Is CYA the same as Trichloro-s-Triazinetrione tablest?

[herb396]

Need to pump up my CYA, so I was shopping the local Walmart/Home Depot shelves for Trichlor Tabs. Is this the same thing?

[CarlD]

No.

Tri-chlor is chlorine that release CYA as it is used. But CYA, called also stabilizer, conditioner or Cyanuric Acid can be purchased as a seperate chemical.

Tri-Chlor is chlorine in the form of tablets (or sometimes powder) that goes in automatic chlorinators or floaters. When you need CYA added to your water, they can be a good way to add it, because as they erode they keep a fairly constant level of chlorine in your water. But Tri-Chlor has another bug/feature: It's highly acidic and tends to drive pH down. If pH is low, it's not necessarily a good idea to use it, although you can compensate by adding Borax to raise pH.

However, if your chlorine levels are good and you are using bleach or liquid chlorine to maintain them, you can just use CYA powder by itself.

But many people run into trouble by using Tri-Chlor tabs in a chlorinator all summer without watching CYA levels. Their CYA shoots up and despite having what they THINK is adequate chlorine, they get an algae bloom. That's when we say STOP DON'T USE TRI-CHLOR ANYMORE!

So, if pH is low and CYA is at your target level (another discussion for another thread) or high, don't use Tri-chlor.

If, however, you have no CYA and your pH is trending high then Tri-chlor may be ideal. This comes up when people have new gunite/shotcrete/plaster or tile pools that are curing, and, as they cure they drive up pH. Being new water, they also need CYA. THEN Tri-Chlor is good to use.

There's a powder called Di-Chlor that's very similar to Tri-Chlor. It's not as acid but adds even more CYA than Tri-Chlor. Same rules apply.

Cal-Hypo, the third powder, adds calcium, which may or may not be a problem...if it gets too high it's a problem.

Best is Bleach/ Liquid Chlorine. No side effects to worry about!

Carl

[Watermom]

What are your current water testing results? Depending on what they are, we can recommend what would be the best source of chlorine for your pool.

[aylad]

And just as a footnote to Carl's post, some trichlor tabs contain copper, so make sure to check your active ingredient list before you buy them, if that's what you decide to use. If it says "dual acting", or has copper in the ingredient list, don't buy them--copper is the culprit that turns hair and nails green. There are still some out there that do not contain copper. They may be a little more expensive, but not if you catch them on sale. Besides, in the long run the "cheap comes out expensive" because copper is a real PITA to deal with once it gets in your pool in levels high enough to start staining.

That being said, Please post your water testing results, as Watermom suggested, and we can help you go from there.

Janet

[herb396]

OK, I have a 25,000 gal gunite pool. Just at the tail end of opening. Water is clear after 6 days of 24/7 filter and at least 20 gal of bleach over that time to keep my CL levels up to clean up the green. Current reading are:
FC - 3.5
CC - .5
pH - 7.2
CYA - 0
ALK - 130

So I was assuming my next step was to get my CYA up. But I'm looking for proper direction at this time. (and exactly what product to purchase to do it) thanks

[aylad]

You could use trichlor, but the CYA rise will be slow, and your pH may tend to fall, which you don't need. I would just buy the stabilizer by itself--you can get it in the spa section at WalMart in 4 # jars. It's labeled "conditioner" or "balancer", I can't remember which--but look at the active ingredient--you're looking for cyanuric or isocyanuric acid. You can add it through the skimmer but not backwash for several days, or add it in a sock or old knee hi and hang it in front of the return.

If you do opt to use trichlor instead, go ahead and pick up a box of Borax too, and keep an eye on your pH.

Janet

[madwil]

If you have trichlor or dichlor, you can use it to get your CYA up; if you get the powder, use it to add Cl and the CYA will come up over time. quit using it once your CYA reaches 30-50, and use straight bleach after that for Cl...
if you don't have trichlor/dichlor already, I would get stabilizer/CYA and add direct, and just use bleach for Cl...
Remember what someone said about new gunite- drives pH up! so you may need acid to keep it in check
and later, you'll want to keep your CH up to prevent the gunite from leaching into pool over time...

