New guy LOST !!!!

[AE340B]

Hi folks, new guy here. I made the mistake of buying a pool that's a bit too large. It's about 44,000 gallons. I don't know much about pools or chemistry, so I've basically let the pool store run rampant on me, with the usual financial casulties resulting. It's an "L" shape with a vinyl liner, a DE filter and a heat pump heater. I'm located on Long Island NY. I opened the pool yesterday and it's already crystal clear. I had my water tested today at Leslies, and it shows the following:

Free Chlorine: 0.5
Ph : 7.4
TA : 110
Calcium Hardness:170

That's all they tested for. They said I needed to buy Hardness Plus, to increase the water hardness, which I did. I added 27 pounds, as they suggested. In reading through the posts here, it seems that I don't need that for a vinyl pool, but then again some seem to suggest that I do because of my heater. The problems I usually have is that it's hard to determine what I need to add and when due to the size of my pool and my limited knowlege. Given the above numbers what do you folks suggest I add, and how much of it should I add? They didn't test for total chlorine or CYA. I have only used 3" pucks since the day I first got the pool. I had just a touch of algae last year for the first time. I loaded up the in line chlorinator today with the usual 3" pucks, so in time the chlorine will come up. Any and all input would be greatly appreciated. I know I have a HUGE learning curve ahead of me. Your input and patience are greatly appreciated.
Doug

[ivyleager]

Doug,

Welcome! That's what I like, a guy who actually admits he's LOST!!!

Most pool stores run many more tests than the ones you posted:
Free chlorine
Total chlorine
Combined chlorine
pH
Alk
Calc hardness
TDS (total dissolved solids)
CYA
copper
iron
saturation index

There's more, I just can't remember this late. Not quite sure why they only ran the few tests you noted. If they can't test for them, find another store. Or, better yet, purchase a drops based kit. Most pool stores carry a Taylors kit (~$70-80) or you can order one of Bens. Either way, testing your own pool water is the way to go.

Are you still thinking of using the pucks? I used pucks for only 1 year, and my CYA >100ppm. Mainly because my inline Hayward chlorinator knob malfunctioned. Seems to be a problem with their product line. Pucks also drive the pH down as they are acidic. The common wisdom is that the CYA level determines the chlorine range required for proper sanitation. So do get that tested soon. Most of the folks here use bleach for chlorination, or SWG/SWC seem to be on the rise also.

Can't help you with the hardness question. That's important if you have plaster/cement pools or use a heater. Down here in Carolina water temps are in the 70's. No need for heater, or at least that's what spouse keeps saying.

Keep reading the posts and you'll pick things up. I'm sure others will chime in with guidance and suggestions, too.

CaryB

[CarlD]

Yeah, test for CYA. I think you chlorine is a little low, but the CYA level dictates the proper chlorine level. Check out Ben's Best Guess table posted by Watermom.

And congratulations on being strong enough and smart enough to figure out you are lost and that the pool store "Pool Stored" you! I'm not kidding--it takes a strong person to come here and say what you said. You also did it WHILE YOUR POOL IS STILL CLEAN AND HEALTHY! You are ALREADY on the right track!

We'll cut through the nonsense and help you enjoy your beautiful new pool for years to come. Don't worry about the size. RARELY do people say "I wish I had a smaller pool!", but they ALWAYS say "I wish I had a BIGGER pool!"

[AE340B]

Thanks, Cary and Carl. Unfortunately, I will probably have to stick with the pucks. I'm away from home due to work about 4 consecutive days per week and need something automated while I'm gone. I guess I need to purchase a test kit that covers all the parameters you discussed. How long do these test kits last before the drops go bad? I have a small drops based test kit that I bought 2 years ago when I first ordered the pool. Is it still good? If so, the results differ from the pool store results. It shows NO chlorine (which makes sense since at the point I tested yesterday there was none put into the pool since it was closed last October), and also showed Ph of 7.2 and Alkalinity of 40. I plan on going to a different pool store today and having a complete water test done again and compare. Also, what is "shock" ? Do I use liquid or powder, and what type? What does it do? How do I know when I need to shock the pool? I really appreciate all the help. The only thing I know for certain is that I have a ton more to learn. If you folks don't mind, I'll post the new water test reults here later today. Hopefully the parameters they test for will be more complete. Thanks for the help and the info.
Doug

[Sherra]

Just inserting my personal experience here. If you're gone up to 4 days at a time and not using the pool, are you covering it at all while you're gone? I keep my pool covered with a solar cover and I only add bleach about once a week when it's not used, sometimes not even that often depending on my readings (I try not to let my level get less than 5 due to my CYA level). Twice a week when we've been swimming it it. If there's not bather load, theoretically the chlorine demand shouldn't be as high.

