Brown sediment and Green Water after Metal Treatment

[mariella]

Hi, I'm a newbie posting here, and hoping that some of you wise folk can help me out. I've been reading the forums, and it sounds like you guys give some great advice!

When we "opened" our pool Memorial Day weekend, we had to put in about 1.5 feet of well water, which is loaded with iron and copper. We knew about this, and just figured we would throw some SuperErace in, and it would do the trick, as in previous years.

Well, not this year.

Over the past 6 weeks, we have put in about 5 bottles of SuperErace, per the instructions of our pool store, cleaned the filter about 20 times, and even hooked up a secondary filter to help clean our pool.

The water has gone from olive-green to brown to greenish-blue to clear to greenish-blue again.

Now, the water is relatively clear, but we have about 1 foot of cloudy water at the bottom, and this brownish dust all over everything. You can see it collecting on the pool steps, and ALL over the bottom of the pool. When we try to vacuum, the hose stirs everything up, makes the pool cloudy, and it takes about 4 - 5 days to settle down again.

I THINK that this brown sediment is giving the water the greenish tint. Our pool store has tested the water, about a zillion times, and they have said "no metals" in the pool water for about the last 3 weeks. That was the last time we put in the Super Erace.

I am pretty sure that algae is not giving the pool this greenish color. The water does not feel slimy, the pool walls do not feel slimy, and there is no ring around the edge.

Here are the vitals: :)

24' X 4 feet above ground pool
vinyl liner
Sta-Rite Cartridge filter

Test Results:
TC 3 ppm
FC .5 ppm
Ph 7.5
Alk 110 ppm
Cya 30 or maybe a little lower

These are from last night. This morning I did a quick check on the chlorine, and the TC had dropped to 1ppm.

So, I know something is eating my chlorine. Is this because the cya is too low?

Also, does anyone have any suggestions for getting rid of the brown dust in my pool? Do you think that I need even more sequesterant?

Our plan today is to vacuum very very very slowly, while cleaning the filter a zillion times again. But I know this will stir the water up again and make it cloudy.

Any suggestions would be GREATLY appreciated!

Sorry for such a long post. Hope this made sense!

[mbar]

You can leave the filter off for the night, then in the morning vacuum to waste, moving the vacuum head really slowly. You can also try a filter sock - they sell them in pool stores, or you can cut the leg of pantyhose or tights and put the foot in the skimmer basket and roll the top over the skimmer basket - it will catch really small particles. You may need to take your pool up to shock to break down the particles. With a cya of 30, you can take your chlorine up to 15ppms. If you have a DE or sand filter you can put a trichlor puck in the skimmer basket, to help if there is any metal that isn't sequestered to hit the chlorine puck in the skimmer basket and fall out in the filter instead of in the pool. Do not use the puck in the skimmer if you have a cartridge filter. If you have any questions, please ask. Welcome to the forum!

[mariella]

Thanks for the response, Marie!

Before I got your reply, we did vacuum the pool yesterday. We tried traditional vacuuming, but the filter just spit everything back into the pool. (Yes, we did clean the filter first). So, we vacuumed to waste.

Unfortunately, no matter how slowly you move and vacuum, the stuff is so fine, that it clouds up. So, we now have a very cloudy pool again. Fortunately, we did get a lot of nasty, tan, milky-looking water full of crud OUT of the pool, though.

I figure that this will be the process: vacuum, wait for the dust to settle, vacuum, wait again, etc. until we get all of this nasty stuff out of the pool.

My new question: Do you know of anything that will make the stuff settle to the bottom of the pool faster? I am guessing that turning the filter off at night will do this, right? Do you think a flocculant would help, too? Would raising the chlorine to 15ppm help as well?

Oh, by the way, we have a cartridge filter, so I can't put the puck in the skimmer. :(

I know I should be patient, but our swim season is already half over here in CT, and we haven't been in the pool once!
I don't know who is more impatient, me or my kids :)

[mbar]

Yes, you can try a flocculant, or even a clarifier. The clarifier will grab onto the small particles and make them clump together more so they can be filtered out. Also a skimmer sock, or the leg of tights really does catch a lot of little particles. I would also take it up to shock for a while, consistant high clorine levels most often is the answer to cleaing up cloudy water.

[mariella]

We did put in a bottle of clarifier this past Monday. Would it screw things up to put more in?

I will definitely bring up the chlorine to shock levels today.

[mbar]

I wouldn't put anymore clarifier in. I would just be very consistant with keeping the chlorine level at shock for a couple of days. You should see your start to improve. If after a couple of days you don't see improvement, then you can use a floc.

[mariella]

Thanks so much Marie! I will follow that course of action, bringing the chlorine up, and turning off the filter at night, and vacuuming. I will let you know how things look in a few days!!

[sw_stupid]

Please keep posting your status. I have the EXACT same problem. "Dirt" settles to the bottom of my pool, but my chemistry seems okay. No algae seems to be growing anywhere so I think it's just sediment too. So, keep posting - I'm kinda following in your lead.

