Cloudy Water in Intex 16' pool

[laurah]

Hi everyone,
We have an Intex 16x4' ultra frame pool which we got last year & had no problems with keeping clear water but this year is a different story...
Came home from being gone for the weekend to find super cloudy water. Tested, chlorine was so low it didn't show up, had trichlor tabs in & cover on while gone so I don't know why it wasn't chlorinated but it wasnt. Filter ran 8 hrs both nights we were gone as well.
Sooooo,
I shocked last night with dichlor & the chlorine levels were high after shock where they needed to be but this morning I only got a level between 1-2 when testing?? I find this strange because I did it in the late afternoon & the cover was on all night so how cold the chlorine have been depleted already???
I also added algaecide 2 hours after shocking thnking what I had was early algae growth.
Water is still very cloudy this norning, no change.
PH is testing at 7.5, Alk tested at 240(??)....
Is it high alk causing this problem?? Will that deplete my chlorine if not balanced??
Last year all I ever checked was chlorine & PH & all I ever had to do was add chlorine, the PH was always fine, never checked alk. or anything else & we had a crystal clear pool =( The only things that I have done different this year is started using a solar cover & used chlorine bleach several times (once to shock & then the other times for routine chlorination)
Turned pump off this am to rinse filter & then turned right back on....
HELP!!!

[Watermom]

Did you drain the pool at the end of last year? Have you used trichlor all of last year and pretty much exclusively this year? Trichlor is stabilized meaning it has CYA in it. Continuous use of it causes CYA levels to get high and as a result, it is necessary to run higher than normal chlorine levels to keep algae away. (See the Best Guess Chlorine chart in my signature below for more about that.)

Do you know your CYA level?

What kind of kit are you using?

[PoolDoc]

Given the care routine you described, last year, you were very lucky. This year, not so much.

You're going to have to do it right . . . or get very, very lucky.

1. Go get a cheap OTO / phenol red test kit (yellow / red drops) Teststrips are not dependably accurate for the most part. Old test strips are dependably inaccurate. All test strips are virtually useless at measuring stabilizer, which is critical.

2. 16' x 4' pool => ~4,800 gallons or PF of 25. So, 1 gallon of 8.25% bleach (~0.7 lbs chlorine gas), will add 25 x 0.7 ppm or 17 ppm of chlorine to your pool.

3. When you get the kit, buy 5 gallons of PLAIN 8.25 household bleach. Add 1/2 gallon of bleach in the EVENING, this evening if possible.

4. Test your chlorine in the AM. If you do not get a DARK yellow OTO result, add another 1/2 gallon.

5. Test your chlorine in the PM. Dose as above (1/2 gallon, unless you have a DARK yellow OTO result).

6. Continue this until your AM result is very DARK yellow.

7. Meanwhile, test your pH before you add your first dose of bleach. (High chlorine messes up the pH test). If the pH is between 7 and 8, you're fine. Otherwise, that will need to be adjusted to.

8. If you aren't already, run your pump 24/7.

9. List all the chemicals you've used in the last 2 weeks, and post them here, along with your test results.

10. High alkalinity does not affect chlorine level. It can lead to cloudiness, if you ALSO have high calcium. (Have you been using calcium hypochlorite shock? See #9 above)

11. What sort of filter do you have?

[laurah]

Yes we drained & stored it for winter.

[laurah]

I just bought the test strips today before seeing this =( but here are the levels I got using them...did it 3 x's lol:
TH 400
FC 5-10
CA 30-50
PH 7.5
TA 240
I have used in the past 2 weeks: hth algaecide (3x concentrate)every 3 days or so I add, hth trichlor 1" tabs (put in 3 or 4 every couple days), Shocked last week with bleach (used 7 cups to shock probably wasn't enough??) and in between adding tabs for sanitizing I have been adding maintenance doses of dichlor. Shocked with Dichlor last night (didn't use enough,ugh) so shocked again this am with the same thing using correct amount.
Water is still very cloudy. I have not used calcium hypochlorite shock...just sodium dichlor.

I have been running my pump since yesterday evening & will continue until the problem clears. The filter is a cartridge style & I rinsed it out this am & was also going to continue rinsing it out daily until the problem is fixed.

Given my readings should I go ahead & add the 1/2 gallon of bleach tonight & continue adding testing as you advised? Or do you think I have other problems.
Thank you! Sooooo much for your help!!

Also wanted to add that before turning cloudy (can't see the bottom) it was hazy for a couple weeks.

[PoolDoc]

I think there's a good chance that the cartridges may be the problem. I'll post that info below.