As for how much chemical to put in...have you downloaded the BleachCalc? It's a huge life saver. You enter the volume of your pool & it can calculate the rest for you!

[AE340B]

HI, folks-
I just returned from another pool store with a full water test. Here's the results:

Free Chlorine: 0.5
Total Chlorine: 0.5
pH: 7.4
total Alkalinity: 50
Calcium Hardness: 140
CYA: 0.0

I guess the question now is, what do I add, in what order, and how much? Again, the pool is a vinyl liner 44,000 gallon pool. I think I know why the CYA is gone - I had a leak in the solid cover all winter that allowed the water from the pool to seep up onto the cover, after which the automatic cover pump would dump it all overboard. I had to keep refilling my pool all winter. I would guess that all in all I replaced the vast majority of my water this past winter, 12" at a time! Will the use of the 3" pucks bring the CYA up to where it needs to be, or do I need to add some stabilizer now? I'd hate to raise it to normal levels now, only to have the pucks push it over the edge and have to drain the pool later in the year to bring it back down. The water is still only 56 degrees, if that matters. I think I may be at the point now where I'm starting to see a glimmer of knowledge, but it's just enough to be a danger to myself. :) Sherra, thanks for the info. Where do I go to download this bleach calc formula? As far as the solar cover, I'm gone alot but my wife and two kids are still here when I'm gone, and the kids are in the pool almost every day. My kids and I basically overuled my wife's objections to the pool when we bought it so she has no strong interest in helping me to maintain it. That's why I need the auto chlorinator. The kids are still to young to maintain the pool in my absence. Also, if anyone has answers to my shock questions asked in the post above I'd certainly be appreciative. As I said earlier, I'm still lost, however I feel that slowly I'm starting to learn. Thanks again to all of you for your help so far. I look forward to the time when I know enough that I can return the favor by helping another who is lost as I am now.
Doug

[Area Man]

Doug,

Wait for others to reply, because I'm learning too. But I think you should add an initial dose of CYA rather than relying on the pucks. Michael's BleachCalc calculator suggests 10 lbs or so to get your CYA up in the 30's.

Did the pool store really report your total alkalinity at 50 today, and 110 yesterday? Something seems wrong there. Using Ben's test kit gives me very consistent TA results.

It also seems odd that they reported lower calcium hardness today, after you added the "Hardness Plus" they recommended yesterday. My general recommendation is: test it yourself! I value my pool store, but am having better results from my own testing and adjustment using information from this forum.

Rick

[AE340B]

Rick,
I agree that I need to get a test kit. The stores around here (I tried the 4 that I know of) all sell the small kits that don't test for CYA. I know Ben sells them, but I think I should get one fairly soon, and other posts from people who have already ordered tham seem to suggest that they take quite a while to arrive after the order. I'll probably just order from Ben and test at the stores until it arrives. Ben put this whole sits together so ordering from him seems to be the right thing to do to support him and his efforts. I agree with you that the test results are all over th board. I think the results I got yesterday were wrong. My small home test kit agrees with the numbers I got today. My kit only does FC, pH and Alkalinity, but those numbers match. Thanks for the response.
Doug

[fullhouse]

this should be the correct link to get you to the bleach calculator. mwsmith wrote it and it is in the signature of all of his posts. there are add'l calculators in the top corner. :) http://www.hal-pc.org/~mwsmith2/BleachCalc262.exe

[Sherra]

http://www.hal-pc.org/~mwsmith2/BleachCalc262.exe
One of our regulars on this board wrote the program. When you download it, save it to your desktop. It's a very small program. You can customize all the settings once you open it. First thing I'd do is in the upper left corner click on "more calcs" and then "settings" and change the units to "imperial" (U.S. units instead of Metric...unless you're more comfortable using metric), then enter your pool volume in gallons. From that point you'll be able to easily figure out how much bleach, etc you need to add to bring your levels up to where you need them. With having practially no chlorine in your water right now and not CYA, you need to bring your chlorine up to about 3 (assuming your water is clear).

Then, my suggestion is to bring your CYA up to about 20 or 30 since you plan on continuing to use pucks. That will get some CYA in your pool and still give you a little wiggle room for using the pucks.

[Sherra]

Sorry, I was typing my reply at work and got interrupted by my boss and actually had to do some work and didn't get to hit the "post" button for almost an hour. Darn work! :)