Need help making pool "swimmable" please

[blessedbeingmom]

Hello, my name is Tricia and I am new here. We live in South MS. We bought an Intex 15' by 48" metal-frame vinyl pool from Walmart and spent a week or so installing it properly so it would be level. My DH (Matt) removed all of the sod from the area, then bought sand and leveled it. We have pressure-treated wood squares under each of the vertical poles. We finished with the assembly about a week ago and started filling the pool up on June 21. Not knowing any better, we went to Walmart and bought a bunch of Aquachem chemicals (pH up, pH down, Calcium hardness increaser, bleach pucks, 20% algaecide, shock plus, stabilizer). We also bought the test strips they sell there. We haven't used any of the pH down, bleach pucks or algaecide, so we are hoping we can return those.
The pool contains about 4,600 gallons of water and uses a 1,000 gallon-per-hour cartridge filter.
Calcium hardness increaser - not sure what it contains as we used up the whole container and threw it away
pH down - contains sodium bisulfate
stabilizer - contains cyanuric acid
shock plus - contains sodium dichloro-s-triazinetrione
We first added calcium hardness increaser, then pH down, then stabilizer. We added more calcium stuff and more pH down. Later we added more pH down. At this point we were still trying to balance and had not yet added any chlorine or shock.
We had to go out of town for 4 days, and came back to a green and cloudy pool. We had not run the filter while we were away. We also found out that we had been invaded by bugs which swim in the water (think they are water boatmen). We do have a small goldfish pond nearer to the house.
FWIW, it rained alot while we were away. We added some more pH down, followed by a bag of shock plus to the pool. Then I started reading more posts here and ordered the Taylor K-2006 test kit this past Monday (June 28). It was late Monday, so we probably won't get it until at least next week. Not sure how long it will really take. We ordered it from SPS Swimming Pool Supply company. Meanwhile, I used the numbers on the strips as an estimate and we added about a gallon of bleach about 9 a.m. yesterday (June 29). We added another gallon at about 9 p.m. last night. (The numbers had fallen into the "safe to swim" range, but although the pool was no longer green, it was and is still very cloudy, and we can't see the bottom, so we figured we needed to get the chlorine level back up.) DH says we might be able to see about halfway down. He's anxious to get into the pool, but I will not get in a pool where I cannot see the bottom and make sure there is nothing lurking in the bottom of the pool. Yikes!
I went to Walmart to buy the only drops-based test they had, but it only tests for a chlorine level up to 5 ppm, and pH. I think our pH is still on the high side though. This morning the chlorine level became almost an orange color (supposed to be a darker yellow for 5 ppm and this was much darker than that). The pH was about equal to the highest on the range.
Current strip readings:
Total Hardness B (about 100)
Total chlorine D (10) or above (darker in color than last square)
Free chlorine D (10) or above (darker in color than last square)
pH level C or D (between 7.8 and 8.4)
Alkalinity C (120)
Stabilizer B (50)
Thanks for any help you can offer to get us swimming! Also, DH says that he can see the bottom of the pool this morning but it's still pretty cloudy. I can barely see the bottom of it myself.

[Watermom]

WOW!! You bought a lot of stuff! And, I'm not surprised you have a green pool. Glad you found us. We can help you get this straightened out. Hopefully your new test kit won't take too long to get to you.

In the meantime........... you can force your test kit to measure higher cl levels by using a dilution method we call the "shot glass method." Take one part pool water and one equal part distilled water and mix these together. Run your test with this water and then multiply your result by 2. If that doesn't take it high enough for you to get a reading, use one part pool water and two parts distilled and then multiply by 3, etc. (The dilution method does lose accuracy with each dilution but it is better than nothing and right now, you have no other way to get a reading with such a high cl.)

Your pH appears to be very high but we need to find out what your chlorine level is before we advise adjusting it because if cl is higher than 10, it can give you a falsely high pH reading.

Your alk is ok, your stabilizer (cya) is ok at 50 but you don't want it any higher. I hope you are planning to just use bleach for your chlorine. You don't want any trichlor pucks nor any more dichlor shock powder. They are both stabilized and will cause your cya to go up which you don't want.

