Pump still running but no longer moving water...

[aylad]

Turned on the pump this morning, fired right up, working, no problem. Went out by pool this afternoon about 2:00, still working, no problem. Went out to get water sample just now, and pump is still on, humming away, making normal noises, zero water movement in pool or skimmer. Opened strainer basket, water is very hot, basket filled only about halfway. Turned off pump, let it sit a few minutes, verified that there's plenty of water in the pool , turned pump back on, pump comes on fine but still no water movement. Something in the impeller? I stuck my fingers into the water inlet as far as I could but can't touch anything. Tried inserting a hook on end of a clothes hanger, it goes in about 4-5 inches and then stops--I figure that's the impeller, but I can't get anything to move past that.

Suggestions?

Janet

[mas985]

If there is no water movement at all and the filter pressure reads 0 PSI then it could be the impeller is either not moving or completely clogged or even the suction pipe is completly blocked. That would be consistent with the hot water as well. The only way to really check the impeller is to remove the motor from the wet end so you can make sure it is attached to the motor shaft and it is not clogged. Double check the suction lines for shut off valves or blockage. A broken check valve on the suction side can also block the line.

No water movement with very high filter pressure would indicate a return side blockage.

[aylad]

That pretty much confirms what I thought--but was curious why the impeller would clog or get stuck mid-day while the thing was running, instead of just refusing to start up. Guess I'll get hubby to take the thing apart tomorrow and see what happens...
Thanks...
Janet

[CarlD]

Jan,

If the motor's turning then the impeller is probably turning as well, but the channel from the pump's basket, or from the impeller to the filter may be jammed. You COULD try disconnecting a fitting from the filter and seeing if it works then, spraying water. If it does, your filter is jammed and it's not your pump.

Of course, if the motor is humming and not turning your impeller is jammed. But try disconnecting the output first (turn the filter to CLOSE first)....did you check your Multivalve to make sure it's on filter?

Just checking the obvious stuff...we all miss it. I did it last night. I just got a replacement for a Dell that had problems right off the bat (Dell was good about sending me a new box). But no sound! I went crazy and finally logged on to on-line support. The guy asked me if the speakers had a USB plug. I had never heard of such a thing on speakers but...he was right. They use the USB for power. I plugged it in and...felt really, really dumb. Diagnosis: "Idiot User Error"!:eek:

[Pool Clown]

Janet, Go and get a small mirror. That will possibly save some time. Use it to look at the inlet of the impeller to see if anything is in there. You may need a flashlight too. The smallest part in the impeller vanes is right at the inlet. If you have a blockage, you should be able to see w/o taking apart the pump.

Did you check and make sure that the weir (door) in the skimmer moves freely? If it gets stuck "up", the pump will drain out the skimmer, and give the symptoms you describe.

[aylad]

Carl, yes, the multiport is in "filter"--it had been running all day with me being the only one home with access to it, before it stopped moving water, but I checked anyway--and removing a fitting from my filter doesn't give me any water flow, either.

Pool clown, I like the mirror trick, will give that a shot and see what I can see, but again I stuck my fingers into the inlet as far as I could last night and couldn't touch the impeller, so not sure I can negotiate the angle with a flashlight and mirror, but I'll give it a shot. (Have a big rock waterfall that butts up to one side of the strainer basket--limits some maneuvering around the basket.) My brother owes me a favor and is supposed to come over this afternoon and take it apart for me. I had lots of little girls with long hair in the pool this summer, so I'm hoping it's as simple as that. We'll see!!

Janet

[Poconos]

Something else to try Jan. Take the pump basket lid off and stand by with a couple big buckets of water. Turn on the pump, it will be dry, and pour the water into the chamber and see if the pump gobbles it up. Reason I say buckets and not a garden hose is you will need more volume than a hose can deliver. If it sucks the buckets up real quick then the impeller is probably OK. It really does sound like a suction side blockage. Reason the water got hot is it isn't moving and the energy just goes into churning thus heating the water in the chamber. I don't know what the pump configuration looks like and how easy it would be to disconnect the inlet to the pump. I'm thinking of jury rigging your vacuum hose right into the pump and bypassing the skimmer and piping just to see if it pumps OK.
Al

[Pool Clown]

Janet, Something else to try...
Do you have a spa tied to the pool, that shares the equipment? If so, turn your mirror around and look down the pump inlet and see if you can see a blockage. If you see no blockage, switch the valves over to spa, and see if the pump takes off then (with the lid on of course).

