New Home! First time pool owner in the NE (RI)

[Bassist286]

Hi all,

Back in June of 2013 I started my journey of getting this new home. It was short sale but I ended up closing on Christmas Eve.

I opened the pool last weekend - early for the NE (RI specifically) and have been trying to get it up and running. I own the Taylor large kit with CYA -2006c. Been using it to get everything good over the past week -running the filter non stop. Starting off with the BBB method. Water is clearing up but very slowly. Is it possible the cold weather is trapping the CC in the pool and stopping it for evaporating in the sun? It was in the 30's here last night. Below are my latest test results. Oh and also- there were about 5 refuse bags worth of leaves in the pool. Most of them are out now.

testing on 4/16/14

FC- 6 ppm
CC - 2 ppm
pH - 7.4
TA - 100 ppm
CH - 40 ppm
CYA - 50 ppm

Added 2 lbs of Calcium Carb to get the CH up (pool calculator recommended something like 10 lbs (~20,000 gal pool) and it scared me so I just put in two to see where it went. Also added 2 gals of 8.25% Walmart GV bleach to get my FC to 15ppm for "shock levels".

Is the cold prohibiting the chemistry from doing its thing?

Thanks!

[PoolDoc]

+ It's almost always better to add calcium in divided doses -- so you did the right thing.

+ Both pool covers and low water temps will tend to keep CC's in the pool, BUT . . . don't worry about CC levels, till you've finished physically cleaning the pool. It's quite possible your CC's are a result of the chlorine acting against the leaves and other debris.

[Bassist286]

Hi Ben!

Thanks for the responce. The plan is to clean, retest, and add another bleach and calcium dose today. I'll update with a picture and new results.

[PoolDoc]

Sounds good!

[Bassist286]

So I did another clean up on Friday and another vacuum today. I can now see my deep end pretty clearly. Got what appeared to be all of the leaves out. Water color has slight green tinge still. Also it looks like the bottom of the pool is stained. I can see where the leaves were and everywhere else is a slight greenish brown color. Used a brush in one spot but nothing came off. Perhaps I need it repainted? Checked FC- was at 10.5 so hit it with another gallon of 8.25 bleach. Pics coming soon

[PoolDoc]

Clear up the water, and run high chlorine at night for a week, and THEN see of you still have stains to deal with. Often, organic stains will fade once the water is cleaned up.

[Bassist286]

Hi All -

It been about a week. Water is clear and I've been running between 11.5 and 16 ppm chlorine for about a week. Leaves are out of the pool (6 Bags!). The water still has a slight green tint, but clear. Also the light brownish stains on the floor are still there. They outline where the leaves were. I'm going to keep the chlorine high until the weekend. Looking around - it appears that the previous owner may have use a lot of goop in the pool. Liner has a bleached water line (found 3" TRi-chlor tabs) and there were some half empt bottles of pool clear and copper algaecide. Do we think the copper could be the culprit for the light green tint?

I haven't backwashed all week since I haven't had my pressure go above 14-15 psi. I usually wait until about 20-22.

Guesses? Need clear water for Memorial Day weekend grand opening so I have some time.

[PoolDoc]

Copper can definitely cause a greenish tint, but so can iron under certain conditions.

What sort of pool surface do you have (vinyl, plaster, etc) and what kind of filter?

[Bassist286]

I have a Plaster / concrete pool bottom with somekind of fiberglass-like wall about 3-4 feet tall. My pump and filter are Hayward PPR s244T high rate sand filter with a Hayward 75 gal/min pump.

Going to do the overnight chlorine test tonight to be sure the water is "clear". Hoping it's not Iron or copper contamination.

[PoolDoc]

What is the pH level?

Low pH can keep copper in solution, in spite of high copper levels. But, I've occasionally seen low pH with high alkalinity occur as a possible cause of greenish clear water.

Also, it would be good to test your sand filter. If you really have a 75 gpm pump, you may have blown a lot of your filter's sand out, during backwashes. One way to check is add a quart or so of DE powder to the skimmer with the pump running. If it blows back into the pool, via the returns . . . your filter needs service, and your pump may need downsizing. If it STAYS in the filter, it will help remove algae particles, and may help remove copper or iron, but will cause the filter to stop up more quickly.

[Bassist286]

I'll run a full test suite tonight and report the numbers. I haven't tested my TA and pH in about 5 days. 75 gmp does sound wrong - I'll double check.

[Bassist286]

Just tested everything again. We had a ton of rain over the past week so I expected the water balance to be off. Also did the overnight chlorine test. It passed (9.5 ppm FC last night, 9.5 in the am and 0.5 cc). Water is still a slightly greenish tint but clear.