Repost with new chlorine readings after you do the dilution method. Also, keep your pump/filter running. Don't add anything else at this point.

Welcome to the forum!

[blessedbeingmom]

The pool isn't green anymore, just cloudy. We don't plan to use the pucks and DH is returning them now, along with the algaecide and pH up stuff.

We definitely plan to use BBB, but we are planning to be on vacation for a week next month, so I'm not sure if at that point we might need(?) to use the pucks to keep the water from turning green, or cover the pool, or what. We won't really have anyone who can come over & add the bleach for us.

I just called my DH and asked him to bring back some distilled water so we can test further. He's also going to look for a vacuum so we can vacuum the bottom & sides of the pool. We have had and plan to continue to have the filter running continuously for now at least.

I will repost when I get the distilled water to do the test.

Thanks so much for all the help!

[Watermom]

Yes, save the pucks for vacation week. We'll help you with that when it gets closer to your vacation.

[blessedbeingmom]

Okay, I'm back with more. After we diluted 1:1 ratio, free chlorine appeared to still be above 5 ppm in the diluted batch (>10 ppm in pool water). We then diluted 1:2 ratio (1 part pool water to 2 parts distilled water) and still appeared to be above (but closer) to 5 ppm in the diluted batch. We then diluted 1:3 ratio and finally came up with FC level of about 12 ppm (3 ppm in diluted water times 4). What do we need to do next to clear up our pool? Oh and it said to check for combined chlorine after 5 minutes. We checked after 5 minutes and there was no change in the color.
We can barely see the bottom of the pool. It isn't really green anymore, just cloudy. We also just had a couple of inches of rain in a brief time period this afternoon, which brought the water level up by a couple of inches, and we aren't yet sure how rainwater affects everything. Our sample was taken from a depth of about elbow deep, just after the rain started.
DH bought a vacuum that attaches with a hose, and a hose for it, but I don't think the hose will work with our pool as I think our pool hose is bigger (probably 1 & 1/2") and the hose he bought is only 1 & 1/4". They only had the 1 & 1/4" hose, so maybe I should order a hose online? I'm not sure what else to do.

[aylad]

Yes, the pucks are okay for vacation, but keep in mind that the WalMart pucks (at least in my part of the country) contain copper, which you don't want in your pool. Better to get a smaller container of them from a different place (even the pool store :eek: ) and not deal with the copper. You probably can use cal-hypo pucks in a floater, as well, and it won't create issues with falling pH and increasing CYA.

Keep the filter running--cartridge filters on smaller AG pools are often undersized, so it takes a little longer for them to filter as well, and remember that the chlorine killed the green in the pool but the filter is going to have to remove it. So....it may be cloudy for a few more days, but keep your chlorine up and the filter running and it will clear.

Don't add any more calcium increaser to the pool--vinyl pools don't actually need any calcium, because there's no concrete in the lining for the water to leach calcium out of. What's in there already isn't hurting anything, but you'll just be wasting money to put any more in it (despite what the pool store will tell you!).

YOu did yourself a favor ordering the bigger test kit--I know it's pricey but it will save you TONS of money over this summer alone, and give you control over your own pool.

Repost with some test results and we'll go from there. Welcome to the forum!

Janet

[sturev]

You can probably get an adapter for the hose at the hardware store. Check the PVC section (sprinklers/water pipe fittings) and you should fine a 1.25 to 1.5 adapter that will work for a dollar or so...

[blessedbeingmom]

With the numbers I posted at about 2:00 in post 5 and given that we had several inches of rain this afternoon, should we add more bleach to our pool tonight, and if so, how would we determine how much to add? Our pool is 4,600 gallons. FWIW, it's still getting clearer, and we can see more of the bottom, but if I put the skimmer in toward the center of the pool, we lose visible contact with it.

Post 5
http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/showpost.php?p=65277&postcount=5

[blessedbeingmom]

Also, as far as the pool being clear, I want to be able to see any bugs or anything else that might be swimming around with me before we get it. As I'm sure you can imagine, the kids are anxious to be able to get back in the pool, as are we. ;)

[blessedbeingmom]

Hello, does anyone know why I made 2 different posts to this thread earlier this evening but only one of them showed up? I had a question in the other one regarding whether we should add chlorine tonight or not with the readings I posted in post 5. I can't remember what else I wrote in that post. LOL!

