How often to test & how much chlorine to add daily? Also, vacation upcoming...

[blessedbeingmom]

Our pool is around 5000 gallons, above-ground, vinyl with metal frame. Last night @ 9:30 we used our K-2006 test kit and found a chlorine level of 2 ppm. We went swimming for about an hour. After we got out of the pool, we used the pool calculator to determine how much 6% bleach to add to get to 10 ppm (about 2.4 Liters), and then went to bed. This morning at around 7 a.m. we tested the chlorine level and found it to be 7 ppm. We haven't yet been swimming today. At 8 p.m. tonight we tested again and got 2 ppm. Combined chlorine is usually 0 to 0.5 ppm.

When we tested our stabilizer a few days ago (8th), it was about 42. How do we know how much chlorine to add each night before going to bed? To what level should we aim? And, how often should we be testing the various chemicals? Our pH runs a bit high, but we don't think it's high enough to worry about.

Also, we are getting ready to leave in six days for vacation. We will be gone for a week, and don't really have anyone to come by & test or add bleach daily. However, we may have someone be able to come by once in the middle of the week and add some bleach.
How should we handle our time away? Should we buy some "pucks" to use while we are away? Should we super-shock our pool before we leave?

And, should we cover our pool? We did buy a timer, so we can set it to run part-time while we are away. It's about an 800-1000 gph cartridge filter. How many hours a day should we be running this pump, and if we aren't swimming (if we are away) should this length of time change? We hope to have some friends over for a swim a few days after we return, so we don't want to allow the algae to return like it did when we were away for four days last month.

Thanks for any advice! :)

[Watermom]

With a stabilizer reading of 42, you need to keep your cl level between 3-6ppm all the time and when you need shock, it will be 15ppm for this pool. So, each evening when you test, add however much bleach you need to take your cl back up to 6ppm. In a 5000 gallon pool, each quart of 6% bleach will raise the cl by about 3ppm.

When you go out of town, I would shock the pool ahead of time and then cover the pool, but maybe leave a corner open so it can vent after is has been shocked. Maybe leave the timer set to come on a couple of times each day and run for about 2 or 3 hours each time just to keep some circulation. If you friend can come mid-week and add another gallon of bleach that would be great. You can also add a dose of Polyquat 60% algaecide for some added insurance if you want. Make sure your pH isn't too low. Don't want it to drop below 7.0 before you return. (If your pool does get a little green, it will easily be cleaned up with some bleach, so don't worry too much.)

Hope this helps and have fun!
(Regarding pump time when you are using the pool --- I usually run mine for 8-10 hours per day.)

[blessedbeingmom]

Thanks!

I'm confused though because we added enough to get to 10 ppm (per the pool calculator) and it was only 7 this morning. Then it dropped all the way to 2 by this evening. It was a very hot and sunny day here in South MS. (Our swimming water temperature this evening was 90 degrees!)

Also, this might seem like a dumb question, but after we test, what is the best way to dispose of the tested water (with the added drops, etc)? We have a septic tank.

I appreciate all the advice!

ETA could it be that it needs to be shocked? We got a pool light and there are a lot of tiny dots floating in the water, that you can only see by the pool light (sort of suspended in the water). Matt has been changing out our filter every other day or so (rinsing the old one well & letting it dry, and swapping them out).

[Watermom]

During the day on a hot sunny day and especially with water that is that warm, you are gonna lose chlorine. That is normal. But, if you are losing 3ppm overnight, I'd shock the pool.

As far as tiny stuff that you can only see in front of the pool light, that is pretty much true of most people's pools I would suspect. Most likely just dust in the water.

When I test, (I test outside) I just pour the test water on the ground, fill the tester a couple of times with pool water to rinse it and pour that on the ground, too.

[blessedbeingmom]

I forgot that Matt wanted me to ask how long after we add the bleach can we check the levels to see if they were brought up to where we wanted them?

Also, how often do you test the various things?

[AnnaK]

How soon you can check the chems after an addition depends on how well your pump circulates the water. I usually wait a couple of hours before testing again.