FC-9.5 ppm
CC - 0.5 ppm
pH - 7.0 (added 4lbs of Borax just now)
TA - 110
CH - 150 (rain must have lowered this. ) Gonna add Calcium if pH is over 7.6 or higher when I get back from work.

Any other ideas on the slight green tint? Haven't testing the filter yet with DE. Pump says noting about GPM, no idea where I got that number.

[PoolDoc]

I would suggest waiting a week or two, before worrying about the color. For reasons I don't fully understand, pools can open green and clear, but then turn blue after a week or so. Iron can do that, but I haven't always seen the characteristic rust colored backwash that would be expected.

Do NOT add calcium when the pH is higher; it is MUCH better to do so when it's low. However, I should ask, why do you need to add calcium? It's ONLY needed on inground concrete pools -- is that what you have? Even then, once your pH goes up, your TA will rise as well. With values of pH=7.6; TA=120; CH=150, your water is plenty close enough to 'perfectly balanced'.

BUT, if you do add calcium, never add a complete dose at one time. Multiple small doses are much, much less likely to result in your pool looking like milk!

[Bassist286]

The Pool calculator shows CH minimum to be 2501 Is that wrong? If i'm at 150- it would seem , according to the calculator, that I have a good amount to go. I think I might have missed something.

[Watermom]

By any chance, is the 2501 in your post above supposed to have been 250! instead?

[PoolDoc]

The PoolCalculator site says a number of things, not all of which agree with each other. It is a very useful tool -- if you know what you are doing. And, being based on Chem_Geek's analytical studies of pool chemistry, it's rather precise.

As it happened, I used the PoolCalculator site to run your numbers quickly, before I posted above.

But, the really important factor for you is, if your have a reasonable pH level (> 7.2) and *some* carbonate alkalinity and calcium present, any corrosion that does occur will take place very, very slowly. I've worked on a large indoor pool (> 150,000 gallons) that had not been drained for 10+ years, and had been serviced only with sodium hypochlorite and hand fed muriatic acid (= small amounts). PH levels on that pool ran a bit high (~7.8), but alkalinity and calcium ran a bit low (< 150 for each), even after 10 years of 'corroding' the plaster. The plaster itself was over 30 years old, and was stained, but not rough.

Keep in mind: to the best of my knowledge, NONE of the saturation indices have been validated by actual lab or field studies, as accurately reflecting the tendency of various waters to corrode or dissolve plaster.

Chasing numbers, whether it's done using Taylor's Dial-An-Index, the PoolCalculator, or with some other tool results in over-controlling your pool's chemistry, which translates into spending time and money unnecessarily.

Keep your pH up, and keep your TA and CH above 100, and you'll be fine. (Well, maybe not. Plaster quality may have deteriorated over the last 2 decades. This is a huge debate, with no final answers. Check out http://poolhelp.com/ for more info. But if you do have plaster problems, but have kept the numbers I indicated (pH>7.2; TA&CH>100), water chemistry is not the cause.)

[Bassist286]

I Guess I’m being a little bit of a perfectionist and guilty of number chasing. The simple pH>7.2; TA&CH>100 are a great benchmark to know. Thanks for all of your help.

I believe I have discovered that the stains on the pool are organic. It appears to be very dead algae. It is stuck on all of the fiberglass walls and some spots on the plaster. I brushed the walls twice and could still make a line on it with just my finger. Any recommendations for a good scrubbing tool? My plan is to get in the pool with a box magic erasers and go to town. I’m not afraid of a little (or a lot!) of sweat equity.
I imagine once the sides are physically clean the water will be perfectly blue/clear.

And Poolmom - yes it was a typo (250).

-Cheers!

[Bassist286]

I'm happy to report that the pool is finally clear. Took a while but I am sucessfully running on the BBB method. Thanks for getting me through it. My chems seem to be pretty consistant. Now it's keeping it clean and staying on top of it. Thanks again.

PS - I want to note that some people around here said they use the Magic Eraser on their pools and I tried it. I don't reccomend it. The moment
I used it the Melamine foam started breakingdown immedialy leaving behind a cloudy mess. Come to find out that CYA precipitates Melimine and turns into a substrate that is very insoluable. Not only is it ugly - it's dangerous for animals and can cause kidney issues. I'd stay away and use a scrubby sponge with some Bi-carb/ H2O paste. Worked wonders for me.

[PoolDoc]

Thanks for the feedback on Magic Eraser. I've never used it myself, so I didn't really now.

But, we've been recommending a bicarb paste for a LONG time.