[sturev]

I'm not sure what's going on with the posts, but it looks like you can add some more bleach. You want to keep it at about 15 ppm, so if you were at 12 ppm earlier, I'd probably test and re-dose up to 15.

[Watermom]

Tricia,
New subscribers have to have their posts looked at by Ben or one of the moderators before they appear on the forum. So, if you post at a time when none of the mods are online, it may be a bit before it shows up. I can't remember right off hand right now how many posts have to be looked at before you are able to just post right to the forum without it having to be modded in. So, if you post and it doesn't appear right away, sit tight. It won't take too long since most of the time at least one of the 5 of us is here!

[blessedbeingmom]

Great! Thank you!

Today was mostly cloudy, overcast & rainy. I just tested again with the dilution method with the OTO drops and got a similar reading as before (somewhere around 12 ppm FC). However, we decided to check our filter and it was pretty gross. We cleaned it really well with the jet spray on our hose and hopefully that will help clear the pool out better. Also, I highly recommend against using old pool noodles in your pool. We found a bunch of purple fuzz in the filter. Eek!

Just for comparison, I tested using a strip and it told me my chlorine level was low (about 1 ppm). However, DH says it definitely has that chloriney pool smell. I'm thinking maybe we won't add any more tonight and will see how it looks in the morning after a night of running with a clean filter.

Thanks again!

[Watermom]

That "chloriney" smell is not chlorine but chloramines (CC). Sounds strange, but whenever you smell that it doesn't mean you have too much chlorine in there but need more. Sounds weird, I know. I'd go ahead and add enough bleach tonight to get back to shock level. (Especially since it rained. Rainy days can add debris and organic matter to the pool.) The more consistently you keep it at shock level, the faster it will get cleaned up.

I agree about the old pool noodles. I find the fuzz in my pool, too.

[blessedbeingmom]

Okay, thanks, I will have DH add more chlorine tonight when he gets home from church. I think we may need to add about 1/2 gallon to get to shock level.

[Watermom]

FYI -- In your pool, each quart of 6% bleach will raise your cl by about 3.3ppm.

[CarlD]

Yup, it sounds crazy until you realize that the smell comes from chlorine being eaten up by something! Those combined chloramines are to blame for the smell and (in part) for eye irritation that gets blamed on "Too much chlorine!" Nope, not enough.

[blessedbeingmom]

FYI -- In your pool, each quart of 6% bleach will raise your cl by about 3.3ppm.

Okay, we just tried to check it again via the dilution method. Those shades of yellow are really hard for us to distinguish. We are guessing maybe it is 3, which would put it about 15, but I have to be honest and say it is a guess. It's still very hard to tell. It is definitely more than 5 or 10 overall, as it is a much darker shade of yellow than the 5 when we put it in full strength or diluted by half.
DH is really wanting to swim soon after all the hard work he has put into this pool. We are unsure what is really a safe chlorine level for swimming for ourselves and for our children (ages 6, 8 & 10). Any ideas?
We still can't quite figure out how much chlorine we should add tonight. Maybe we'll just add a quart and check again in the morning? We are pretty sure it is over 10. Also, previously when I said the test strip was showing as low, I forgot it was because I used the test strip on the solution that had already been diluted 1:3. When I tested the sample this evening straight from the pool, it tested to be at least 10. It does appear that we probably still have about 50 ppm CYA, but again, a guesstimate based on the strip.
Also, we did brush the pool bottom this evening to get up any algae remnants on the floor of the pool so they can be filtered out overnight.
Thanks again for all the help!
Tricia

[CarlD]

Ultimately, all decisions about your pool are your own--we can only suggest.

However, if your pool is still green and cloudy, it means your chlorine is being "eaten" killing it. If when you test you see chlorine levels have dropped a lot from the last test, your chlorine is being consumed.

If, however, your water is clear, and despite the difficulty with the dilution test (Hold a white card behind the cell--it may help), you don't see much change in the test, it means your chlorine is holding and it's probably safe to swim in it.

But, if the chlorine is high, wear last year's bathing suits. You'll be ok but the suits may fade.