As to how often to test, I check pH and FC/CC every day, TA once a week, CYA once a month after I have it where I want it to be. Because our pool has a lot of splashout from the dogs we refill almost daily and have considerable dilution of CYA and have to adjust it more frequently.

[blessedbeingmom]

Okay, last night at 8 pm our FC was 2 ppm. Using the pool calculator, at 10 pm last night, Matt added enough bleach (1,140 grams) to get to 6 ppm. This morning when he tested at 8 am, the FC level was 4.5 ppm. How does this sound?

[CarlD]

It sounds like you either are still fighting something or miscalculated. I can't figure powder amounts--but bleach and LC I can do in my head...

Had you measured the pool an hour after you added the chlorine, you would know what the FC was then and there. If it was 4.5, then by this morning, you lost nothing.

Meanwhile, I don't know where you are but this season, for unexplained reasons, EVERYONE around the country seems to be using excessive amounts of chlorine--myself included. I've had to add a gallon of 12.5% the last two days.

[blessedbeingmom]

It sounds like you either are still fighting something or miscalculated. I can't figure powder amounts--but bleach and LC I can do in my head...

Had you measured the pool an hour after you added the chlorine, you would know what the FC was then and there. If it was 4.5, then by this morning, you lost nothing.

Meanwhile, I don't know where you are but this season, for unexplained reasons, EVERYONE around the country seems to be using excessive amounts of chlorine--myself included. I've had to add a gallon of 12.5% the last two days.

It wasn't powder that we added, it's just that DH uses the scale to measure how much to add, on the presumption that for 6% bleach, since most of it is water, it's of a similar density to bleach, and therefore 1000 grams is about 1000 milliliters (one liter).

We would have measured it last night again, but weren't sure how long it would take for the chlorine to be dispersed. We plan to check the level mid-day today since it is going to be a hot & sunny day here, and then again this evening. We plan to shock the pool Tuesday night, and then again before we leave for vacation.

We are in South MS, about an hour northeast of New Orleans.

[CarlD]

Why use a scale? I think you are doing it the hard way.

The rule of thumb for bleach is: 1 gallon of 6% adds exactly 6ppm to 10,000 gallons of water.

Since you have 5,000 gallons, you would need only 2 quarts of 6% to get a rise of 6%. 3/4 of that (a quart and a pint) would raise your FC by 4.5ppm.

Did you add 3 pints of 6% bleach?

BTW, if the bleach is 5.25%, substitute 5.25 for 6. If it's liquid chlorine and it's 12.5%, substitute 12.5 for 6.

You don't even need a calculator!

this is based on the formula for bleach addition:
FC added = (1,000,000/pool gallons) * 0.06 * # gallons of bleach, where 0.06 is 6% bleach. Use .125 for 12.5% LC.

[AnnaK]

Meanwhile, I don't know where you are but this season, for unexplained reasons, EVERYONE around the country seems to be using excessive amounts of chlorine--myself included. I've had to add a gallon of 12.5% the last two days.



Yep, count me in with that group.

I decided to raise my CYA from its normal 40 ppm to 60 ppm which has noticeably reduced the frequency and amount of chlorine additions. I'm running the FC at 5-7 ppm now.

It's been a weird season. Late to warm up, lots of rain in the spring, then a nasty heat wave with no rain at all which is making demands on my well for refills.

[blessedbeingmom]

Why use a scale? I think you are doing it the hard way.



That's DH for you! ;) He specializes in doing things the hard way. LOL! He's very scientific about everything! To be fair, he says the bottle is an odd size, so it makes it hard to measure it. I think we'll find an old pitcher or something and make quart and/or pint markings on it and use it for adding bleach, so we can do it the easy way, but for now, he's still doing it the technical way.
Okay, I was at work today & DH did not test the FC levels this afternoon. They were 4.5 ppm this morning. We swam at around 11:30. At 9 p.m. this evening, the FC was only 0.5 ppm. DH figured the amount of bleach to add to get it back up to 10 ppm and added 2,280 gm (about 2.28 Liters) of bleach. He checked the FC levels again at 11:45 (to allow time for circulation, and our level did not get up to 10 ppm. It only got up to 8.5 ppm.

