Replacing a liner in a 16x32' inground pool

[DIYLINER]

The liner was showing its age when we moved in about 9 years ago
It finally developed a massive leak over the winter, the shallow end was dry in the Spring
I had planned on replacing the liner myself at that time, wife threw a fit so I did not do it
Now I've decided to go ahead & DIY....can't afford the $2k they will charge around here

Sand packed bottom,hopper appears to be concrete lined
It needs some patching here & there, nothing catastrophic
Whats the best mix to use, hydraulic cement for smaller patches ?

I plan on putting the foam around the steel sides
Whoever installed the last liner failed to put it on 3 sides...maybe the 4th side was already there

I'd also like to reduce the deep end from about 8' 6" to about 7'
It used to have a diving board, long gone
I thought maybe dumping about a foot of gravel in as fill, then pouring 6" concrete on top ?

Pool has been here for 30 years, no signs of movement
Thanks
-Dave

[aylad]

That's a question for Waste--I'll alert him to pop in here and see what he can do to help :)

Welcome to the forum!

[waste]

The liner was showing its age when we moved in about 9 years ago
It finally developed a massive leak over the winter, the shallow end was dry in the Spring
I had planned on replacing the liner myself at that time, wife threw a fit so I did not do it
Now I've decided to go ahead & DIY....can't afford the $2k they will charge around here

Sand packed bottom,hopper appears to be concrete lined
It needs some patching here & there, nothing catastrophic
Whats the best mix to use, hydraulic cement for smaller patches ?

I plan on putting the foam around the steel sides
Whoever installed the last liner failed to put it on 3 sides...maybe the 4th side was already there

I'd also like to reduce the deep end from about 8' 6" to about 7'
It used to have a diving board, long gone
I thought maybe dumping about a foot of gravel in as fill, then pouring 6" concrete on top ?

Pool has been here for 30 years, no signs of movement
Thanks
-Dave


Hi Dave, welcome to The Forum!

2K for a liner drop, if it includes the wall foam and floor touch up is pretty cheap.

However, you are also wanting to make the hopper less deep.

I don't know if you would be able to use a 'stock' liner for the pool as it sits now but, if you modify the hopper, you'll need to get a custom liner (it's the better way to replace a liner anyway but ... costs a bit more).

I would love to discuss your remodel (especially, the floor, both sand and crete parts, walls, light, plumbing and stairs) - without a good idea of what you have and what you want to be done - I'm left guessing and proffering advice that may or may not fit your needs :sad:

I've done the rehab I think you're talking about dozens of times and am more than willing to help you do it right while saving as much money as possible (especially avoiding the shortcuts, oversights or poor workmanship that might end up costing you more money in the future).

As said, I'm more than willing to consult with you on your pool rehab and help you as much as I can on-line.

(Thanks, Jan, for the 'heads up' :) )

[DIYLINER]

Thanks for the Welcome, I'd appreciate any info/help you can offer
The $2k was only an estimate for labor, did not include parts, foam etc
And given the patching that needs to be done I can imagine that price would increase

The pool is 16' 3" by 32' 4", it's also slightly out of square & short side measures 16' 3.5" at one end........16' 2.5" in the middle & 16' 3" at the far end
The long side measures 32' 3.5" on one side........32' 4" on the other side
Seems it should not be an off the shelf stock liner to begin with ?

The steel walls "straight" walls measure about 40-42" (only thing I did not write down as easily measured)
They do not appear to be in too bad a shape, some rust but not bad - seems to be surface only
I was wondering if I should paint over the rust spots - I have some oil base Rustoleum
The thin rolled foam along the walls is in the plans

I do not have a inground light installed
I do have a 50w light for an above ground pool that I used to have installed under the diving board (board now gone)
I have plenty of lighting in the pool area so no intention of trying to install a light

The stairs are fiberglass, I do have one small crack in one stair that will be under water
I had planned on patching that, I'd think I'd need some fiberglass matt & resin
Also planned on repainting the fiberglass stairs as well as the coping

I do not have a floor drain/skimmer - old pool - it only has 1 wall skimmer & 2 returns
It's 1.5" plumbing everywhere except into out of the Hayward Pro-Grid DE4820 filter
The pump is currently a 1.5 hp Hayward SP3010X AZ15 pump - up to 96 gpm
When we moved in it did not have enough flow so I replaced the filter & upsized the pump
One reason for upsizing the pump was to supply water to the solar heat system -now being re-installed on the new cabana roof

