Replacing liner with high water table

[jjdean]

Hi,

I am going to be replacing my 20' x 40' IG liner, but the water table is currently higher than the bottom of the pool. After I drain the pool, there is about 2 inches of water in the deep end after sitting for an hour (a couple of feet when it sits over night). Since I've never replaced a liner before, I doubt that I can get the liner into position and start filling the pool within an hour. Does anyone have any advice they could lend?

Thanks,

Jeff

[Watermom]

bumping this back up

[aylad]

This sounds like a question for Waste, who must have missed it along with the rest of us. I'm sorry!! We're all trying to be more conscientious about not missing posts, but this one got by us.

Do you have the liner in, or are you still working with it?

Janet

[jjdean]

The liner is going in on Friday (weather permitting). I'm still finishing up lots of patching with vermiculite. Right now my plan is to run a garden hose down thru the main drain line and use a small pump to get the water out from underneath the liner while it's being installed. Someone will have to use a squeegy on top of the liner to get the water that accumulates under the liner to the main drain while others get the rest of the liner ready. I'm not sure if this will work or not.

If anyone has any other suggestions/advice, I would be more than happy to hear.

Thanks,

Jeff

[Chardonnay]

It sounds to me as if you've done all that you can but I am curious to know if you've had problems with the liner "floating" in the past because of your high water table? A high water table is usually always there unless you've had a lot of rain lately. Water pressure has a lot of force behind it and a high water table can wreak havoc with a liner...especially at the main drain.

[waste]

Welcome to the Forum, Jeff!

Sorry i missed this earlier.

What we would do in your situation is break through the vermiculite floor in the deep end, dig down ~ 18" put ~ 1' of gravel in the hole and drop in a sump pump and fill around it with more gravel. Leave the pump running 24/7 until you are ready to drop the liner (actually the morning of the drop, turn off the pump - try to keep the water in the discharge hose from flowing back into the pool- and see how long it takes for the water to get up to the floor level again). When the time comes to drop the liner, put a piece of cardboard over the pump, to keep the hot motor from melting the new liner, and fit the liner in place. Pull the deep end back so as to reveal the pump and get the shallow end and steps(?) set. Then, just before you start filling the pool, pull the pump, add gravel to ~1'" of the floor and patch the hole with hydrolic cement (Waterplug or similar).

The hydrolic cement sets within 5 minutes and you're ready to finish the install and start the water.

Please be sure to sweep the floor 3 times before the liner is installed and make sure the walls are free of debris - also be very careful not to leave any chunks of the Waterplug on the floor - trowel them down or sweep them up but leave nothing between the floor and the liner!

Are you dropping the liner yourself? If so, let me know if you need any tips on prepping the pool or doing the dropping (I've dropped well over 1000 liners & some of them even ended up in the pool LOL)

[jjdean]

We just moved into the house last year, and this is the first time we will be using the pool. The house was vacant for a couple of years before we moved in, and the pool wasn't in good shape. Large sections of the side wall had washed away, and the liner was mostly out of the the track. I can relate to your main drain comment - I had to patch completely around the main drain, as the floor bottom around it had washed away.




It sounds to me as if you've done all that you can but I am curious to know if you've had problems with the liner "floating" in the past because of your high water table? A high water table is usually always there unless you've had a lot of rain lately. Water pressure has a lot of force behind it and a high water table can wreak havoc with a liner...especially at the main drain.

[jjdean]

Thanks for the advice, Ted. I'll dig out a hole tonight. A friend of mine actually suggested doing the same thing when we were trying to figure out what to do, but we didn't follow thru because we weren't sure if it would work.

I am going to drop the liner myself. Originally planned for Friday, but maybe Monday now (if the new sump pit needs a few more days to cure the water problem). I do have some questions that maybe you can answer:

1) I get conflicting instructions on when to screw in the gaskets around the stairs. Some say wait until the water gets into the shallow end, and some say do it right away. What's your opinion? Also, I do have some concerns because the stairs extend into the pool about an inch, so the liner won't be flat against the wall when I screw the gasket covers on. Do you need to cut the liner out of the stair section before you put the gasket cover on (so the liner lays flat against the wall)? Or will the liner stretch enough, so that getting a crease in the corners isn't an issue? My liner is 28 mil wall and floor.