Stay tuned for tomorrow's edition of "As the Pool (prayerful does not) Turn (into Algae) Again." LOL!

[CarlD]

OK,

That's very revealing. Thank you.

You are clearly fighting something in the water. That's why it's dropping so much. Of course, as I said, EVERYONE around the nation is using large amounts of chlorine this season. You need to add sufficient bleach to bring your FC up to shock level: 15ppm, and keep it there for at least 24 hours or until it stops dropping drastically. It may be as little as 24 hours. After raising the FC, check the water 3x a day and raise it back to 15 as needed. When, after 24 hours, it doesn't drop, or doesn't drop much (especially overnight, when there's no UV to break chlorine down, you can gradually let the FC drop back to the maintenance level which is 3 to 6 ppm and which is where you'll keep it on your normal daily basis.

[Watermom]

That's DH for you! ;) He specializes in doing things the hard way. LOL! He's very scientific about everything!


Um, yeah. I know somebody (who shall remain nameless) but his initials are P.o.c.o.n.o.s. who is just like that! :rolleyes::rolleyes:


Stay tuned for tomorrow's edition of "As the Pool (prayerful does not) Turn (into Algae) Again." LOL
Love it! Gave me a good chuckle this morning! :D

[blessedbeingmom]

You are clearly fighting something in the water. That's why it's dropping so much. Of course, as I said, EVERYONE around the nation is using large amounts of chlorine this season. You need to add sufficient bleach to bring your FC up to shock level: 15ppm, and keep it there for at least 24 hours or until it stops dropping drastically. It may be as little as 24 hours. After raising the FC, check the water 3x a day and raise it back to 15 as needed. When, after 24 hours, it doesn't drop, or doesn't drop much (especially overnight, when there's no UV to break chlorine down, you can gradually let the FC drop back to the maintenance level which is 3 to 6 ppm and which is where you'll keep it on your normal daily basis.

Okay, so last night Matt added enough bleach to get up to 17 ppm. This was at 11:15 p.m. In the morning, by 7:15 a.m., our FC was only 12 ppm. He added enough bleach to get up to 20 ppm this time (as we were both going to be away from the house all day today). I came home and checked it at 6 p.m. and the FC was down to 5 ppm. Again, it was a very hot and sunny day (pool water temperature of about 93 degrees). The CC was only 0.5 ppm.

We will bring it back up to shock level again tonight before going to bed. I bought a pitcher that goes up to 2 quarts and wrote "pool" and "bleach" all over it (so we won't use it for anything else). On the side where the markings are, I wrote lines for 1.5 ppm, 3 ppm, 4.5 ppm and 6 ppm, to make adding bleach easier.

How many ppm is normal to lose at night, and how many is normal to lose on a hot, sunny day?

So, for our vacation, the plan is to raise to shock level before we leave, then cover (but vent). Set timer to run pump for 2-3 hours at a time, several times a day. Mid-week (after about 3-4 days) have relative come by and add a gallon of bleach (should raise it by 12 ppm) and keep pool covered but vented. Does this sound okay? Do we need to add any stabilizer? It was about 42 ppm six days ago.

[CarlD]

Your chlorine loss should be negligible, not massive. I think you have a fight on your hands (with something that is using up your chlorine.)

Remember: You want the chlorine there to kill dangerous contaminants. Not to be too disgusting but every person who gets in your pool brings a very,very, very small amount of fecal matter--and the chlorine rapidly neutralizes that and renders it safe, sanitary and harmless. If algae is using up your chlorine you lose that protection.

That should reassure you that doing this is the right thing.

[aylad]

Carl's right--you're fighting something in the water. Your chlorine loss overnight should be less than 1 ppm. It will be more during the day, but shouldn't be nearly as much as you're reporting. You need to shock it and hold it at shock level as consistently as you can to kill off whatever is creating your chlorine demand. As far as vacation, your plan sounds good--but if that bleach-adding relative could come by a couple of times, maybe on day 2 and day 4 or 5? it would be even better.

