Green tinted water - Intex 15' X 48" Salt water system

[Xevious2001]

Hi,

We have an Intex pool (15' X 48")that we put up and take down every year and we fill it with well water. The pool uses a salt water system. All previous years we have had no problem, and the water has been crystal clear, but this year after running the chlorinator for only an hour, the pool water took on a strong yellow tint. It is still clear, but tinted.

I have since gone to a pool store for help and they had me add Keetrol Plus because they thought it was metals in the water reacting to the chlorine causing the tint. They had me add 12 oz originally, and I have since added another 10 oz. The color is now lighter, but is more of a green tint. The store also had me add about 2 1/2 pounds of Clear View to raise the total alkalinity.

It is now several days later and the green tint is still present. I have also been running the chlorinator to make sure I dont start getting organic problems.

I went out and bought a testing kit today (hth 6-way) and did some tests. I am hoping that if I post the results here along with the history, someone can tell me what is going on and what I should do next.

Total Chlorine / Total Bromine - I could not tell. The water color turned orange and the max value of 5/10 is a dark yellow. I assume my level is way higher than that (which is surprising...no chlorine smell or anything to the water).

Ph - 8.2

Total Alkalinity - 100 ppm

Hardness - 80 ppm

CYA - 30 ppm is the lowest the test can measure...I think I am lower than that, but close (the black dot on bottom of tube was still visable, but barely).

Please let me know if you need any further information or have any suggestions. Any help is greatly appreciated.

[Watermom]

You should order a good kit. The one we recommend is the Taylor K-2006 or 2006C (test kit link in my signature below.) For now, get some distilled water and test your chlorine again using half pool water and half distilled water. Then, multiply your result by 2. Post the reading here.

You cannot trust that pH reading. A pH reading taken when chlorine is really high is typically reads higher than it really is. Wait until the chlorine level drops below 5 and then test pH again and report it here.

What kind of tabs are you using. Some tabs have copper in them and you do NOT want copper in your water!

Go to the section of the forum called "Dealing with Stains & Metals." There is a stickied thread called "Bucket Test for Metals" at the top of that section. Read it, do a bucket test on your well water and report your findings here.

Welcome to the Pool Forum, by the way!

[Xevious2001]

I did the test with 1/2 distilled water and 1/2 pool water and while the color was not orange, it was still a dark yellow and beyond the scale. I then repeated the test with 1/3 pool water and 2/3 distilled and it was still a darker yellow (but not by too much) than the top of the scale. Since the highest it can measure is 5 ppm, this would mean I have at least 15 ppm (5 x 3) and probably more like 20 ppm?

I will read up on the bucket test and let you know my findings. I will also order one of the suggested testing kits.

Not sure what you mean by what kind of tabs that I am using? Chlorine tabs? I dont put any Cholorine in the pool (other than what is generated by the chlorinator). I have never needed to do a shock or anything.

[Watermom]

OK. When you say chlorinator, you are referring to an SWCG (Salt Water Chlorine Generator) and not a chlorinator that you put chlorine tabs in. Gotcha.

[Xevious2001]

Yes, I use a SWCG system, sorry about the confusion. I am also not able to access the 'Dealing with stains & metals' section, so I can not read up on the bucket test yet.

[Watermom]

Until new members have their memberships upgraded, it is always necessary to log out first in order to see the rest of the forum. (Sorry I forgot to tell you that part when I wrote the post above.)

[Xevious2001]

K-2006 kit ordered (used the amazon link from the forum). I have also started the bucket test.

Initial results -
Well Water is clear with slight blue tint
Pool Water is slightly murky with yellow tint

After adding bleach and waiting 15 minutes I saw no noticeable change in color or clarity.

I then added the Borax and will check them again in 24 hours.

The other thing that is happening is that I have now changed the filter twice in a few days and both times the water in the filter chamber was quite brown and the filters themselves had picked up quite a bit of brown material, so there is clearly some minerals or something in the water. My SWCG system is 6 or 7 years old now...is it possible that there is corrosion inside the system and is the source of the minerals? The pool water was fine until I first turned the system on (both pump and chlorinator).

[PoolDoc]

I have now changed the filter twice in a few days and both times the water in the filter chamber was quite brown and the filters themselves had picked up quite a bit of brown material, so there is clearly some minerals or something in the water.

