space underneath patio block? HELP

[denanbob]

When my husband leveled the ground, it was level except for minor bumps/tread from the bobcat tires, etc......When he took down the pool from the sellers house, we realized the bottom wall channel would have to be replaced so contruction is on hold until those come in. However, he went ahead and set the size braces with the buttresses. He put the end pieces (that didn't have buttresses) on 2x8x16 patio blocks. He used a rotary level and to be perfectly level the one sits up off the ground about 2-3". Here is a picture:
http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j115/denanbob/IMG_0927Small.jpg
http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j115/denanbob/IMG_0928Small.jpg
Is there anything easy we can do for this? He was going to put sand underneath it but from what I've read, the sand will eventually wash away and the pool will sink and become unlevel. Can we put backfill underneath it? Our soil is super hard and clay-like. Is this where we would use that crusher run or screenings that I've read about? Is there anything easy we can do for this? My husband spent millions of hours trying to get this perfectly level and we still have this and it's FRUSTRATING! Ideas anyone? Thanks so much!

[hrsdennis]

Hi, The level of the pressure plates is also the level of the bottom rail and footplates at the ends. What I am seeing in you photos is you will be having to raise a whole lot of your pool area. Why not lower the pressure plates so they sit on flat ground? Is the other side set flat and this is how this side needs to be to sit level? If that is the case you need to some filling with something besides sand. Pack it good. It is extremely important that those pressure plates rest on firm, solid level ground.

It is also very importand that the ends of the eight braces also have blocks under them. They will be supporting a lot of water pressure.

Their is no way to make a connection with the word "easy" and the words "pool installation". There is nothing easy about it, but it is better and much less expensive to do it right the first time.

Best of luck, Dennis

[NWMNMom]

The entire thing should be flat on the ground level and the patio blocks buried UNDER all of it (and level too) Confused? We were too - Dennis was awesome at helping me understand the patio block thing. All that leveling is the hardest part - but this too shall pass, get it right and it will all be worth it. Keep a cold beverage handy and go out to dinner so you don't strangle each other - its frustrating work.

[Aranon]

Bury the patio blocks so the rest of the pool is level with the ground.
Aranon

[CarlD]

Their is no way to make a connection with the word "easy" and the words "pool installation". There is nothing easy about it, but it is better and much less expensive to do it right the first time.

Boy! Truer words were never spoken! I add that site preparation is the most important part of the job, the hardest part of the job, and the least-anticipated part of the job.

[matt4x4]

Want to make it EASIER on yourself?
Notice i didn't say "easy", but there is a way to make this easier.
First off, your ground looks nowhere near what you want it to look like, you need it FLAT and LEVEL all around, then as stated above, SINK the patio blocks into it so the top surface of the block is flat and level with the ground.
If you're having a really hard time getting the ground flat, then get several yards of screenings aka crusher run aka the stuff that falls out of the crusher when they make 3/4" gravel. (you'll have to do the calculations here to see exactly how much you need). I would go with 2-3" of it (compacted with a gas tamper and water - 40 dollar rental) make sure it goes approximately 2 feet beyond every edge of the pool, sink your blocks into that and build everything on it, it will give you a great highly compacted base that won't wash out, and is really easy to get level.
All you have to do is rake it out as level as you can, tamp it down and now detail rake the high spots down some, once it's good, dig in the patio blocks, tamp everything once more after they are in place.