Janet

[blessedbeingmom]

So last night when DH got home, he added enough bleach to get it up to 19.5 ppm (the 1.42 gallon jug) at 12:30 (just after midnight). This morning the chlorine level tested at 13 ppm at 9 a.m.
We'll see what we can do about the relative. The problem is that they are Matt's parents and they are joining us midway during our vacation.
What would be the hazards of superchlorinating while we are away (like going up to a higher than normal shock level, or adding a bunch of bleach, and then having them add a bunch more on their way out of town)? Would that hurt the liner or anything?

His parents are on the older side and don't live super-close to us either.

[aylad]

Your shock level right now is 15 ppm...you could probably go up to 20 ppm just before you leave without any problem other than possibly the fumes fading your cover a little, but if you leave it vented it should be fine. (I don't use a cover, but I'm sure someone here who does will pop in and advise you better there.) How confident are you in your in-law's testing abilities? If they could test, and get it back up to shock level, that would be great. If not, then having them pour another gallon in (which would raise your Cl by 12) should be sufficient.

In looking through your thread, I don't see mention of a pH or calcium level, but another option could be to purchase a floater and put a couple of trichlor (if you can withstand a lowered pH and slightly raised CYA level) OR cal-hypo (if you can stand a slight calcium increase) pucks in it, then tie it off somewhere in the pool where it can't float over and make contact with your pool walls. This would at least allow for some continuous chlorination, but honestly I'm not sure how well it would work with your pool covered. Again, maybe somebody here that uses a cover will comment on that. You do need to take a look at your pH level, though, even if you don't use the floater--you don't want a pH lower than 7.0 because it can start causing damage to your liner. Keep in mind that pH at high chlorine levels will read falsely high, so if you test it while the pool is shocked, and only get a 7.2, then I would for sure add some Borax to adjust it upward.

Honestly, don't lose any sleep over this--I'm sure that by shocking the pool before you leave, and having your inlaws add a gallon of bleach mid-week will be fine--the absolute worst thing that could happen is a little green when you come back, but that's easy enough to take care of in a few days.

Janet

[blessedbeingmom]

In looking through your thread, I don't see mention of a pH or calcium level

Our pH is usually around 7.8 (on the higher side) even when the chlorine level isn't high. Our calcium was 140 ppm last week. Our CYA is close to 42.

I thought about either getting a chlorinator or a few pucks (but wasn't sure what to look for) and also thought about getting some polyquat 60. I just haven't had time this week to do much more than think about it. ;)

[aylad]

I just haven't had time this week to do much more than think about it. ;)

I TOTALLY understand this statement.... :)

One thing that is going to make a huge difference in your outcome over vacation is what kind of shape your water is in before you leave. I don't know when you're planning to leave (and it's probably better that you don't post it here), but I'm hoping that you can clear up your current chlorine demand by maintaining a shock level until your chlorine loss is normal BEFORE you go. Having a stable chlorine usage will give you a much better chance at clear water on your return.

Polyquat is a good idea, also, just as an insurance, it certainly won't hurt. Polyquat does create a pretty good chlorine demand, or so I understand from around here, so once you add it and let it circulate, you need to then raise your chlorine back up.

Your pH is high enough that a couple of trichlor pucks in a floating feeder wouldn't hurt (unless it will create issues with the cover, again, you need some input from someone who uses a cover on that issue) because your pH can stand to come down a little bit anyway. If you decide to go that route, though, just make sure to tie it somewhere that it can get circulation but can't float over and sit next to your liner to fade it by dispensing pockets of chlorine and low pH while the pump isn't running.

Janet

[blessedbeingmom]

So last night when DH got home, he added enough bleach to get it up to 19.5 ppm (the 1.42 gallon jug) at 12:30 (just after midnight). This morning the chlorine level tested at 13 ppm at 9 a.m.


Okay, this morning at 9 a.m. after getting the reading of 13 ppm, DH added 2 quarts of bleach, which should have brought it to 19 ppm. He checked it just now (a little over 2 hours later) and it's only 11! Yikes! What is going on???