[herb396]

Thanks for the advice, I think I'll look for the "conditioner". But I still have a question. What is "trichlor"? Is this a tablet? Is that the actual name of the product (becasue I can never find anything called "trichlor") And when I ask in the pool store, they don't seem to know) So where do you buy it?

Thanks again for the help, herb

[Watermom]

Trichlor is sold as tablets that you put in a floater or a chlorinator. If you go to a pool store that doesn't know what trichlor is, RUN FROM THAT STORE!!

[CarlD]

Ha!-Ha! Lisa's right. A pool store that doesn't know what Tri-Chlor is, isn't a pool store.

When you look a container of chlorine tablets or powder it will say on active ingredients Trichlor...something. That's Tri_chlor. If it says Dichlor...something...that's Di-Chlor. If it says Calcium Hypchlorite, that's Cal-Hypo.

Frequently Tri-Chlor tablets are labeled as Stablized Chlorine, but the ingredient is Trichlor...etc. If it says "Double-Acting" or contains copper do NOT,NOT buy it!

With a gunite pool you also need to watch your Calcium Hardness levels. You T/A as at the high end, or just past. If your T/A is too high and your calcium is too high, you'll get cloudy water.

For now, I wouldn't even add Borax to raise pH. Instead, I'd use aeration of the water, which will increase it. Doing that will keep your T/A from rising.

If you don't have tri-chlor or dichlor around, just use bleach and add CYA.

But most important is to watch your numbers.

Carl

[herb396]

OK, found the cyanuric acid (aka: Stabilizer & Conditioner by hth). So I now have two 4lb bottles. Do I just fill a floater and drop in in the pool? If my floater is busted can I just hang a sock full of this stuff over the edge?

Thanks for the great guidance!
herb

[Watermom]

You can either put some in a sock and hang the sock in front of a return jet or pour it slowly into the skimmer and let it dissolve in the filter which is what I usually do. If you do put it into the skimmer, don't backwash for about a week to give it time to dissolve completely or else you'll just lose it. Do NOT broadcast it across the pool, however, like some labels suggest that you do. You don't want acid granules sitting on your liner.

[herb396]

The sock has been hanging since last night with about 3lbs of granular cyanuric acid. Water is clear (yeah no green!) My current readings are:
FC - 6
CC - 1
pH - 7.0
TA - 110
CH - 240 (calcium hardness)
CYA - 0

What to do next? Add Borax and plenty more of the cyanuric acid? How long should it take to see the CYA present? More bleach too?
Again, I'm working with a 25,000 gal./ 30 yr old gunite pool

[Watermom]

Go ahead and add enough bleach to get back up to 10 since you have a CC reading of 1. ( You want the CC to be zero.) In a 25K pool, each quart of 6% bleach will raise the chlorine level by about 0.6ppm. You want to test and add bleach at least twice per day and probably 3x if you can and each time add enough bleach to get back up to 10ppm. Do this until you can go from sundown one day to sunup the next day without losing more than 1ppm of cl.

You probably still have most of the CYA in the sock. Keep it in front of the return jet and give it a squeeze a couple of times a day to help it dissolve faster. Don't test for it or add more CYA until about a week after you added it to give it time to register.

Add a half a box of Borax and see how high that takes the pH. You are above 7.0 now, so that is good. Aim for 7.4-7.6.

[herb396]

The sock is now empty (total of 4lbs), my pH is up to 7.6 and I'm maintaining my CC to 10 with bleach. I've noticed very small translucent / white flakes on top of the water (not alot, but a very light layer on top of the water). Almost like soap flakes (or snow flakes). When I touch one it just seems to dissolve when rubbed between my fingers. Is this a result of the CYA being presented to the water? (or maybe my sock dissolving?) lol. thanks

[madwil]

not sure about the flakes, but they will filter out or dissolve with time. You want your FC to stay at 10- you want your CC to go eventually to 0 (or <.5...) so if your CC is 10, you need to keep adding chlorine to maintain FC higher to oxidize the CC

[herb396]

Typo there. My FC is 8 today and my CC is 0.2. So I think I'm on track. thank you