[aylad]

Thanks, guys, for all the suggestions......Just an update....my brother finally got the thing apart and the culprit is a broken impeller shaft. There's a plastic piece at the end of the impeller shaft where it screws onto the shaft from the motor, and it's broken in half--so the pump was chugging along with no problem, but the impeller was then not connected to anything and therefore not turning. So--the new impeller with intact shaft is due in around 3:00 this afternoon, and I"ll go pick it up and hopefully (knocking on wood) be back in business when I get it all put back together again.

It's interesting--the impeller in this motor is not like the one in my first motor--the impeller is not a set of blades, but is actually a spinning plastic housing, with slots around the top that the water goes through on its way to the pump--there's not a set of exposed blades that something could get wrapped around,which is what I was expecting. I took some pics of it all taken apart, in case somebody else runs into this sometime... It's been a learning experience, as always...:rolleyes:

Janet

[Poconos]

Interesting....email me the pics when you have a chance Jan.
Al

[CarlD]

Sometimes a shaft can just fail. Metal gets lots of cracks in it when under stress, but if they don't make it to the surface of the metal they seal themselves (people don't realize that perfectly clean metal will bond with itself). If the crack makes it to the surface, then the impurities prevent it from re-sealing and the part fails. This is why shot-peening is used to strengthen metal parts--it makes it much harder for the crack to reach open air, or water, or an oil bath, so it re-seals more often.

The stuff you learn in 34 years of motorcycle riding!

The other suggestions were to save you from unnecessary dis-assembly by ruling out other causes.

[mas985]

Thanks, guys, for all the suggestions......Just an update....my brother finally got the thing apart and the culprit is a broken impeller shaft. There's a plastic piece at the end of the impeller shaft where it screws onto the shaft from the motor, and it's broken in half--so the pump was chugging along with no problem, but the impeller was then not connected to anything and therefore not turning. So--the new impeller with intact shaft is due in around 3:00 this afternoon, and I"ll go pick it up and hopefully (knocking on wood) be back in business when I get it all put back together again.

It's interesting--the impeller in this motor is not like the one in my first motor--the impeller is not a set of blades, but is actually a spinning plastic housing, with slots around the top that the water goes through on its way to the pump--there's not a set of exposed blades that something could get wrapped around,which is what I was expecting. I took some pics of it all taken apart, in case somebody else runs into this sometime... It's been a learning experience, as always...:rolleyes:

Janet

Most residential pool pumps use closed impellers these days. I think they are easier to manufacture and don't require as much adjustment as open impellers, plus have a bit more head than open impellers. Unfortunately, one of the downsides to closed impellers is that they are more prone to clogging and usually near the outer end where the vanes narrow. So when they do clog it is not always possible to clear the clog via the eye and need to be taken apart.

Although not too common, this isn't the first time I have heard of an impeller breaking off the shaft which is why I had suggested that could be the problem. If something makes it through the impeller but gets caught in the diffusor, it can break the impeller nut right off the impeller. Also, check your pump basket to see if there are any broken pieces that would allow large debris through. But something narrow and hard can sometimes make it through the basket even if there are no holes.

[aylad]

Just a quick update-- 5 minutes, a $30 impeller, and TA DA--my pump is working again!!!! :D :D

This time, though, the connection coming from the back of the impeller where it screws onto the motor shaft is made of metal instead of plastic, so hoping for a much longer life for this one!!

The good news is that even though the pump was off for 2 1/2 days of 98 degree Louisiana sunshine, once I got it going again this morning and tested the water, I had only lost 3 ppm of chlorine over that time--thank goodness for high CYA levels!!!! So my chlorine was at 4, added a healthy dose of bleach, and we're back in business. What a relief!!

To those who are completely intimidated by taking the pump apart to look for problems, it's REALLY not a huge deal--it's not nearly as complicated as it sounds. I was that way but after this whole experience I wouldn't hesitate for a second to take it apart again if I needed to (here's hoping that doesn't happen!! :) )

Janet