[blessedbeingmom]

Okay, this morning at 9 a.m. after getting the reading of 13 ppm, DH added 2 quarts of bleach, which should have brought it to 19 ppm. He checked it just now (a little over 2 hours later) and it's only 11! Yikes! What is going on???

Okay, we just did CarlD's chlorine test on our bleach, and it only came to 3.5% bleach. Maybe our bleach is old and that is part of the problem???

http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/showthread.php?t=10167 (CarlD's chlorine test)

How do we make sure we're buying fresh bleach?

[aylad]

When you say "he added enough bleach to get up to x amount"....are you testing it at that level, or just assuming it's there because that's what the bleach calc says? If you're testing it at the higher level and then testing it at the lower level, then you still have a problem with your water. If you're just assuming that it's hitting the high level you think it is, then you probably don't have nearly the chlorine demand that it appears. With the weaker concentration, it's not going as high as you think, and it's probably not going high enough to maintain a shock level for very long. When you make your next addition, give it an hour or so after the addition to circulate, and then test it to see what you get. That result will make the results from the next test meaningful....make sense?

AS far as buying fresh bleach--there's really no way to know--you could ask the manager of the place where you are buying it how long that particular lot has sat around, but even he can't control things like how long it sat in the warehouse, what the temps were, the storage conditions, etc. I buy mine at WalMart, where there's a HUGE turnover--they completely turn over their bleach (generic, anyway) shelves at least every couple of days.

Janet

[blessedbeingmom]

We haven't done much testing afterward, but will start doing that now. I did buy 4 large containers of bleach from Walmart today, thinking they probably move a lot more bleach. (Our last bottles were bought from 2 different Dollar General stores.)

I also bought some polyquat 60%. CarlD, if you are still reading this, how much would you recommend for algae prevention and a week away? Our pool is about 5000 gallons.

[aylad]

It will be interesting to see what your actual overnight chlorine loss is--measure tonight and in the morning, and be sure and let us know...

Janet

[blessedbeingmom]

Okay, numbers for the evening...

Last FC reported on this post was 11 ppm at 11:30 this morning (Thursday). We did not add any chlorine at this point.

At 4 p.m. today DH added 4 quarts of the Dollar General Bleach (tested to only be 3.5%).

Unfortunately we do not know how much the chlorine had dropped before the bleach was added at 4 p.m. since I wasn't home (stuck in line at Walmart with the whole store full of registers with computers down) and DH did not test at this time.

At 8 p.m. our FC level was 9.5 ppm. We added 2 quarts of the new bleach (Walmart brand), which should have brought our FC level to 15.5 ppm.

At 10 p.m. our FC level was 13 ppm. Either the bleach wasn't 6% or something is eating up the bleach.

We will test in the morning and I will post the results. Then I will probably add a maintenance dose of polyquat 60 to the pool.

Oh, I forgot to submit this reply when I wrote it about half an hour ago. Since then, we have done the test and verified that our Walmart bleach we just bought today is indeed 6 percent. However, we think the Dollar General bleach may have gotten a bad rap due to measuring mistakes. We used a pipette we had from a microscope set to measure the 1 mL bleach earlier today. However, we just found out that it wasn't accurate at all. I had ordered a set of scientific graduated cylinders (for our homoschool) and we got them today. Using the 10 mL cylinder, we found that what we though had been 1 mL bleach was actually only a bit over half (maybe 0.6 or 0.7 mL). We are retesting the DG bleach now to see what percent it really is. Well, we retested and still got 3.5% for the DG brand.

[blessedbeingmom]

Okay, so at 10 p.m. our FC was 13 ppm (last night). This morning at 7:45 a.m. it was 12 ppm. We only lost 1 ppm last night. This is good, right?
I think we are going to add the polyquat now.

[aylad]

yes, that's much, much better!! I would think that today's loss will be less than was reported yesterday, too--but testing won't bear that out because the Polyquat will probably drop your chlorine a bit.

Janet