But the ultimate decision and responsibility is yours. It's your pool and we aren't there to see it.

[Watermom]

Hint, hint ---- Buy a K-2006 --- hint, hint. (Was that subtle enough? ;) )

Really, it will make this whole pool care thing SO much easier for you. Then, you won't have to be diluting and trying to decipher how high the cl is. The good kit will tell you precisely how high it is.

http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/showthread.php?t=10006

[blessedbeingmom]

Ultimately, all decisions about your pool are your own--we can only suggest.

However, if your pool is still green and cloudy, it means your chlorine is being "eaten" killing it. If when you test you see chlorine levels have dropped a lot from the last test, your chlorine is being consumed.


Of course, I realize you can't tell me what to do. Thanks for the help though. The pool is only cloudy, not the least bit green at all. After we rinsed the filter thoroughly last night, we checked it again this morning, and again, there was a light brown algae coating the filter. We replaced the filter this morning. Our chlorine level (via dilution method) was probably over 20. It was definitely over 10 last night, and we added about 2 quarts of bleach before going to bed. I'm pretty sure the algae is dead, just needs to be cleaned out thoroughly. I'm thinking about buying a bunch of replacement filters and just replacing them daily for a few days or something to help it clear up faster. Not sure about that though.

[blessedbeingmom]

Hint, hint ---- Buy a K-2006 --- hint, hint. (Was that subtle enough? ;) )

Really, it will make this whole pool care thing SO much easier for you. Then, you won't have to be diluting and trying to decipher how high the cl is. The good kit will tell you precisely how high it is.

http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/showthread.php?t=10006

I'm sure you read so many posts here (and are very helpful, thanks so much!) that it's hard to remember what you read by whom, but I did mention in my initial post that I've already purchased the Taylor K-2006 earlier this week, just waiting on it (not so patiently I suppose) to arrive, and doing the best I can in the meantime to guesstimate the chlorine levels to see if we need to add more.



Then I started reading more posts here and ordered the Taylor K-2006 test kit this past Monday (June 28). It was late Monday, so we probably won't get it until at least next week. Not sure how long it will really take. We ordered it from SPS Swimming Pool Supply company.

I try to be a quick learner! ;) :D

Thanks again! :)

[Watermom]

I'm sure you read so many posts here (and are very helpful, thanks so much!) that it's hard to remember what you read by whom

You got that right! :eek::eek: But, sorry I missed (or had forgotten) that you had already purchased. Sorry, sorry! :( (Sometimes, especially on some of these threads that get pretty long, it is time-consuming to have to go back and reread the whole thread each time a new post is added. Especially at times when there are lots of posts waiting to be answered. Sometimes we miss things, but really do try and do our best!)

Hope your kit will arrive soon!

[blessedbeingmom]

Sometimes we miss things, but really do try and do our best!)


Absolutely! I am very appreciative! :D

[blessedbeingmom]

DH tested the water this evening and our best guess is the chlorine level was about 6 or so. He added about a liter of bleach to the pool tonight. We're pretty sure the algae is dead, and we're just waiting for the pump to be able to clear the water up for us. I'm not really wanting to get back in until I can see the bottom of the pool in the middle. We are considering upgrading to a larger pump/filter set.
I've been writing my thoughts about that in a different forum:
http://www.poolforum.com/pf2/showthread.php?t=10060

[aylad]

I posted a response to that one in the other thread...
Janet

[blessedbeingmom]

I just wanted to write that DH says the pool is getting clearer by the day. He & I got in the pool tonight (after the kids went to bed) and it was fine and very nice. We are going to check the chlorine level again tonight and add some more bleach before we go to bed. We are still waiting on our Taylor K-2006 kit to arrive.
There isn't one bit of slime to the pool floor or wall, which is nice!

[Spensar]

Congrats Tricia. Great folks on this forum. I've walked in your shoes, and it can seem to take forever to go from green to cloudy, then finally clear. When I have algae, I always err on the side of caution and would rather have to much chlorine than let the level get to low and give the algae a break.

Many new pool owners get hung up on "balancing" their water and waiting way to long before adding chlorine, when it is essential to get sanitizer in to the pool. Enjoy your summer of swimming.