It's iron.

There are apparently some low-grades of salt that contain quite a bit of iron, being sold to pool owners for pool use. If there's not iron in your well water, then I'd check the salt out as a source.

Membership updated.

[Xevious2001]

After 24 hours -

Well Water - Clear, slight blue tint as before (which I believe is just normal water color in a white bucket). I did notice 2 very small deposits of some material on bottom of bucket.
Pool Water - Clear, yellow tint but perhaps lighter than yesterday. Also noticed 2 small deposits of some material on bottom of bucket.

The salt I used is Morton Pool Salt which (they claim) is free of additives and impurities. It is also the salt I used in previous years with no issues.

The pool itself remains tinted..now seems more yellow than green. Water is still clear.

Should I just drain the pool and get ready to start over? Or is there some way to recover from this. My wife and kids dont want anything to do with the pool (and who can blame them).

[PoolDoc]

I wouldn't drain the pool, but I would let the chlorine drop. OTO 'orange' can be 20 - 40 ppm of chlorine. If your stabilizer is truly < 30 ppm, that is very high. You should read the "Best Guess" page, linked in my signature, so you can understand more.

Do this:

1. Test your CYA with the K2006 as soon as possible.
2. Operate your filter as much as possible --iron has to be removed as particles, either by vacuuming or filtering. Filtering is easier.
3. The green water is dissolved iron -- you can't remove it in that state.
4. Do not use any more "Clear View" (baking soda -- really!), Kee Trol or other pool chemicals, except chlorine and pH adjustment chemicals.
5. The fact that the bucket test is only showing small amounts of iron (reddish material?) is good - that means you should be able to manage your pool fairly easily, once you get the hang of it.
6. From now own ONLY fill via the skimmer or suction intake, and fill as slowly as possible. This will maximize the iron removed on the first pass.
7. Turn the salt system down, or off. Your chlorine is too high. Unless your CYA is > 100 ppm, OR you are having severe algae problems, you should stay out of the "orange" range.
8. Your family can swim, but wear old swimsuits. Skin is VERY chlorine resistant, far more than most swimsuits.

One scary thought: a cheaply made SWCG (like the Intex) could add iron to the water, at least in theory. It's only a guess, but it's one I'll have to check into.

[Xevious2001]

I have not put anything into the pool in 3 days (since I took the very high chlorine level) and the filter / pump has been running 24/7. I have not turned on the chlorination system at all. I did another chlorine test on the pool itself today (using the hth 6-way kit...the good kit is supposed to be delivered tomorrow) and the level appears to be down to 2 - 3 ppm now.

As for the bucket test -
Well Water - Still clear with a slight blue tint but I am now seeing quite a bit of very small black specs on the bottom of the bucket. There are two larger (but still small) specks that do appear orange (like an orange smear around them). The chlorine test resulted in an orange color. Oddly, the orange water has small specs of material floating in it like the drops I added did not completely mix or something.
Pool Water - Still clear with a yellow tint. I saw more specs of material (all with smears of orange around them) but considerably less than the well water bucket. Chlorine test had the same result as Well Water.

Seems pretty clear there is metal in my water. Once I have the better kit I will do the CYA test and get a more accurate chlorine test on the pool. Should I do a full set of tests with the new kit? Or is CYA and Chlorine enough to start?

[PoolDoc]

When you first get it, do a full set of tests.

However, with the very high chlorine levels, you'll need to modify the pH test. Purchase a gallon of DISTILLED (not "spring", not "bottled" => "distilled) at Walmart. Mix 1/2 cup of pool water with 1/2 cup of distilled water, and test the pH of THAT water. Take that reading directly.

If you have a high CYA level (sample is very cloudy after adding R0013 reagent), do another 1/2 cup of distilled + 1/2 cup pool water. Test the CYA level of that water, but multiple the result by 2.

[Xevious2001]

Ok. I will do a full set of tests and the diluted pH test (I already have some distilled water at home).

Not sure if you missed it in my previous post, but I did a chlorine test last night using the hth 6-way kit and the chlorine levels have come way down (3 days of nothing added to pool + lots of sunlight). The reading was 2 - 3 ppm. Just wanted to make sure you were aware of that just in case it changes how you want me to run the test.

