that today with the 100+ temps.

[CarlD]

Are you chlorinating with Cal-Hypo? If so, the usual answer is to add a dose of Muriatic acid and that should clear it. But you pH is low so you have to be careful with that, then add Borax to immediately raise it again.

[chem geek]

Just a guess, but there might be a problem with the filtration/circulation. Your numbers do not indicate cloudiness from the TA/CH/pH combo. Carl is right that adding either calcium to your pool (as with Cal-Hypo) or adding soda ash (sodium carbonate) to raise pH will often cloud the pool, but normally this goes away relatively quickly, especially in your situation with your pool water balance.

If you've got suspended particles causing the cloudy water, then your filter should normally clear that out which is why I brought up your checking your sand filter to make sure it's operating properly. I don't have a sand filter so don't know how to see if it's working correctly, needs backwashing, etc. so others will have to help on that front.

Richard

[rferrel1]

adding regular Clorox bleach 6% since mid-July. I backwashed the filter last Friday - actually the day before the cloudiness appeared. Pool/filter is only 2+ months old - water went into pool Memorial weekend. Got fairly "cursory" backwash instructions from the install guys but they are local so I could have them come back out. I do have the manual and as best I can tell I am following instructions correctly.

Is it possible I'm not running the backwash long enough - I'm waiting until the water clears and then rinsing for 30 seconds after. Any other suggestions. I did use the 3" Wal-Mart brand pucks in an autochlorinator until mid-July - just until my CYA got up to the 40-50 range. The autochlorinator is hard-plumbed in. I still have it "open" with no pucks in - should I set it to 0 (i'm guessing this really doesn't matter since there are no pucks in the chamber) I know my sand filter is a Sta-rite with a 1.5hp pump but couldn't tell you the size etc.

When I vacuum (automatic Lil' Shark) I've been vacuuming to "filter" - should I vacuum to waste??

[Simmons99]

Try getting some skimmer socks from Wal-Mart - or just cut the ends off some old nylons and put it on the skimmer basket.

Also - how long are you running your pump/filter a day? You need to make sure that you are circulating double the volume of water everyday.

Another thing you can do is purchase some DE and put some (I think a 1/2-1 pound) in your skimmer. This will go directly onto your sand filter and help filter out smaller particles. Be aware that when you backwash - all of the DE will wash out - so I would try this last.

[rferrel1]

thanks for the suggestion - I'll try the "skimmer socks" - I've already been doing the old nylons thing whenever I cut the grass around the pool.

For the last week I've been running the filter 24/7. Last night I vacuumed the pool (definitely some green on the bottom which has me puzzled as the chlorine has checked as low as 2 over the last 3 weeks but never lower) and then backwashed for a full 5 minutes/rinsed a full minute. Added water overnight as well as an additional 3/4 gal of bleach per the bleach calc - chlorine was 12.5 when I got home - that got it up to 18.
Checked this a.m. and it was 17.

Filter still going - will vaccum again this evening. Still kinda' waiting to hear if I need to add BS to get the TA up.

[aylad]

It wouldn't hurt--I'd get it up to the 80-90 range and see how that does for you.

Janet

[stma]

Hey Rob:::
I'd bring the TA level up with the baking soda...little at a time directly into the skimmer....
try this tonite though:
When the sun goes down, shine a flashlight into the water and check if you can see the tiny particles that in fact make up the "cloud" in your cloudy pool....If so, the nylon sock should do the trick....but be sure to check the sock every so often so it doesn't clog the skimmer then ultimately the filter.
After doing such, perhaps you may want to shut the filter down for the nite to see if the cloud settles to the bottom of the pool....Although I would NEVER reccomend a pool store for ANYTHING, you may want to get a clarifying agent to see if that can bring the "cloud" together.....

I feel your pain....BELIEVE ME !!!.....(but that's why God created Budweiser)

[mbar]

I would keep the chlorine up at 15 for a while longer - be consistant, don't let it fall until it holds steady overnight. Your water will clear with the high chlorine levels.

[Jeffski]

Can you swim with chlorine levels that high?

[Simmons99]

You can - but it may fade your suit.

[chem geek]

Even the high FC of 15 in the presence of 40 ppm CYA won't likely fade your swimming suit or have other ill effects. The CYA makes the disinfecting chlorine (HOCl) concentration only 0.36 ppm and that is far less than the 1-1.5 ppm (of HOCl, 2-3 ppm FC) typically found in indoor pools that have no CYA. When my wife uses the indoor pool at the local community center during the winter, her suits do wear out (usually the rubber goes before the suit fades). She does not find any such problem with our outdoor pool that has 15 ppm CYA and typically 3 ppm FC in it.

Now on the other hand, I wouldn't want to swallow this water with higher chlorine levels, but then I wouldn't want to drink pool water in any event. Bottom line is that I think you are safe though this is not conventional wisdom.

Richard

[chem geek]

I must add to what I said in my previous post. I would not go into the water if the CC > 0 (> 0.5 or so) OR if you are still losing a lot of chlorine overnight. Having a high FC with CYA may not be a problem, but if the CC > 0 or you are losing chlorine overnight then this means there is still a lot of stuff getting killed or oxidized in the pool and you don't want to get exposed to that stuff if you can help it.

Richard

[rferrel1]

thanks for all the great advice. We've finally had some rain today. I turned off the filter this a.m. to hopefully let anything that was still being circulated fall to the bottom. I had to pump off some water this morning to keep it from overflowing but my FC was still at 15 this morning. I'm guessing that with the 2 backwashes and letting some off this morning I'm going to need to add some CYA. i'm keeping my fingers crossed to seeing some improvement when I get home.

[rferrel1]

Just reporting in - water finally cleared yesterday. I did end up putting some 3" pucks in the autochlorinator because due to the 2 full 5min backwashes/1min rinse cycles, my CYA had gotten down to around 30. Thanks for encouraging me to stick with the consistent shock level as I'm quite sure that's what eventually solved the problem. robin

[Watermom]

Since your cya is 30, you are fine to use the pucks for a while. But, keep an eye on the cya level. It is amazing how quickly the trichlor pucks can cause it to get to a level that is higher than you want. 30-50 is what we usually recommend. I like mine 40-45.