After draining down the pool & measuring I have 7' 11" depth at the deep end to the top of the liner bead, not as deep as I thought
Subtract the approx 6" to the top of the skimmer & I should have maybe 7' 5" depth when full as much as possible
Possibly still interested in reducing the depth, but not as critical due to less depth then I originally thought

What I am thinking about is putting down 2" XPS rigid foam (R10 - 25 psi) in the hopper & then pouring "x" inches of concrete over that
Since I heat only with solar & hopefully it will be 15+ years before another liner goes in now seems to be the time
In the shallow end I'm thinking only 1" (R5)....I don't see 1/2" available at the local big box store

I'd love to have the whole pool & deck professionally redone
But unless I hit the lottery that isn't going to happen
I have 2 concrete sections of the pool I'll need to cut up & repour (cracked, one small area sank/cracked a little)
Then its a matter of trying to do something to coat/color all of the concrete to match

That's my info for now
I have some pics & can take any more as needed
Thanks again - Dave

[waste]

Dave, always a pleasure to help the good folks here. :)

Take care of the pool first, then worry about the deck.



Your pool is most certainly 'out of square' and, as such, will require a custom liner. If the budget allows, why not 'shallow up' the pool?

I have never had much success with the 'rigid foam', but maybe I just never learned to do it right.. My preference is vermiculite however, you can use sand or sand and cement or regular concrete for a pool base - I'll help tell you how to apply any of them.

If you DIY you'll need to properly measure the pool before ordering the new liner - I can help with that.

I'm also worried that your stair faceplates and gaskets may need replacing.

You've taken on a BIG job - I can help you with any phase of it, but you need patience and we need to communicate throughout the rehab, so that you don't inadvertantly harm the pool while fixing it. :innocent:

[DIYLINER]

Thanks,

I am planning on adding the 2" foam to the existing hopper bottom
Then add some 8x16 pavers to hold them in place, add sand/small rock to level off.....then compact as much as possible
Then pour a new floor on top of the sand etc..........I'm thinking of only raising the floor less then 12"

2" rigid, 2" sand etc....Then 4" concrete on top of that - would that be enough ?
I'm not sure fo the difference between concrete and cement......just the mix ?
If the vermiculite/sand/cement mix is better then I can go with that, HD has 2 cu ft vermiculite bags for $21

Smoother is better for the liner :)

Thanks
-Dave

[PoolDoc]

pool chart data processed . . . .

[DIYLINER]

pool chart data processed . . . .

Thanks...question regarding the pool chart data...I can't access it
On different pool volume calculators my pool volume always came out around 19,000g....which I thought was high
Mainly due to the way my pool is formed...sides that slope in etc
I always thought I could have a more accurate volume with something like autocad
Does the pool chart use a more accurate calculator ? ---since I *think* my signature volume was update to 16,600 g
Thanks !
-Dave

[PoolDoc]

An AutoCAD calculation would be WAY more accurate. The algorithm used on the Pool Chart is my own, and makes the following assumptions:

1. Break begins 1/3 of the distance from the shallow to the deep end.
2. Hopper bottom (straight slopes) rather than bowl bottom.
3. Actual water level is 6" below listed depths.

It does not account for a 4" - 6" shelf around the deep end.

Pool salesmen consistently over-estimate pool volumes, as a sales tool.

[DIYLINER]

Thanks.....great to have a closer approximation of the actual water in the pool
Raising the bottom will decrease the volume even more......easier to solar heat the pool

[PoolDoc]

Raising the bottom will decrease the volume even more......easier to solar heat the pool

Not as much as you think -- most of the heat loss in an AG pool is from the surface, and 2nd most is from the top 12" the pool sides.

[DIYLINER]

Actually it will make quite a difference, since we have a stream on the property & groundwater flow
The groundwater flow constantly cools the bottom of the pool
The 1st year we lived here we hardly used the pool as it was too cold
With solar heat the 2nd year temps were in the 80's
Insulating the bottom against the ground water flow will make a big difference, just wish the whole pool had been insulated when installed

[PoolDoc]

Insulating a pool can make a difference, but it's still true that your major loss is via the surface.

[DIYLINER]

I had a cover the 1st year we moved in, I did not have solar heat
In my case the major loss of heat is thru the ground