2) One corner of the deep end is about 1 1/2 to 2 inches deeper than the other three. I didn't note this on the liner dimension sheet because I planned on adding some vermiculite to the floor to level it out. Now I'm wondering if I need to do this or will the liner stretch into position anyway, so I don't need to worry about it?

Thanks a lot for your help,

Jeff






Welcome to the Forum, Jeff!

Sorry i missed this earlier.

What we would do in your situation is break through the vermiculite floor in the deep end, dig down ~ 18" put ~ 1' of gravel in the hole and drop in a sump pump and fill around it with more gravel. Leave the pump running 24/7 until you are ready to drop the liner (actually the morning of the drop, turn off the pump - try to keep the water in the discharge hose from flowing back into the pool- and see how long it takes for the water to get up to the floor level again). When the time comes to drop the liner, put a piece of cardboard over the pump, to keep the hot motor from melting the new liner, and fit the liner in place. Pull the deep end back so as to reveal the pump and get the shallow end and steps(?) set. Then, just before you start filling the pool, pull the pump, add gravel to ~1'" of the floor and patch the hole with hydrolic cement (Waterplug or similar).

The hydrolic cement sets within 5 minutes and you're ready to finish the install and start the water.

Please be sure to sweep the floor 3 times before the liner is installed and make sure the walls are free of debris - also be very careful not to leave any chunks of the Waterplug on the floor - trowel them down or sweep them up but leave nothing between the floor and the liner!

Are you dropping the liner yourself? If so, let me know if you need any tips on prepping the pool or doing the dropping (I've dropped well over 1000 liners & some of them even ended up in the pool LOL)

[waste]

I'm gonna wait til tomorrow, when I have the day off, before responding :)


Just didn't want you to htink you were being blown off.

[waste]

Hey Jeff.

Let me start off by saying to pump the water as far away from the pool as you can - and preferably downhill from the pool.

The stair screw question is a tough one - on the one hand, it's hard to get the vacs to fully pull out the wrinkles without the faceplate attached, on the other hand, without the water fully setting the liner, you have potential tears or spots where the liner isn't fully against the walls (which will cause premature weakening in those areas).

In Va. we used a piece of coping screwed to plywood (enough to cover the stairs and duct taped to the deck) to hold the liner in place until the water was up to normal level, then get wet and hand screw the ~ 60 faceplate screws in. In Ct. they were better with liner pools, the company I worked for only installed IG liner pools and have ~ pretty much mastered it. The way they did it was to get the slope transition "break" set, then get the shallow end corners ~ perfect and then do the steps 'dry'. You need the vacs running to do it this way - so let's hope that you can pull the pump for ~ 30 minutes, while doing this:cool:

As I type this, I've realized that I can't tell a first-timer all the 'tips and tricks' :( Use sand bags or duct tape to seal the stairs while the vacs are running and install the faceplates when the water is up to the the faceplate on the bottom.) By the time the water is up that far, you'll have removed the vacs - DON'T! - just pull them up ~ 6" and let them pull the liner ~ tight into the gap that the 1" stair lip makes:) so you can do the side plates without having to worry about the gap!

I realize that this probably isn't very lucid for you :mad:- we've still got a few days to work out the terminology, so that you'll better understand what I'm saying.

[jjdean]

Thanks Waste.

I think I understand what you're saying: Wait until the water gets near the bottom faceplate of the stairs, then raise the vacuum lines up a bit, and if I've sealed the liner good enough - the liner should pull into the area where the stairs extend out from the wall (hopefully the liner will stretch enough to be flush against the wall at the bottom corners of the stairs). I suppose I could heat the liner with a hair dryer if I have to, and manually force the corners in?

Jeff

[waste]

Sounds like we're on the same page :)

I would avoid heating the liner to get the faceplates on - with a 70*+ day and sun, the liner should be pliable enough to get the faceplates on. If you need a little more stretch, you can cut the center of the liner that you'll be removing from the steps (in other words, stretch it from the stair side NOT from the corners). Definitely have the bottom plate installed first!

Please let me know if you have more questions about this!