[Aranon]

I had the same problem you had because I had (chose) to build my pool over a concrete sidewalk that goes around our back yard. What I did was pour a 14 inch concrete curb around the perimeter of the pool where the rails would sit in the middle and filled the interior with rock and sand. I used a compactor and lots of water to compact the interior of the circle so it was level with the metal double C-Channels. I even had the extra problem that our side walk was 2 inches our of level from one end of the run to the other. That means that on on end I had 2" of build up and the other end I had 4 inches. I happened to have a ton of bricks from a fountain wall that fell down during a storm. The ones with three holes in the middle, so I used them laying flat under the pool with sand filling up the holes. ( we used dry sand to fill to make sure they were completely filled) Then we filled the rest of the way with sand and gravel and crushings and compacted all of this with a gas compactor that we rented from Home Depot by the day. After everything was level with the metal, you should see just the tops of the metal and the top of the straps ( ours is a buttress free pool) all level and level with the sand. We chose to use two inches of Dow Chemical Blue Styrofoam on top of that but you would use 2" of sand on top of the compacted filler and metal channels for you bottom if you choose to use sand.

Normally if you are putting up a pool you would grade flat your area where your pools goes and about 2 ft. all the way beyond that and use a transit or laser level to make sure everything is perfectly level. Then you would bury your patio blocks 4" below the ground and your metal channels 2" into the ground so the top of the metal channels are level or even with the leveled ground and your patio blocks are buried below the metal channel uprights. Then you would put your 2" sand bottom or 2" foam on top of all this.

A month ago I did not know any of this and look at me now. lol. I was like your husband at the very beginning. I thought you put the patio blocks on top of the ground. I didn't know you had to sink the channels into the ground and dig deeper below the channels to put your blocks. The only problem I see if yall just fill it up like hes talking about is if it rains hard the water could possibly wash out your sand or gravel or whatever out from under your pool and your bottom would sink. This is why I choose to put a 14" wide beam all around my pool, to contain my filler when it rains hard. Oh, and if your soil get large cracks during the summer, make sure you lay down some heavy landscape fabric and 6" mill plastic before putting in your sand or it could run down the cracks and you will have valleys or channels in your pool. That happens a lot here where I live. The soil opens up and your sand disappears. We have cracks 3 or 4 inches wide and 2-3 foot deep.

Hope this helps. I didn't know anything when we bought our pool but with the help of this forum and especially Dennis, I learned a lot. We love our pool. I'm putting 10 solar panels on top of my house this week to warm it up. Have fun and good luck. Especially putting the liner on. lol.

Aranon

[hrsdennis]

Hi, what a bunch of thoughtful and helpful posts. This pool is one of the easier ovals to build. It all sits ground level. No channels to bury. The area does need to be the same exact level from 2' beyond the pool at each end and from just beyond the buttress ends going side to side. Filling this area in is not a problem if that is easier. It's just that the whole area needs to be done and level with the tops of those blocks. Just doing the parts under where the pool rests is not good enough with this pool.

Is there anyway you could sneek us some more pictures as this project moves along. It is very possible your husband has it all under control. I do see a few things in your pictures that concern me aside from the level. I hope it is just that he has not finished this stage yet.

Best of luck, Dennis

[denanbob]

First off, your ground looks nowhere near what you want it to look like, you need it FLAT and LEVEL all around,

We already put the sand in the center area so that is definitely not spread out or level yet so is that what you're talking about? Or just the big space between the pressure plates and the ground?

[denanbob]

I do see a few things in your pictures that concern me aside from the level. I hope it is just that he has not finished this stage yet.

Oh, sheesh, please do tell! LOL! If you're talking about the missing buttress, it is off to the side and needs to be reattached. When they took down the pool, they left the pressure plates connected to the buttresses to avoid some labor. That one must not have stayed attached for some reason. I know he said some of the screws were stripped and rusted out and would have to be replaced so maybe that is the case. I noticed that buttress missing so I went out to look and it's sitting off to the side. What else did you notice? Thanks for all of the info everyone! I'll keep you posted as things develop.

[matt4x4]

I highly doubt that any rainstorm will wash the screenings out from under your pool, mine was built that way, and it actually helps drain the water away better than any dirt you'll be putting there.
Also, the reason I stated 2 feet beyond the edge of teh pool is so that the screenings can be graded away from the pool once it's done for better runoff, also, you probably want screenings right up to the outside of the butresses anyways.