But you also need to EITHER get a HTH 6-way test kit (made by Taylor, sold by Walmart) OR a Taylor K2006. You'll find a link to the testkit info page in my signature block. Here's the filter info:

+ The OEM cartridges in Intex / Summer Escapes / etc. filters are not high quality. The Intex manuals recommend replacing them completely every 2 weeks. A BETTER option is to replace them permanently with 2 - 3 Unicel or Filbur cartridges, and rotating them through a cleaning solution. Properly maintained, these cartridges should last all season AND filter better. So even if they cost more per cartridge, they cost less per season! Learn to maintain them, by reading this post, Cleaning-your-Cartridge-Filter-wiithout-Damaging-It! (http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/showthread.php?18044)

But, purchasing them is tricky. Amazon does not consistently stock them, and some of the 3rd party sellers are charging high prices and/or high shipping. So, check the Amazon link, but watch out for the prices and shipping costs.

It would be nice if you could just buy them elsewhere, but many of the online pool stores are listing Pleatco or other Asian made low quality filters, as "Unicel C-4607 type" or "fits Unicel C-4607". So shop carefully!

Here are the Amazon links:

Unicel cartridges: @ Amazon

Unicel C-4607 Replacement Filter Cartridge (Intex A or C) (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000BNPRC2/poolbooks)
Unicel C-5315 Replacement Filter Cartridge (Intex B Filter (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0039X2XZK/poolbooks)
Unicel C-3302 Replacement Filter Cartridge (Intex E) (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0040T54NA/poolbooks/)

Filbur cartridges: @ Amazon

Filbur FC-3710 Antimicrobial Replacement Filter Cartridge (Intex A or C) (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B007F8T4KW/poolbooks/)
Filbur FC-3752 Antimicrobial Replacement Filter Cartridge (Intex B) (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B002BUM8KM/poolbooks/)
Filbur FC-3751 Antimicrobial Replacement Filter Cartridge (Intex E) (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00564Q680/poolbooks/)

[laurah]

Not sure about it being the filter~ I used the same ones last year. I did try the summerscapes brand & thought they reduced the suction so never bought those again. I am using the intex type A filters which I purchased on ebay 6 for around $17.
Should I try the bleach thing still?? I have the 6 way test kit, I will go measure the Chlorine & PH now & see what that reads...

=====================================

ok so with the 6 way kit I got:
OTO 5-10
PH 7.2

[PoolDoc]

If you are using cartridges from last year, that's DEFINITELY a problem. Those cartridges only last 2 - 3 weeks, unlike the Filbur or Unicel cartridges which may last several seasons.

But, if you have the 6-way (NOT 5-way) test and report your CYA (stabilizer) level.

[laurah]

PoolDoc,
They are the same brand not the same ones =) I change them every couple weeks or as needed. Did the CYA & its 50~if I did it right.

[PoolDoc]

OK, then.

Is there any green to the cloudiness? Or is it just gray?

If it's gray, using a clarifier may help, but ONLY if you have not used any OTHER clarifiers, flocculants, or metal treatments. Getting the Filbur or Unicel cartridges will also help. I'll post a link on a clarifier that I've seen good reports about. If you order the clarifier, do NOT exceed the recommended dosing.

If you are replacing the cartridges every two weeks, that's what's recommended. It will improve your filtration some, if you get the Filbur or Unicel cartridges, but it still won't be an instant clean-up.

Meanwhile, keep the pH between 7 and 8, and the chlorine in the dark yellow OTO range.

Good luck!



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[laurah]

Hi PoolDoc,
Here is an update on my progress =)
Added 1/2 gal of bleach last night, water looks better today but still hazy. TC tested 5-10(dark yellow), pH 7.2, this am - was glad it held overnight. Still running pump/filter, rinsed filter again this am.
Planning to test again this evening & add another 1/2 gallon of bleach if still cloudy.
I may get the clarifier you suggested if not cystal clear in a couple days, thanks. I do use Amazon, but never signed up for prime may try that too =)

Here are my other questions:

1.) Should I use algaecide? If so is hth 3x concentrate ok?
2.) For a maintenence dose, if my CYA is at 50 I should keep my chlorine between 3-6, going by the chart,correct? Adjusting accordingly by the amount of stabilizer I have in my pool?

[laurah]

Oh, also with a CYA level of 50 should I stick with unstabilized chlorine until that level goes down?
THANKS A BUNCH!!!

[PoolDoc]

1. Don't use algaecides now. None are fully compatible with chlorine; only polyquat (www.poolsolutions.com/polyquat.html) is mostly compatible.

2. 50 ppm CYA is perfect.