[Xevious2001]

Got the K-2006 kit in and ran the tests -

Chlorine - 1.5 ppm
pH (just pool water) - 7.9 (color seemed between 8.0 and 7.8)
Total Alkalinity - 130 ppm
Calcium Hardness - 35 ppm
CYA - 35 ppm

Diluted pH test (1/2 cup pool water and 1/2 cup distilled - took sample from that) - About the same as the pH on the pool water. - 7.9

[PoolDoc]

At this point, here's what I'd recommend:

1. Use bleach to maintain chlorine in the 1.5 - 3 ppm range. 1 - 2 cup doses of PLAIN 8.25% bleach should be about right for now.

2. Lower your pH closer to 7.6. Use whatever you have. If you need muriatic acid, read the muriatic acid guide, linked in my blue signature block first.

3. Do not add anything to adjust your alkalinity or calcium.

4. Run your pump as much as you can.

5. Do NOT run the salt system -- disconnect the power to the cell.

6. Order new Filbur or Unicel cartridges for your filter. Links below. Read the filter cleaning guide.

7. Meanwhile, USE the pool and enjoy it.

8. If you have access to a Sams Club, buy their 24# pack of bags of dichlor shock; you'll use this once the water is all cleared up. Do NOT purchase from Kmart, Walmart, Lowes, Costco, or most other locations: they are selling blended and diluted dichlor. Use links below for dichlor if needed.

Good luck!

+ The OEM cartridges in Intex / Summer Escapes / etc. filters are not high quality. The Intex manuals recommend replacing them completely every 2 weeks. A BETTER option is to replace them permanently with 2 - 3 Unicel or Filbur cartridges, and rotating them through a cleaning solution. Properly maintained, these cartridges should last all season AND filter better. So even if they cost more per cartridge, they cost less per season! Learn to maintain them, by reading this post, Cleaning-your-Cartridge-Filter-wiithout-Damaging-It! (http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/showthread.php?18044)

But, purchasing them is tricky. Amazon does not consistently stock them, and some of the 3rd party sellers are charging high prices and/or high shipping. So, check the Amazon link, but watch out for the prices and shipping costs.

It would be nice if you could just buy them elsewhere, but many of the online pool stores are listing Pleatco or other Asian made low quality filters, as "Unicel C-4607 type" or "fits Unicel C-4607". So shop carefully!

Here are the Amazon links:

Unicel cartridges: @ Amazon

Unicel C-4607 Replacement Filter Cartridge (Intex A or C) (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000BNPRC2/poolbooks)
Unicel C-5315 Replacement Filter Cartridge (Intex B Filter (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0039X2XZK/poolbooks)
Unicel C-3302 Replacement Filter Cartridge (Intex E) (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0040T54NA/poolbooks/)

Filbur cartridges: @ Amazon

Filbur FC-3710 Antimicrobial Replacement Filter Cartridge (Intex A or C) (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B007F8T4KW/poolbooks/)
Filbur FC-3752 Antimicrobial Replacement Filter Cartridge (Intex B) (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B002BUM8KM/poolbooks/)
Filbur FC-3751 Antimicrobial Replacement Filter Cartridge (Intex E) (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00564Q680/poolbooks/)

[Xevious2001]

So it really just comes down to filtering out the metal, which just takes time. I will read up on the filters (and other areas of the forum). Thanks for the help.

[PoolDoc]

It's a little more complicated than that, unfortunately.

When the iron is 'green', it's usually in a soluble (dissolved) state, and cannot be filtered. It can be "adsorbed" onto various zeolites, like the CuLator product . . . but this is a very slow process.

So, the usually way by which metal leaves a pool is when it becomes insoluble. This is what happens when it 'stains' various surfaces. It can also form iron oxide (or other iron salt) particles, which can settle to the pool bottom, or can be filtered out.

What makes it even more complex is that not all 'green' iron is alike. I have worked with well water that would come in green but very clear, and would INSTANTLY turn orange when you added chlorine. But I've also worked with 'green' water that would only very slowly oxidize to the insoluble state.

So, just saying that there's "iron in the water" doesn't really tell us what you'll be dealing with . . . and thus makes it really hard to give a recipe or prescription. The steps I gave you above, will usually work, in a fairly reasonable time. Especially if you use the polyquat, you CAN swim, while you are cleaning up iron.