New (very grateful) user/question re: bleach addition

[Texas247]

Hi! First, thank you so much for this forum! I've gone from a person who only knew how to swim in a pool to someone who feels more confident in caring for one :) My family and I closed on a new house 2 weeks ago, and when we walked into the backyard, the swimming pool looked like raw sewage (even had a couple of dead birds floating in it!). Needless to say, we were completely disheartened...until I found this website. Now after 2 weeks of cleaning (and cleaning and cleaning) and shocking and adjusting alkalinity/pH, it's actually pretty clean and I can see the bottom (when we closed you couldn't even see the top step). I've become a firm believer in the BBB method, and now I would like a little advice regarding my numbers:

FC: 0.5 ppm
TC: 0.5 ppm
CC: 0.0 ppm
pH: 7.5
CH: 200 ppm
TA: 90 ppm
CYA: 85 ppm
No metals detected

My pool is approximately 16' x 35' inground with a vinyl liner and is 3' to 8' deep. The pump is a Hayward 1.0 hp and the filter is a Nautilus DE filter (the label is worn on it so I'm not sure of the actual size but I can read the worn part that says it requires 7 lbs of DE). It's running now at a consistent 14 psi after we cleaned the grids and replaced the DE, have replaced filter baskets in the skimmer and pump basket, and vacuumed out about a bajillion pounds of sediment/leaves to waste (and then had to replace it - my poor water bill :(). The water is pretty clear and I can see the bottom of the deep end, but it's still a little cloudy. I need to add more chlorine, and the alkalinity is a little low. Which one do I address first? Also, how many gallons of 6% bleach should I add to bring the levels up correctly?

[AnnaK]

You want to address chlorine first. Your TA is actually within range and, if your pH is holding steady without wild fluctuations, you don't need to do anything with the TA.

Take a look at Ben's Best Guess Chlorine Chart (http://poolsolutions.com/gd/best-guess-swimming-pool-chlorine-chart.html#a). It tells us that at CYA=85 you want a minimum FC = 5 ppm. You should try to get the CYA down a little because the higher it is, the more chlorine you'll need. Your value is really at the upper limit of manageable.

It would be better if you can get it down to 50. You can do that by replacing water - a partial drain and refill works but so does gradual replacement of water lost from splashout and backwashing. Don't use trichlor pucks (if you were in the habit of using them). Go with just bleach.

As to how much bleach, take a look at the Pool Calculator (http://poolcalculator.com). Input your pool's approximate volume, your current FC, your target FC, and the type of bleach you use, and it will tell you the amount to add to achieve your target.

Welcome to the Pool Forum, your gateway to "Five Minutes A Day" pool maintenance. You did a good job cleaning up what sounds like a cesspit. What method do you use for testing the water?

[Texas247]

Thank you so much AnnaK! While I'm waiting on my Taylor kit to come in I've relied on the HTH test kit (not strips) from WalMart and comparing those results with 'professional' tests at the pool store. They have the funniest confused look on their faces when I tell them I'm using the BBB method :), but they have learned not to pressure me to buy their chemicals. I only buy equipment at the pool store now, but they still test my water for me and tell me to "do whatever that method calls for." Thanks again for all your information; Southeast Texas gets a little warm this time of year and I'm ready to JUMP IN!!!

[AnnaK]

The HTH kit will do you until the Taylor arrives and it's useful that you're checking your values against the pool store's tests. Once you get the Taylor and use it daily you'll become confident with the results and will trust them more than the pool store's.

You go right ahead and jump in your pool! Your numbers are good, raise the FC some, keep the filter going, have fun.

[CarlD]

Actually, if you're still cleaning the pool you want to shock the water up to 20ppm. You'll have to make do with what you have but it's do-able. I estimate your pool to be 23,100 gallons... It could be 20k, or 25k, but this is good enough. 8 gallons of 6% bleach should bring your FC to around 20 or 21. You can use the CarlD Shot Glass dilution method but you'll need 3 shots of distilled water for 1 shot of pool water to see a chlorine level of 20 (assuming your kit goes to 5).

Or you can look for the OTO test to go deep yellow, but not orange.

Unfortunately, the 8 gallons are the FIRST time. You'll need to test and boost your chlorine back to 20 till your water can sustain it...