[mariella]

Turning off the filter at night helps ALOT!! All of the stuff does settle down, and we are able to vacuum the stuff out. We have done this twice already, and the water is definitely bluer. We figure 2 more times, and then we will be good.

Only problem is, since we are vacuuming to waste so much, we now have to add water. Which I am terrified to do. I ordered a filter that you attach to your garden hose, which supposedly filters out the iron and copper before it gets to the pool. But this won't be here for at least a week :(

So, we may just have to bite the bullet, and add the well water again. Of course, I will add the metal out first, and hopefully, we won't start this vicious cycle all over again!

[mbar]

mariella, just make sure there is enough sequestering agent in the water. Add your fill water through the skimmer and you should be fine. When adding, just keep your ph on the low side.

[mariella]

How low should the pH be, mbar? And, should the chlorine also be low?

I have to tell you, I am terrified about adding the new water! We finally have all of the stuff vacuumed, and the pool is BLUE!!

I don't want to go back to where I was, but we seriously have to add water.

[mbar]

Just keep your ph at 7.2, and add the water through the skimmer. You should be fine. If you see any stain start to form, just add more sequestering agent with the ph at 7.2 and it will take it away. Your chlorine can stay where it is. I remember how scared I was to get the stains back too - but now that you know to keep the ph low, and keep the sequestering agent in the water, you should be fine.

[tammyncook]

Mariella,
I too have been fighting an iron problem in my pool since we filled it at the end of May. I have had MAYBE 2 days of clear water. I CONSTANTLY have fine brown sediment on the bottom of my pool. I am getting REALLY tired of the whole process- I feel I'm fighting a never ending battle since I vacuum to waste, then have to put more water in the pool to make up for it which introduces MORE iron to the party. YIKES!
Anyway, you mentioned that you ordered a filter to attach to the hose to take the iron out of the water. Would you mind sharing what it's called and where you got it from? I feel if I could stop the iron from getting in the pool, I could end this frustrating cycle!
Thanks!
Tammy

[mariella]

Hi Tammy,

I haven't received the filter yet, but I am hoping it will be waiting for me when I get home from work :) I will definitely post more information, and the results, after trying it out.

Since we vacuumed to waste so much, I had to bite the bullet, and add water to my pool from the well, only about half an inch of water. Just so we could run the filter. We still need about 3 more inches. I just followed mbar's instructions, and added the stain remover before I added the water. My ph was already about 7.2.

We still do have a little brown sediment at the bottom that gets stirred up when we swim, but I want to wait until we get the filter before vacuuming again, and then adding more water.

It is kind of frustrating when we wake up in the morning, and the pool is SO clear. Then it gets all cloudy when we swim, but I know that will be taken care of soon. I just keep repeating......POP.........POP........POP........

On the plus side, since the water level is so low, my 5-year old thinks he is king-of-the-pool, since his head is so far above the water. :)

[mariella]

Just an update....

The hose filter that I bought did NOT work. Caveat emptor, indeed.

So, now I have lovely green water again, and I have to start the whole process over again :(

I have lowered the chlorine, and will start the metal treatment again today.

By the way, when I went to the pool store to get the metal treatment, the lady there was insisting that my ph was fine, and that the higher it was, the better for the metal treatment?? (my ph is 7.5, by the way)

I tried arguing with her, and telling her that the ph should be 7.2, but she was quite nasty and rude, so I just left. Time to find a new supplier, I think :)

[mbar]

Some metal removers need the ph to be high - I am currantly waiting for "Metal Magic" by Proteam, that Waterbear told me about. It is really supposed to "remove" metal from the water by turning the metal into crystals so they can be removed by the filter. I don't know if this really works or not - I will post when I try it. There is also something by "Jack's Magic" that is supposed to be used after the sequestering agent - I have to call there and speak to someone there today. I am still trying to find something that removes metals instead of just sequesterering them. I will post the info I get.

I still have gotten the best results taking down the ph and adding the sequestering agent then the other way around. That's my experience. Hope this helps, and really hope we can find something that will get the metals out once and for all!

[mariella]

Marie,

The stuff that I use is SuperErace, made by Phoenix. I did q quick search on the internet, and this is all that I could find:


Metal Out and Erace are metal sequesterers. {they block the metals from staining but do not take them out of the water} Super Erace and Metal Magic are actual metal removers. {they change the chemical composition of the metal to a crystal so that it can be filtered}

I do know that, after I use the SuperErace, I get all that fine brown powder in the bottom of the pool. I am guessing that this powder is the "crystals"? My DE filter used to filter it out, but the cartridge filter does not, so that is why we have to vacuum to waste. (Have I mentioned that I hate the cartridge filter?)

So, just in case this is one of those chemicals that needs a higher ph, I will keep the ph at 7.5. I am still mad at the pool store people, though. Rudeness is just not good customer service. :)

[mbar]

Yes, there is no excuse for rudeness! I understand your frustration with having to vacuum to waste - I hate when I have to do that too. Thanks for the info on super erase!