Had to Partially Fill From Well w/Iron

[jrsdws]

Had to install a new liner and filled pool halfway with our wells...one of which is high in iron. I'm having one tanker come in this morning to finish it off so I can start filtering. Simply budgetary reasons for not filling completely with tankers at $325 per load.

The water right now is the green/brown iron nasty color. I ran the water through a homemade filter overnight and I suppose I trapped a fair amount of iron, but I'd have to go much larger scale to make a difference.

So I need a plan of attack now.

27' above ground pool with sand filter and 1hp Hayward pump. The sand was new last year.

From my bucket tests, one fill well was pretty clear and clean and free of metals. The other, however, deposited a large amount of orange dust on the bottom of the bucket after adding bleach and borax. I ran this well through a 5 micron filter and ran the bucket test again and I'd say I reduced the settled iron by at least half. When filling, I also ran this filtered water through a bucket stuffed with cotton towels and holes in the bottom. Hopefully that filtered it even better as a third bucket test showed another significant reduction in iron sediment.

What I have: Lots of 8.25% bleach, enough stabilizer for proper dosage, a few bottles of blue clarifier, and tri-chlor pucks for the in line chlorinator which I haven't used yet..

Initial plan: Find some polyquat ASAP and get it doesed appropriately. This is my number one goal today.

So this is where I become unsure of what to do now. I've been reading threads and stickys for days.

In this form...brown water...I read that this is where it is filterable. Do I not chlorinate and let the filter work? Do I slowly chlorinate and let the filter work? Or do I shock the heck out of it and maintain shock level?

I have some FerriTabs coming early next week. They sounded like a good idea at least.

Put me on the right path, please.

[jrsdws]

Tanker is emptied in and I'm topping off the last few inches with my well water mix. I should be able to run the filter/pump very soon.

I ran and purchased the following to add to my stash of ingredients to try to get the water squared away:

2 quarts of polyquat 60
5lbs of cal-hypo
Nature's Way Scale and Iron Control (this was the only sequestrant they had)

The pool store says to start with the Scale and Iron Control. Then shock hard tomorrow.

What is the right way to attack?

[jrsdws]

Running a trichlor puck in the skimmer basket. Pressure is rising gradually so I think it's helping. I've also dosed with polyquat and sequestrant. Total alkalinity is very high so I'm aerating with return bubbling aggressively and keeping ph down with muriatic acid. I've decided not to shock at this time as I hope patience will prevail now.

[jrsdws]

Been making good progress on the iron removal. The pucks in the skimmer yielded some good rusty backwashes daily and you could see the water turning from green/brown to green. Actually I assume the water is more of a yellowish and the blue liner makes it appear green.

I ran the FerriTabs and they made a big impact in a 24 hour period. After backwashing and running pucks in the skimmer for another day, we could see through the water to the bottom throughout the pool.

It's another 90 degree day here and we decided to take a swim. There was some iron that had settled to the bottom so we vacuumed to waste and got in for a cool down. We found two BIG lumps...rocks I think...under the liner in the floor. They're really bad. Sooooooo now I'm waiting to hear back from the installers. Their office said they would scheduling me in to replace the liner and repair/regroom the floor.....again.....but on their dime. So I'm going to try like heck to get them to spring for tanker trunks of good water too!!!

[jeffstang]

I have a very hard well with super high iron content. I found the metaltrap 6 at http://hydropuretechnologies.com/ that removes just about all the iron from your water right from the hose. i just buy a new cartridge every season and the well water is no longer an issue for me except for the calcium hardness. this thing is great for make up water and topping off the pool when you opn in the spring.

[PoolDoc]

@ Jeff - I copied your post to this new thread: Using-HydroPureTech-cartridges-to-deal-with-Iron (www.poolforum.com/pf2/showthread.php?21284)

@ jrsdws - Sounds like you're making progress, with the Ferritabs, and with your other actions. Metal removal is NOT a process that we've mastered here, so every good result especially when all the details are recorded as you've done, helps us.

The Ferritabs seem to be a polyacrylamide (PAM), originally formulated by (or for) Aqua Clear (Chemtura / Bioguard), now owned and marketed by www.michiganswimmingpoolservices.com / askthepoolguy.com.

This trademark for FERRITABS was filed by BIO-LAB, INC.; Biolab Services, Inc; AQUA CLEAR INDUSTRIES, INC.; HYDROLOGY LABORATORIES, INC.. On 7 October 1974 this trademark was filed, on 6 January 1976 this trademark was registered and on 6 January 2006 this trademark was renewed.
http://goo.gl/JnTnF => www.trademarken.com


polyacrylamide on Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyacrylamide)

I was curious why, if the product works, Aqua Clear would have dropped it. But I found this article:

Acrylamide release resulting from sunlight irradiation of aqueous polyacrylamide/iron mixtures (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18351736)
J Agric Food Chem. 2008 Apr 23;56(8):2773-9. doi: 10.1021/jf703677v. Epub 2008 Mar 20
download here: http://www.researchgate.net/publication/5500153_Acrylamide_release_resulting_from_sunlight _irradiation_of_aqueous_polyacrylamideiron_mixture s

From the Wiki article, it appears that un-polymerized acrylamide is a toxin of concern with respect to consumer use of PAM. The article listed above apparently reports data suggesting that PAM + iron + sunlight releases acrylamide. My guess is that the evidence is non-conclusive OR that the quantities released are not really problematic. But, big consumer companies (like Chemtura / Aqua Clear) don't want products that have a bad rep, if it's undeserved. So I'm guessing that Chemtura may have looked that the small profits (for them) from the product, and the possibly large PR risk, and decided to dump it.

Of course, that's ONLY a guess. However, it appears that you might be a bit safer using the FerriTabs, if you keep the pH high, near 8.0:

Linear anionic polyacrylamide (PAM) has been used in irrigation practices as a flocculating agent to minimize water losses through seepage in earthen canals. The stability of PAM is of concern because of the possibility of acrylamide (AMD) monomer release during environmental weathering. Aqueous solutions of commercial PAM mixed with ferric sulfate, subjected to simulated and natural sunlight irradiation, showed polymer chain scission and release of the AMD monomer. At acid/neutral pH, the amount of AMD released was directly related to the concentration of ferric ion and the irradiation time. At alkaline pH (∼8), PAM/Fe3+ mixtures were stable under irradiation. (highlight added by PoolDoc) PAM chain scission involved the hydroxyl radical, but specific AMD release appeared to require PAM-bound iron. Low iron concentrations and alkaline pH of irrigation water would limit AMD release. Residual monomer in PAM can contribute AMD to irrigation water, but concentrations would remain below the U.S. EPA drinking water standard of 0.5 ppb.

[jrsdws]

Today the pool is very clear...nearly perfect. I have some iron sediment that has settled on the bottom, as well as regular dirt, so going to vacuum shortly. I'm sticking with the pucks in the skimmer basket for now while I'm working on water chemistry. I have to do all readings yet this afternoon. TA started really high and I've been bubbling the return and lowering pH accordingly with muriatic acid. I guess when I get things right I'll run it back up in the 7.8 range. Still many unknowns I think as I've read many posts about the iron discolored water coming back after a few days. We'll see soon enough.

I think the FerriTabs had their place and helped, but I think keeping up with the sequestering agent and running the pucks 24/7 in the skimmer has done more.

I'm just looking foward to some pool enjoyment again instead of pool frustration.