Once it's completely clear, then you can go into the maintenance level AnnaK is talking about.

Carl

[Texas247]

CarlD, what do you mean by "still cleaning"? There is a little bit of cloudyness to the water, but as far as sediment and leaves I'm all done vacuuming and scrubbing (Thank God!). Everything is clear to the bottom of the deep end, but as I said, a little cloudy. To be perfectly honest, the liner is completely bleached out (we knew this before we purchased the house and plan to replace this next year), but there is nothing left as far as deposits of sediment and/or dirt. Should I still bring it to shock levels or just work on raising it to maintenance levels? My plan was to just add nearly (according to the Pool Calculator) 3 gallons of 6% bleach tonight, measure after running it for a couple of hours, and then rechecking for loss in the morning. Should I add more?

[madwil]

normally, shocking/cleaning is supposed to go on until 3 things all happen
1- loss of FC overnight is <1
2- CC is <.5
3- water is clear

If you meet 1 and 2, probably you can get away without more shocking and let the filter clear up the cloudiness, but no guarantees.
but to meet 1, you need to at least add the 3 gallons you were planning, test the FC after an hour with pump running, and test again in morning before sun affects the pool (earlier is better, sometime around sunrise or shortly after!) If that test shows 1 and 2 are good, just maintain it after that...
As long as the pool is maintaining some FC, it's safe to swim in- even at shock levels, its safe but maybe harsh on swimwear! just be careful, if cloudy, someone could "disappear" on the bottom and you wouldn't know it!

[AnnaK]

My plan was to just add nearly (according to the Pool Calculator) 3 gallons of 6% bleach tonight, measure after running it for a couple of hours, and then rechecking for loss in the morning. Should I add more?

Given that you reported a CC = 0 your approach is reasonable. If your FC loss is greater than 1 ppm overnight and if you have more than 0.5 CC when you test this morning, go back to shock level for your amount of CYA.

The cloudiness is most likely caused by the remnants of dead algae and particulate debris and will eventually filter out. This is the most frustrating part of cleaning up a dirty pool—waiting for the water to sparkle. It takes time. Don't let the FC drop below 5 ppm; in fact, try to keep the FC at the high end of your range for now at 7 ppm.

[Texas247]

Woot! Pool looked great this morning and holding strong with no loss of FC (around 7 is my best guess as the HTH kit only goes to 5) :) I can see clearly to the bottom of the deep end. I can still see some particles in the water, but it's clearing out just from running the filter. Kids are gonna have a blast today - they're so excited! Now to get started on the landscaping around the pool.....*wondering if there's a forum for that*....LOL Thanks for all of the excellent advice!

[CarlD]

madwill nails it:

If your FC is NOT dropping by more than 1ppm overnight and your CC <.5ppm, you don't need to shock.

Otherwise you do.

Assuming you don't need to shock:
Other things to speed up cleaning your pool can be using "skimmer socks" in your skimmer. They are cheap and work amazingly well. A couple of layers of old panty-hose can substitute. I find the skimmer socks are fine enough to prevent pollen getting in to my filter.
You can also now dose your water with PolyQuat, the only algaecide we recommend. Interestingly, PolyQuat may help clear your water faster as its also a good clarifier. I'd only use an ounce or two, and you WILL see your FC drop over 24 hours, but probably not much.

Carl

[Texas247]

Update: I hesitated for a while to use the skimmer sock because I'd read conflicting opinions on it here in the forum, but after a week or two of having clean water and STILL getting sediment on the bottom (even after shocking, vacuuming to waste, repeat), I decided to take the plunge, so to speak. I am now a skimmer sock convert - it works beautifully! Thanks again for everyone's advice and information...this new pool owner is completely grateful!!!

[AnnaK]

We just love posts like that!

I use skimmer socks. I've found that if I brush the pool and stir up what dust/dirt is on the bottom much of it will get caught in the sock. I don't obsess over the occasional line of dirt in a dip or a liner crease. As soon as the dogs get in they'll stir it up back into solution and the sock will catch it.

Be advised that when you have lot of crud, such as in spring with various pollens, you want to exchange skimmer socks twice a day, maybe more. They are a terrific aid to keeping a pool clean.

Happy, happy, happy for your success!